Argonath RPG - A World of its own
GTA:SA => SA:MP - San Andreas Multiplayer => SA:MP General => Topic started by: Astaroth on March 18, 2014, 10:35:03 pm
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So guys, as most of us know, Keybinds are considered a rulebreak here. Yes, I understand that some may missuse it to flood, that's why we have the Sauron for, of course.
What I'm trying to say is, I was thinking of a way to make roleplays seem more RPish, and by that I came to a point that adding characters appearance would be pretty interesting.
Then there comes /em being missused for O O C chat, then there's that Argonath has no IC and O O C and it goes on and on.
(Someone made O.O.C preview as "for those without brains" on forums :D )
So like, what if we added keybinds and use it for basic /me's and /em's that people get tired of repeatedly typing them.
Example:
/em Derp is 5'9" tall, wearing green shorts, a black T-shirt and sneakers. Tattoo on his neck saying: fite me
/me grabs the door-handle, pulling it for the door to open.
Etc etc etc.
Yes, I really think that keybinds can actually improve roleplays. If you want me to be honest here, most people don't even bother to roleplay taking out a shotgun out of their ass or getting into their car.
I'm only trying to make the staff re-think this decision and think about the things that it could bring.
What's the worse that can be done with binds? Spam another servers IP? If someone wants to do that he will do it , we have the Sauron script and the person gets banned anyways.
So come on guys, give me your opinions here. What benefit could binds bring, what's the worse that can happen if we allow them and why shouldn't we add them?
Might not be the most perfect made topic about this, but I guess you get what I'm trying to say.
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:app:
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As far as I know, keybinds are not allowed in SAMP
(I didn't read the topic though, got it from the subject)
I like the idea :app:
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As far as I know, keybinds are not allowed in SAMP
(I didn't read the topic though, got it from the subject)
Read it then :3
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As far as I know, keybinds are not allowed in SAMP
(I didn't read the topic though, got it from the subject)
We know, that's why you shouldn't post without reading it.
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As far as I know, keybinds are not allowed in SAMP
(I didn't read the topic though, got it from the subject)
You should have probably read the first two lines as he has already said that.
- I think that keybinds are indeed a great way to improve roleplay, but one has to know its limits. The reason they're disallowed its because people can use them for their own selfish advantage. To continue with what you were saying, for an example, if I am typing "/me is taking out a sidearm, rising it up towards Derp's head", the other person can easily do the same thing but way quicker and that way, the roleplay is changed in his favour.
I honestly think that keybinds should be allowed though but everything has its limits and it should not be abused. Using keybinds to give a description of what you're wearing, of what the other players are seeing / should see, then that is completely fine.
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Of course, limits must exist for this too. Only the ab00zers shall get punished. Thank you for your replies, I need more. From staff and players about this.
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If you ask me, i support this. I often get sick of typing /me 981712419641942 times
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Keybinds help improve roleplay, by how... exactly?
As if the administration already has enough on their plate, they would have to investigate every keybind reports to see if they're valid or not.
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What is O O C and IC?
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What is O O C and IC?
Out of character and in character, oh you know :D
Keybinds help improve roleplay, by how... exactly?
As if the administration already has enough on their plate, they would have to investigate every keybind reports to see if they're valid or not.
Well, there wouldn't be reports of keybinds if keybinds are actually allowed now, would there be?
Just, read the topic.
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And I bet atleast 50% of the server already uses it, so why not just allow it? :|
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Well, there wouldn't be reports of keybinds if keybinds are actually allowed now, would there be?
Just, read the topic.
I did. Did you?
Of course, limits must exist for this too. Only the ab00zers shall get punished. Thank you for your replies, I need more. From staff and players about this.
Which brings to my response:
As if the administration already has enough on their plate, they would have to investigate every keybind reports to see if they're valid or not.
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How pressing a key that will send constantly the same sentence is improving roleplay in any way?
It just makes it more predictable and annoying.
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If I walk up to a bunch of people in a roleplay which I never met before, how can "/Anthony is 5'9 tall, 25 y/o, darkhaired, wearing a blue bandana around his head, beige pants, a black shirt. Facetattoos." be annoying?
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I did. Did you?
Which brings to my response:
Yup, reports for what tho'?
"Omg admen he spam his binds"
- Le no worries, Sauron is here.
Anything else? Will he spam another servers IP with the help of binds?
Player#1: IP.IP.IP.IP.IP:IPIP
Player#1: IP.IP.IP.IP.IP:IPIP
Player#1: IP.IP.IP.IP.IP:IPIP
Player#1: IP.IP.IP.IP.IP:IPIP
Player#1: IP.IP.IP.IP.IP:IPIP
- Dang, Sauron kicks in.
Another thing that can happen, admin bans him.
But why even bother making this example, a player who advertises has clear intentions to get banned. Do you think disallowing keybinds would stop people from breaking rules? :3
How pressing a key that will send constantly the same sentence is improving roleplay in any way?
It just makes it more predictable and annoying.
Not exactly.
As I said above, making RP look more RPish. Using binds only for basic things that people are tired of constantly typing in. Ex:
/em Derp has long hair, black skirt and a guitar in his hand(Character appearance, which I don't think is often used)
/m.e fishes the keys out of his pocket, gently placing them into the door lock as he twists them - unlocking the door.
etc etc.
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Out of character and in character, oh you know :D
Wait whut? We don't do that shit here on Argo mayne.
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People can spam IP's or whatever almost as easy as without keybindings by using the T and up arrow, as we all know.
I remember that one time when I was heading to the bar to buy milk, I flooded like 10 times the "7milk" and the admins questioned me for keybinds because I was so quick :rolleyes:
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If I walk up to a bunch of people in a roleplay which I never met before, how can "/Anthony is 5'9 tall, 25 y/o, darkhaired, wearing a blue bandana around his head, beige pants, a black shirt. Facetattoos." be annoying?
Overusage of details, especially considering you have a skin. Not to mention they don't need details such as your height or hair color (unless they're blind) or your age. (unless they're telepathic)
No. Just no. The usage of keybinds does not improve roleplay and this is exactly another reason why they are not added, so get that delusion out of your heads. In fact, it only degrades the roleplay by making people too lazy and/or uncreative to type out what they have to do.
A good roleplayer is someone who can portray their character best with less effort, not someone who spams pre-defined "roleplay" lines from some keybind.
Ironic, people have complained that the server's roleplay has degenerated and that /s1-3 /m1-3 have taken the creativity out of fire/medic/police roleplay, then we have these topics...
Argonath does not recognize IC/OOC or other server "roleplay rules", not to mention there is a reason OOC was censored to "for those without brains:". Keep that in mind.
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TOO much unnecesseary stuff about a topic this simple.
Everyone says: People can use keybinds to spam/flood
Well they can also use T and UP arrow, yet they dont spam (well in most of the cases). And screw it, if someone spams way too much, there is Sauron! If Sauron doesnt help, and admin can and will be called, AS SIMPLE AS THAT!
Now just think is all this discussion necesseary when the answer is rather simple?
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Been trying out keybinds to roleplay in other places...It's a no-no for me. Most "RPers" misuse it too much. No, I do not care how tall your character is or the accent he's speaking in. "Ghetto" is not an accent. One /me is wearing clothing associating him to [clique name]. Is enough. Now, I personally would benefit from keybinds in certain situations. Yes, listing my character's patches so others can learn where I stand in AOD is useful...But typing that out can't be that hard in the beginning of a Roleplay. Only thing keybinds would be useful is business adverts, which can be bypassed by Ctrl+C > Ctrl+V. It works ingame, which renders the use of keybinds useless.
But still, some people think keybinds make their roleplay better. Well, I honestly don't care. It's not about how your character looks like, or where he takes his gun out from. Keeping track in chats be it in /pm or /p, should mean you can also keep up with / me while you are roleplaying. Simple as that.
They should be allowed, but should not be encouraged.
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As I said above, making RP look more RPish. Using binds only for basic things that people are tired of constantly typing in. Ex:
/em Derp has long hair, black skirt and a guitar in his hand(Character appearance, which I don't think is often used)
/m.e fishes the keys out of his pocket, gently placing them into the door lock as he twists them - unlocking the door.
etc etc.
I never realized we needed to write an essay to open a door. No wonder people get tired of constantly typing for minor, simplistic things. :rage:
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Keybinds should not be disallowed, simply because of anti-spam measures implemented such as Sauron...
All keybinds would do is increase roleplay. RP is fine as it currently is, but if people are allowed to use keybinds to show simple things that would be hard to type over and over like the description of their character what is the issue ? I do not see it...
Remember, in order to push forward for a better future we have to not be so closed mind about ideas that may seem "SRS RP" when in reality they are not hurting anyone..... just giving veteran players a bit more freedom..... no new player will go "z0mg srs rp server" if when they walk up to a group of gang members and see "/em Emmet is 25 years old looking with gang tattoos" ...
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You know I have no idea why are we supposed to roleplay entering a vehicle. It's already visually done, why add a bunch of texts to it? :rolleyes:
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A good roleplayer is someone who can portray their character best with less effort, not someone who spams pre-defined "roleplay" lines from some keybind.
Yes.
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For the love of Sauron, how many times must this topic be made? The Server Owners have already given an answer on this many, many, many times, and each time people bring up the same statements they have already argued against...
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Overusage of details, especially considering you have a skin. Not to mention they don't need details such as your height or hair color (unless they're blind) or your age. (unless they're telepathic)
Pretty sure the reason people state their character's description in /em, is to relay to other players information that they have come up with and isn't visible through the skin, and people can't really know what age or hair color your character has without giving it to them on an /em. (Unless you already role-played with them before.)
No. Just no. The usage of keybinds does not improve roleplay and this is exactly another reason why they are not added, so get that delusion out of your heads. In fact, it only degrades the roleplay by making people too lazy and/or uncreative to type out what they have to do.
They were already creative when they came up with the content, that they save it on a keybind for future re-use is simply a convenience.
A good roleplayer is someone who can portray their character best with less effort, not someone who spams pre-defined "roleplay" lines from some keybind.
Agreed, but then again, isn't that the whole point of keybinds? Portraying your character best with less effort (keybinds instead of typing it out or Ctrl+V).
I actually agree with the dissenters that keybinds do not improve role-play - they're just useful tools that aid it where necessary.
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I've already talked to you about this but meh.
Claiming they improve roleplay is a rather overused statement with little value. Sure; they can be useful to repeat information(Think /s2 for the cops, which yells to stop and surrender.) But the main reason we've disallowed them is the malicious usage pointed out several times in this topic.
Examples which I had pointed out before is that you are able to print commands and sentences much faster than before, being able to completely flood in less than two seconds.
Usage of /buy milk for example allows you to heal in maybe 3 or 4 seconds flat, provided you don't make a fool out of yourself and spam "t/buy milk" instead, Which of course gives it away.
And it's rather obvious about advertising.
Now to other examples proven here:
Say you do use keybinds to roleplay, is it necessary to constantly repeat what people can already see: your skin? I know the tattoos etc. are special but I don't think pointing them out gives any effect.
Speaking in an accent and having to point it out is more of a nuisance than additional, not to mention it also limits the actual message.
Using them for certain actions i.e. /me takes his briefcase and thus points out the meeting is dismissed, makes the roleplay stale if used often.
Those are my two cents about it, and as said before:
For the love of Sauron, how many times must this topic be made? The Server Owners have already given an answer on this many, many, many times, and each time people bring up the same statements they have already argued against...
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The reason why we're not allowing keybinds as players is gonna try to use it to gain advantages over other players, and we want it to be a fair play ingame. Also it can be used to flood players wiht it, for an example /pm (even with Sauron, they would be flooded big time). Therefor, we will not allow it.
I understand that it can be usefull at times, since i used to use it in beginning of 2009 to login when we still had /login before i was told it was not allowed. :D
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I don't have anything against keybindings. I think they are harmless, as people can flood even without them anyway. I've got keybindings which I mostly use for LoL, and I'd maybe even get some for Argo should they be allowed.
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I don't see a problem with it in MTA...
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I don't see a problem with it in MTA...
But it's not MTA here, it's SA:MP.
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But it's not MTA here, it's SA:MP.
:app:
On a serious reply, I won't use them either way, because I don't know how to, but it was somehow useful in MTA...
With B I could bring up a /me line and make an animation to fit that line in the same time.
Or R where I could "/me reloads his weapon." and make a /reload animation. It was cool, if you ask me.
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What's the point to write something that people can see?
If you reload your gun with an animation, there is no point at all to write it...
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What's the point to write something that people can see?
If you reload your gun with an animation, there is no point at all to write it...
I know, I know... But for doing that I got "ASS-PULLING ? GREAT RPER!"
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I know, I know... But for doing that I got "ASS-PULLING ? GREAT RPER!"
Then ignore them and continue with whatever you was doing.
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As I said, this will go on and on. But then the person who didn't RP that declares himself a pro RPer and you're a noob because you avoided to "rp" with him. But seriously, it will go ON and ON..binds will make it easier for everyone, it's up to the staff to re-think this decision.
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I'm positive for keybinds but I would only use it to describe my character when new players joins a roleplay scene.
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aka simpler and more fun.
Totally support this, just because as emmet said, describing yourself over and over again isn't fun, I mean think about needing to write down all the miranda rights, fuck that.
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aka simpler and more fun.
Totally support this, just because as emmet said, describing yourself over and over again isn't fun, I mean think about needing to write down all the miranda rights, f**k that.
That's why you have /mir :rolleyes:
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Then ignore them and continue with whatever you was doing.
Free bans are also included.
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That's why you have /mir :rolleyes:
EXACTLY! so how about there are commands for something you would write out, for example have your look set at a command like /perspection, but that wouldn't make any sense, why not just allow keybinds, I mean for the love of god if someone abuses it you ban him, I mean there are way worse things that the server allows and people just simply get banned for it, let me not get started how guns cost less than healing..
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I mean there are way worse things that the server allows and people just simply get banned for it
Like?
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Like?
everyone who joins the server can buy a gun and start shooting people with it, everyone as soon as they join the server can suspect people, and to be fair it isn't hard to hide that you have keybinds.. I mean I've used them for two years before someone told me they were illegal, it's not like you go insane with them.
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everyone who joins the server can buy a gun and start shooting people with it
If they do that, admin will take some actions.
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I was just trying to make it easier for everyone here, no need to argue about it. -_-
If it cannot be allowed then fine, let it be. :D
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If they do that, admin will take some actions.
And if they abuse keybinds, admin will take some action.
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Don't see why they shouldn't be allowed, keybinds don't exactly give an advantage to the person using it unless being able to post a message quicker is considered that. Spamming them wouldn't pose a issue as most binds are for /me actions and other local chats plus we do have a anti-spam kick. CamHack is allowed providing users with many advantages yet binding a command with text is forbidden? :neutral2:
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Okay I understand both sides;
A person can set their keybinds to
/me pulls out a desert eagle
/me aims at the person
/me pulls the trigger three times
but people don't even roleplay it anyway, I mean holy shit, there have been so many times where someone just pulled a gun out of their rectum. It isn't a bad thing, even if this happens, at least people will start roleplaying it, and if someone abuses it you can just freaking report him, it isn't that hard, it can be useful and easily controlled
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but people don't even roleplay it anyway, I mean holy shit, there have been so many times where someone just pulled a gun out of their rectum.
yes because it totally takes 10 seconds for someone to take out a pistol in real life, and they stay completely still while doing that as well
You don't need to /me something that other people see you doing anyway - opening doors, driving cars, taking out weapons, shooting at someone etc. /me is only there to show the actions that people wouldn't normally see.
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Keybinds should not be disallowed, simply because of anti-spam measures implemented such as Sauron...
The Sauron antispam itself is not 100% effective, but is there to provide support to what existing admin protection we have. There are ways to get around it, and we should not fall back on it for all situations involving spam.
All keybinds would do is increase roleplay. RP is fine as it currently is, but if people are allowed to use keybinds to show simple things that would be hard to type over and over like the description of their character what is the issue ? I do not see it...
Quantity and speed do not equal quality. All keybinds would do is degrade roleplay by turning it from something creative into something that people would just spam, and I'm not talking about things like writing a f**king essay just to open a door, although that can be included too.
Remember, in order to push forward for a better future we have to not be so closed mind about ideas that may seem "SRS RP" when in reality they are not hurting anyone.....
Except that this is a server where we do not keep porting "SRS RP" ideas over from those servers.
just giving veteran players a bit more freedom..... no new player will go "z0mg srs rp server" if when they walk up to a group of gang members and see "/em Emmet is 25 years old looking with gang tattoos"...
1. Most of the new players who are already familiar with roleplay are from one of those servers anyway.
2. It doesn't make any sense to write /me or /em for something already immediately visible, like skins and animations.
3. "Freedom" does not equate to allowing measures that would only degrade roleplay, or provide security threats and unfair advantages.
They were already creative when they came up with the content, that they save it on a keybind for future re-use is simply a convenience.
You could say that /s1-3 /m1-3 were creative lines at the time of their conception, but did their addition increase the quality, rather than quantity of roleplay itself? No.
Agreed, but then again, isn't that the whole point of keybinds? Portraying your character best with less effort (keybinds instead of typing it out or Ctrl+V).
Less effort, yes. Better portrayal, no. Players just spamming a keybind and copy-pasting things they've done plenty times before, rather than using their imagination and creativity to best suit the situation (as every situation is unique) is not a better portrayal at all.
Totally support this, just because as emmet said, describing yourself over and over again isn't fun, I mean think about needing to write down all the miranda rights, f**k that.
Describing yourself over and over again is usually done by those who are not skilled enough to properly convey their character through its portrayal, rather than an exposition. (hint: Google narrative exposition) Another one of their bad habits is "overkill", like writing a f**king essay just to open a door or perform other simple and completely visible actions.
Also, I was one of the FBI Agents from an older generation that predated the addition of /mir. At the time, even the lowest-ranked FBI Agent could perfectly recite the Miranda rights from memory. Embodying the character's portrayal took actual skill, not some keybinds you spam from a button.
And if they abuse keybinds, admin will take some action.
It's absurd to allow this-and-that just because "oh we have admins, they'll take action anyway". Admins already have enough on their plates and are not machines, no need to flood them further with unnecessary workload.
and if someone abuses it you can just freaking report him, it isn't that hard, it can be useful and easily controlled
Not to mention you have little idea of how admin work actually works, based on how you argue for adding something that is ostensibly easily controllable, when in reality all it would do is add a dozen unnecessary and/or time-consuming reports per admin. Take this from someone who did not only perform admin work, but also trained others to do it.
Now, a little recap of the quotes you need to keep in mind for this topic:
As if the administration already has enough on their plate, they would have to investigate every keybind reports to see if they're valid or not.
How pressing a key that will send constantly the same sentence is improving roleplay in any way?
It just makes it more predictable and annoying.
No. Just no. The usage of keybinds does not improve roleplay and this is exactly another reason why they are not added, so get that delusion out of your heads. In fact, it only degrades the roleplay by making people too lazy and/or uncreative to type out what they have to do.
A good roleplayer is someone who can portray their character best with less effort, not someone who spams pre-defined "roleplay" lines from some keybind.
The Server Owners have already given an answer on this many, many, many times
The reason why we're not allowing keybinds as players is gonna try to use it to gain advantages over other players, and we want it to be a fair play ingame. Also it can be used to flood players wiht it, for an example /pm (even with Sauron, they would be flooded big time). Therefor, [sic] we will not allow it.
You don't need to /me something that other people see you doing anyway - opening doors, driving cars, taking out weapons, shooting at someone etc. /me is only there to show the actions that people wouldn't normally see.
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2. It doesn't make any sense to write /me or /em for something already immediately visible, like skins and animations.
A note, just because I'm wearing a ballaskin, doesn't mean I'm a balla wearing purple clothes.
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A note, just because I'm wearing a ballaskin, doesn't mean I'm a balla wearing purple clothes.
so don't use the balla skin?
It might be because I'm a shitty roleplayer with no creativity whatsoever when it comes to visuals, but wearing a skin and then spamming /em with how you look completely different like a special little snowflake just causes confusion. New people coming into the situation won't know what your character actually looks like and most people involved in the situation simply won't care. If you choose a skin, stick to it and if you can't find anything you like, make a compromise and pick something closest to the thing you're looking for.
If the "/em RandomNegro looks about 25, has gang tattoos, is shirtless and wearing baggy jeans and boxers so low that you can see his ass crack etc etc" is absolutely vital to how you play your role as your character, you're just a bad roleplayer with tunnel vision.
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Everything that was asked, was answered. And I think the main questions already were. Now It's up to the HQ to decide if this should be allowed or disallowed. Just seriously, read through the pages and you will find everything you need, no need to continue this.
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As far as I know many servers have command to see how does the other person looks like, that could be useful sometimes.
through its portrayal, rather than an exposition. (hint: Google narrative exposition)
yes i think that u r the smartest guy around teach plsss :cowboy: :cowboy: :bananav: :app: :janek: :weed:
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I dont think people who are going to spam an IP or just flood care if keybinds are allowed or not :rofl:
OT: Dont really mind with keybinds being allowed altough some do have a point it can get quite annoying... And the server spam :P
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If one wishes to describe their character in detail at the start of a roleplay, they can do so.
If someone wants to describe every detail of their character such as hair colour and so on, they're free to do so.
Keep in mind that there is no way to say your method of roleplay is right and someone elses method is wrong because that don't follow the exact same methods.
That is what makes roleplay entertaining, meeting new people that share different views on roleplay, others that have different techniques and along the way you begin to catch on to the way others do things which then counts towards the evolution of your roleplay and roleplay skills in future.
Some users would like to be able to use keybinds for logical purposes like describing themselves, of course that sounds perfectly reasonable; However you do not need to describe yourself every single time you meet someone either.
With that being said, I will discuss this with the rest of the SA:MP HQ and see if we can come to a consensus about the matter.
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I dont think people who are going to spam an IP or just flood care if keybidinds are allowed or not :rofl:
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If one wishes to describe their character in detail at the start of a roleplay, they can do so.
If someone wants to describe every detail of their character such as hair colour and so on, they're free to do so.
Keep in mind that there is no way to say your method of roleplay is right and someone elses method is wrong because that don't follow the exact same methods.
That is what makes roleplay entertaining, meeting new people that share different views on roleplay, others that have different techniques and along the way you begin to catch on to the way others do things which then counts towards the evolution of your roleplay and roleplay skills in future.
Some users would like to be able to use keybinds for logical purposes like describing themselves, of course that sounds perfectly reasonable; However you do not need to describe yourself every single time you meet someone either.
With that being said, I will discuss this with the rest of the SA:MP HQ and see if we can come to a consensus about the matter.
Thaaank you, kind sir. Now noany argues :D
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Okay I understand both sides;
A person can set their keybinds to
/me pulls out a desert eagle
/me aims at the person
/me pulls the trigger three times
but people don't even roleplay it anyway, I mean holy shit, there have been so many times where someone just pulled a gun out of their rectum. It isn't a bad thing, even if this happens, at least people will start roleplaying it, and if someone abuses it you can just freaking report him, it isn't that hard, it can be useful and easily controlled
It only happens because some people think that way. Why the heck do you need to use /me on things, that can be animated within the game?
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AoD would have found this pretty useful when they were RPing the ten green bottles as abandoned. I saw them repeating the same /em over and over, to anyone who entered the bar. IMO, we should allow them on /em ( maybe even /me ) and animations only. No /p or anything alike.
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If one wishes to describe their character in detail at the start of a roleplay, they can do so.
If someone wants to describe every detail of their character such as hair colour and so on, they're free to do so.
Keep in mind that there is no way to say your method of roleplay is right and someone elses method is wrong because that don't follow the exact same methods.
That is what makes roleplay entertaining, meeting new people that share different views on roleplay, others that have different techniques and along the way you begin to catch on to the way others do things which then counts towards the evolution of your roleplay and roleplay skills in future.
Some users would like to be able to use keybinds for logical purposes like describing themselves, of course that sounds perfectly reasonable; However you do not need to describe yourself every single time you meet someone either.
With that being said, I will discuss this with the rest of the SA:MP HQ and see if we can come to a consensus about the matter.
I am liking you more and more everyday since I returned. :D
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As much as RS5 needs to have it's scripts improved, maybe in the future some personal macro system can be added. /mac[1-10] (example). /setmac1 /me is wearing [bla bla bla] , /setmac2 [/ad Business is open] etc. This is one way to avoid the whole keybind problems.
On the other hand...People mostly want to use keybinds to describe the unneeded details around your characters. A good roleplayer won't care for your character's sock color, if your nails are cut,your boots are red or whatever(in most cases). No, being able to describe the length of your character's hair in centimeters is not good roleplay. A simple /me has a short cut hair and has tattoos of [said clique]. Is more than enough. No need for /me is 7" tall, grew in the Ganton ghetto, is 23 years old, wearing a nike tracksuit with a spot on the left collar. This is utterly annoying to me and other people. Typing out a /me command takes less than 20 seconds, if you have time to turn on SA:MP, you must have time to actually roleplay, and not avoid it with keybinds.
A simple macro command could be added, which could help those people in need to describe every single unneeded detail of their character, however it will just increase player laziness and won't imporve shit. (No, keybinds do NOT improve or help Roleplay in any way, I have been roleplaying for more than 5 years now, be it GTA or not and I have not even once needed keybinding of any sort. And before people going "you must be a shit rper trololol", I think there are enough players who can vouch for my roleplaying skills.)
AoD would have found this pretty useful when they were RPing the ten green bottles as abandoned. I saw them repeating the same /em over and over, to anyone who entered the bar. IMO, we should allow them on /em ( maybe even /me ) and animations only. No /p or anything alike.
It wasn't really a big deal to me :rolleyes: Roleplaying around the bar always has me typing out /me's in order to serve a customer's personal order for a drink. Describing the patches on my vest when needed or anything. I'm perfectly okay with the way things are. As long as /l , /s , /me and /em work correctly, I do not see any more commands that could improve roleplay. ( /glasses and commands like such bring a pleasant element to it, but a /me is wearing black sunglasses. has about the same effect.)
come at me srs rpers, i'm ready for you
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A good roleplayer won't care for your character's sock color, if your nails are cut,your boots are red or whatever(in most cases). No, being able to describe the length of your character's hair in centimeters is not good roleplay. A simple /me has a short cut hair and has tattoos of [said clique]. Is more than enough. No need for /me is 7" tall, grew in the Ganton ghetto, is 23 years old, wearing a nike tracksuit with a spot on the left collar. This is utterly annoying to me and other people. Typing out a /me command takes less than 20 seconds, if you have time to turn on SA:MP, you must have time to actually roleplay, and not avoid it with keybinds.
Describing your appearance is not avoiding roleplay and you are so much like wrong talking about short me's being enough for every roleplay.
The more detail you spend into your roleplay the better the atmosphere, the better you can make a real image of your opponent, it's a huge difference between a 20 years old guy and a 50 years old one, aswell as his skin tone, even clothes. The location of tatoos can also play a role.
People should get the possibility to enhance their roleplay, not replace it - indeed, but an appearance should be individualistic and players shall also have the right to make it according to their own creativity. And explain me please, why do people get annoyed by one single /me?
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Padres couldn't have said it any better.
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The more detail you spend into your roleplay the better the atmosphere, the better you can make a real image of your opponent, it's a huge difference between a 20 years old guy and a 50 years old one, aswell as his skin tone, even clothes. The location of tatoos can also play a role.
Does that explain the people who write a paragraph just to open a door and think roleplay is some kind of essay-writing contest?
If someone needs keybinds to actually enhance their roleplay because they would rather resort to a mechanical, repetitive sequence of pre-defined lines due to them being either too lazy to type out the roleplay, or too uncreative to improvise for every situation (as all roleplay situations are unique), then some reflection on their skills would do them good.
/s1-3 /m1-3 are nicely written lines and can be done instantly. But did their addition increase the quality of government service roleplay? No. One of the biggest results we had, rather, were officers who spammed those lines with little to no regard for the quality of the rest of their roleplay. (speed + quantity) != quality.
Most of us in this topic agree with the idea that the overall quality of roleplay on the server has deteriorated over the years. Let's not push for the addition of something that will only saturate and degenerate it further.
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Does that explain the people who write a paragraph just to open a door and think roleplay is some kind of essay-writing contest?
If someone needs keybinds to actually enhance their roleplay because they would rather resort to a mechanical, repetitive sequence of pre-defined lines due to them being either too lazy to type out the roleplay, or too uncreative to improvise for every situation (as all roleplay situations are unique), then some reflection on their skills would do them good.
/s1-3 /m1-3 are nicely written lines and can be done instantly. But did their addition increase the quality of government service roleplay? No. One of the biggest results we had, rather, were officers who spammed those lines with little to no regard for the quality of the rest of their roleplay. (speed + quantity) != quality.
Most of us in this topic agree with the idea that the overall quality of roleplay on the server has deteriorated over the years. Let's not push for the addition of something that will only saturate and degenerate it further.
If you could please take another look at my message. In my reply I answered in regards to a character's appearance. Actions are way different, and no, roleplay is not a essay writing contest. Yet it always depends on the situation how much you should write and how much not.
Taking your example to open a door. To open a door you don't need much to write, there's no need for /me slowly pulls his right hand out of his pocket, extending it straightly towards the doorknob and eventually turning it, opening the door. I agree with you on that part, but there are other situations where detail can play an important role, for example in a fight to roleplay a dodge or counter attack, aswell as in cuffing processes where it can improve the atmosphere.
Moving to the fact that people write pre-defined lines. When I firstly began SA:MP I started off on a german argo-typish server where people had a keybinder for everything, even chat messages. So when you got pulled over they just simply hit Numpad 1, then 2, then 3 and several chat messages got spammed on the screen.
I totally hate that and I would never agree on that.
As I said before, keybinders shall be of help in roleplay, not replace it. If someone is too lazy to roleplay then why does he actually do it? Roleplay is something that requires your motivation and creativity because roleplay without improvising is not possible, fact.
On the other side, some roleplayed actions may need to be done in a rush, for example shootouts(not often, but it does happen!) For those actions people could use keybinders.
I don't really directly consider /s and /m as "roleplay" but I know what you mean. But the thing is that I don't tend to spamming these, but rather use my own messages to individualise my actions.
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Describing your appearance is not avoiding roleplay and you are so much like wrong talking about short me's being enough for every roleplay.
The more detail you spend into your roleplay the better the atmosphere, the better you can make a real image of your opponent, it's a huge difference between a 20 years old guy and a 50 years old one, aswell as his skin tone, even clothes. The location of tatoos can also play a role.
People should get the possibility to enhance their roleplay, not replace it - indeed, but an appearance should be individualistic and players shall also have the right to make it according to their own creativity. And explain me please, why do people get annoyed by one single /me?
This.
I'd like to add that one detailed description of your character, the situation or whatnot you are using "unnecessary text" for can be highly useful in a roleplay scene if you keep your mind open and actually use your fantasy to throw it back at him/her/them, positive or negative.
Having the mindset of "meh so boring with text, you can see every solid animation in game, why even use text?" is just a sign of having lack of creativity and being incredible one sided in their way of roleplaying.
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Having the mindset of "meh so boring with text, you can see every solid animation in game, why even use text?" is just a sign of having lack of creativity and being incredible one sided in their way of roleplaying.
http://wiki.argonathrpg.com/index.php?title=SA-MP_Role-playing_Guide
Overusing /me
While /me is the basic RP command, many players overuse it.
Gandalf takes out a gun.
Gandalf walks to the door.
Gandalf sits down.
All of these are actions which are visible for other players. To double them by /me has no added value. SA-MP is not a text-based or MSN RP, but one with full animated capabilities. Use them.
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http://wiki.argonathrpg.com/index.php?title=SA-MP_Role-playing_Guide
Even though using animations is better than reading plain text it's at times better to write text(or use both) for the sake of the good old detail. :gand:
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Srsly, what could be wrong with using anims and binded /me's. Of course we can't bind EVERYTHING. Basic stuff, as everyone who agrees said.
/me takes this out
/em has this and that on him and is sexy
/me does something to his car
You get it, that's the point. :3
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How dare you roleplay, if there is a animation for it thou shall not roleplay it! Thy shall be punished for wanting enforce witchcraft on us!
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http://wiki.argonathrpg.com/index.php?title=SA-MP_Role-playing_Guide
Everyone has their own way of roleplaying. Nothing is right or wrong. Don't try to enforce people to roleplay without creativity and being all simple just because you prefer it. Let people have their own way of roleplaying and use their own imagination to set up their own style just the way they like it.
That's the delicacy. And if people like to describe their character with /em's or /me's. Or even using a lot of /me's to describe their doings that is out of simple animations and whatnot. Let them. It's just positive.
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Even though using animations is better than reading plain text it's at times better to write text(or use both) for the sake of the good old detail. :gand:
Exactly the mindset of the "extends hand" players. Not everything becomes better when you try to put out more of it. Argonath was found on creativity and imagination, and it raised players who are not dumb enough not to know that someone got into a car if they did not do /me and the animation at the same time.
Everyone has their own way of roleplaying. Nothing is right or wrong. Don't try to enforce people to roleplay without creativity and being all simple just because you prefer it. Let people have their own way of roleplaying and use their own imagination to set up their own style just the way they like it.
That's the delicacy. And if people like to describe their character with /em's or /me's. Or even using a lot of /me's to describe their doings that is out of simple animations and whatnot. Let them. It's just positive.
Is that the same justification we're going to use when people bring in things from other servers (including roleplay styles, and yes I am bringing up this topic as it is relevant) and attempt to spread them here, preferring them over Argonath's own? And to think many veterans yearn for the "spirit of old Argonath" that has "long gone".
People have the right to some individual preference, yes. But Argonath also has the right to be protected against people who try to spread things here that are prevalent on other servers by people who want to replace "A world of its own" with "A world just like my old roleplay server".
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Exactly the mindset of the "extends hand" players. Not everything becomes better when you try to put out more of it. Argonath was found on creativity and imagination, and it raised players who are not dumb enough not to know that someone got into a car if they did not do /me and the animation at the same time.
You don't seem to get my point.
It varies on the given scenario how much detail you (should) spend into your roleplay. When I enter a car then I don't use a /me because it is most of the times useless, but when I interact with other players then I often tend to use /me along with an animation, simple.
Now it seems we went a tad off-topic. My point still stands. Players should get the opportunity to enhance their roleplay appropiatily.
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Players should get the opportunity to enhance their roleplay appropiatily.
Then let's talk about enhancement.
Argonath has for years produced players who enhanced their roleplay skills to levels far above today's average without using any keybinds or "roleplay crutches". This proves only someone seriously lazy, uncreative, unskilled, or a combination of some/all of those would need keybinds to "enhance" their roleplay.
You do realize that keybinds in this context are to roleplay what aimbots are to shooting. I don't need some kind of external tool to improve my skills as I can do it myself.
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Ofcourse we don't need keybinders, but be honest now.
Let's say, you are a real hardcore roleplayer, you need solely 3-4 /em's to describe your appearance. Would you type it out everytime? Exactly - you wouldn't. The example I had taken was extreme but I think you get my point atleast.
Nobody needs, but instead wants keybinders to enhance their roleplay and make it more simple. To me it seems you still compare keybinders as a complete replacement to creativity and roleplay, which is not the case. I'm not for those people that use pre-defined action-binds, that's something that I'm definitelly not voting for. Instead, I put myself in for those who want to make their roleplay easier, but still as creative as before.
You gotta think about it. Keybinders don't change the way other people roleplay.
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Still does not eliminate the fact that keybinds are to roleplay what aimbots are to shooting; using an external program to enhance an ability that could be otherwise enhanced through one's own effort.
Now let's replace "roleplay" with "shooting" and "keybinds" with "aimbots":
Ofcourse we don't need aimbots, but be honest now.
Let's say, you are a real hardcore shooter, you need nearly 100% hit rate to fight well. Would you stand still in the middle of combat and try to get a good shot everytime? Exactly - you wouldn't. The example I had taken was extreme but I think you get my point atleast.
Nobody needs, but instead wants aimbots to enhance their shooting skills and make it more simple. To me it seems you still compare aimbots as a complete replacement to shooting skills and practicing them, which is not the case. I'm not for those people that use it as complete compensation for shooting practice, that's something that I'm definitelly not voting for. Instead, I put myself in for those who want to make their shooting easier, but still as easy as before.
You gotta think about it. Aimbots don't change the way other people shoot.
The logic still applies. If it sounds absurd to you now, then you know how the usage of keybinds sounds absurd to people who believe in enhancing their roleplay through their own effort.
At the end of the day, if you need an external program or installation to enhance your abilities, then you're doing it wrong.
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It seems people are only looking at the "bright" side of keybinds, take into account the other things that can be "abused" with keybinds, for example surrendering instantaneously, "buying food" (when the system is up) in seconds when being chased perhaps?
With every positive and helpful tool there is always a downside that can be exploited or abused.
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Why don't just allow it and see what happens? You can always disallow it if it gets abused.
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It seems people are only looking at the "bright" side of
They always do that with every idea. :rolleyes:
Why don't just allow it and see what happens? You can always disallow it if it gets abused.
A better question to ask about this server is what people actually don't try to abuse.
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Is that the same justification we're going to use when people bring in things from other servers (including roleplay styles, and yes I am bringing up this topic as it is relevant) and attempt to spread them here, preferring them over Argonath's own? And to think many veterans yearn for the "spirit of old Argonath" that has "long gone".
People have the right to some individual preference, yes. But Argonath also has the right to be protected against people who try to spread things here that are prevalent on other servers by people who want to replace "A world of its own" with "A world just like my old roleplay server".
I think we should stay out of people's business how they want to use /me's or not as long as they contributing positively within the community. Dot.
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A better question to ask about this server is what people actually don't try to abuse.
I have a few;
/mir
Okay it stops there.
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I think we should stay out of people's business how they want to use /me's or not as long as they contributing positively within the community.
Did you just indirectly admit to being in favor of people trying to turn Argonath into something overrun with customs and "rules" from other servers?
And to think you are one of those who want to restore the high quality of Argonath roleplay. What you are supporting goes in the opposite direction instead.
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Did you just indirectly admit to being in favor of people trying to turn Argonath into something overrun with customs and "rules" from other servers?
This topic does not need this type of discussion. We can talk over Skype about that matter.
As long as people are contributing, and doing their best, I can't care less of which style someone's using. Some of you should stop make it such a big deal, and make it into a HUGE thing every time it comes up. If someone would like to use "unnecessary" sentences to describe their character or whatsoever - let them do it. It doesn't even make a difference for you lol. It's their way of roleplaying. Just like you are doing it simple and likes it that way.
There's no written rule how to roleplay, and that is what makes it unique.
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This topic does not need this type of discussion. We can talk over Skype about that matter.
As long as people are contributing, and doing their best, I can't care less of which style someone's using. Some of you should stop make it such a big deal, and make it into a big thing every time it comes up. If someone would like to use "unnecessary" sentences to describe their character or whatsoever - let them do it. It doesn't even make a difference for you lol. It's their way of roleplaying. Just like you are doing it simple and likes it that way.
There's no written rule how to roleplay, and that is what makes it unique.
They are free to do what they want, however doing it by a 3rd party software won't be supported as abuse will pop up.
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They are free to do what they want, however doing it by a 3rd party software won't be supported as abuse will pop up.
Yeah, and that's something totally different. :)
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It seems people are only looking at the "bright" side of keybinds, take into account the other things that can be "abused" with keybinds, for example surrendering instantaneously, "buying food" (when the system is up) in seconds when being chased perhaps?
With every positive and helpful tool there is always a downside that can be exploited or abused.
I'm pretty sure I can type /gu easier than remembering an button to give up, let's see more realistic ones
/jail ID 200 won't work because of the ID
/pickpocket won't work because of the ID but it's easier than /jail
gambling? not sure if the /dice cmd even exsists.
/kill -> that would be me (/s allaku akbar -> /kill)
other than cat messages it is really hard to abuse it because of the need to write down the ID, which it would still be simpler to me just to writhe the whole command.
The logic still applies. If it sounds absurd to you now, then you know how the usage of keybinds sounds absurd to people who believe in enhancing their roleplay through their own effort.
At the end of the day, if you need an external program or installation to enhance your abilities, then you're doing it wrong.
You just compared something that annoys people to the point of quitting the game with a simple shortcut. So if it's easier for me to write something with a keybind I'm not putting the same effort into roleplay? Why don't you want roleplay on the server, what happened to [RPIT]JDC, if keybinds help people to roleplay why not allow them, I mean most people will try to find a way to exploit them, but just for simple roleplay commands as in using an animation quicker which may help mechanics and cops.. a shortcut isn't the same as hacking, that's like saying CTRL+A CTRL+C and CTRL+V shouldn't be allowed because you aren't putting the same effort in as you would with selecting all text with your mouse, pressing right clock, pressing copy, pressing right click, pressing paste, it's a simple shortcut, it gets the job done the same only quicker, and time is money, in this case it isn't, but some people just don't want to put in the effort to.. using Emmet's example.. write their body description over and over again.
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Now let's replace "roleplay" with "shooting" and "keybinds" with "aimbots":
You have to be pretty delusional with your head very far up your own arse to compare keybinds with hacks.
Keybinds essentially help you type repetetive messages quicker, since they do happen and CAN be good, even though I don't like them the majority of the time since people do tend to spam them. However, most MMO games have some sort of a macro system, and while they don't contribute to personal roleplay, they certainly don't harm anyone like hacks do.
Personally I only use one personalised message (/m for pulling people over) so I can simply ctrl+v it and it won't be considered abuse since everyone can do it, so for the time being I recommend people copypasting their /em character message if they really feel the compulsion to do it.
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The only delusion here is the idea that keybinds are actually required for someone to better their (quality of) roleplay, which is pretty much the core premise used by the supporters. While shooting (and aimbots) causes physical harm, perpetuating the delusion of roleplay being based on keybinds harms the server by further degrading the quality of roleplay. (as if it has not already degraded enough)
Roleplay is created and enhanced by creativity and imagination, not by some macros or external program.
Unbelievable how people ignore huge security risks and the other red flags waving in their faces, as long as at least one benefit looks "cool".
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We have discussed the matter and come to the consensus that keybinds will not be allowed within SA:MP.
Unfortunately the risks out-weigh the advantages of allowing these sorts of programs which makes allowing it too much of a risk.
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Is Keybind the same as copy and paste?
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I say leave it disallowed, but majority of us already use copy & paste to do our commands faster.
With allowing it I see people getting advantage to role playing pulling out guns faster and such, as someone without key binds would still be typing out his commands. I know majority of servers out there support the key bind idea, but it gets annoying when you are the player without key binds. Allowing it could help, but also brings enforcement with spammers and moaners who would say it's unfair because they don't have key binds.
P.S Key binds are not the same as Copy & Paste, you bind a command to a key and you hit that key to do the command. It's instant so no need of typing. In my opinion I think we should disallow it, but it requires more enforcing but the same goes for allowing it.
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We have discussed the matter and come to the consensus that keybinds will not be allowed within SA:MP.
Unfortunately the risks out-weigh the advantages of allowing these sorts of programs which makes allowing it too much of a risk.
Okay, than I'll just call in
"Copy and Paste"
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Okay, than I'll just call in
"Copy and Paste"
Be my guest. :)
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It seems people are only looking at the "bright" side of keybinds, take into account the other things that can be "abused" with keybinds, for example surrendering instantaneously, "buying food" (when the system is up) in seconds when being chased perhaps?
With every positive and helpful tool there is always a downside that can be exploited or abused.
Devin, i really dont see your poin in this example. I can do the same without keybinds :lol:
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We have discussed the matter and come to the consensus that keybinds will not be allowed within SA:MP.
Unfortunately the risks out-weigh the advantages of allowing these sorts of programs which makes allowing it too much of a risk.
I do not understand "risks" of such programs considering servers with three times the player base daily have most players using them with no issues... The only thing I can think of is that Argonath has a bad history of its players always abusing things. :/
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It's a third party application, you can't say that most would have it installed which means it's not unfair to those that don't have it.
There are ways it can be abused which is why it will not be allowed within SA:MP.
I took it up with the rest of the HQ for discussion about allowing it and the responses were to not allow it.
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If it cannot be allowed then fine, let it be. :D
If you believed that you would not of made this topic as it had already not been allowed ...
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If you believed that you would not of made this topic as it had already not been allowed ...
double negative makes a positive, double triple negative makes a positively negative, positively negative positive gives a possible positive, Keybinds confirmed.
(http://i.imgur.com/YHEFPbF.png)
Your reply was posted on 28.3 at 10:03:10 pm which was the exact time and date as the first keybinder for SAMP was scripted, only 5 years ago.
I'm not making this shit up people! CBFasi is dropping hints!
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I'm not making this shit up people! CBFasi is dropping hints!
(http://www.rebellesociety.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/disappointment.jpg)
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Haha, best conspiracy theory ever! :lol:
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(http://i.imgur.com/nlGabC7.png)
EVEN FUCKING LEON KNOWS IT! They don't want us to know,
I will be your prophet, I will tell you what hints they are dropping!
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(http://i.imgur.com/nlGabC7.png)
EVEN FUCKING LEON KNOWS IT! They don't want us to know,
I will be your prophet, I will tell you what hints they are dropping!
Everybody CHILL! SPECIAL OPS GOT THIS!
(http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y405/gojko7/TacticalFacepalm_zps7ac7c6a7.jpg) (http://s1273.photobucket.com/user/gojko7/media/TacticalFacepalm_zps7ac7c6a7.jpg.html)
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Everybody CHILL! SPECIAL OPS GOT THIS!
I could make random lines that spell out faggot but I don't want to waste my time, will just straight tell you that you are a faggot.
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Twisting the words of a Community Leader ..... then flaming others ...
I am one who believes nothing has changed to encourage the removal of this ruling on NOT allowing keybinds.
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keybinds.
Exatcly.
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Exatcly.
If you're going to accuse other discussions of being outright retarded, stop making a laughingstock of yourself on this forum first.
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If you're going to accuse other discussions of being outright retarded, stop making a laughingstock of yourself on this forum first.
Now why would I do something silly like that.. someone needs to be a laughingstock whateverthatmeans
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If you're going to accuse other discussions of being outright retarded, stop making a laughingstock of yourself on this forum first.
You COULD try taking that stick out of your bottom and be a bit more light-hearted.
We've already been informed that keybinds won't be allowed, so there's really no point for you to remain so belligerent.
Besides, Jaka's on to something.
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You COULD try taking that stick out of your bottom and be a bit more light-hearted.
We've already been informed that keybinds won't be allowed, so there's really no point for you to remain so belligerent.
Besides, Jaka's on to something.
Keybinds were never allowed in the first place, and this topic was tantamount to asking for hacks to be allowed.
I understand and appreciate humor, but discarding all sense of maturity and making a spectacle of yourself on the forum while haphazardly breaking forum rules does not qualify.
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Alright guys cut it out, no need for this. The topic was simply created to get answers for why keybinds would and wouldn't be allowed. We have the answers, now there's no need to proceed arguing.
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Keybinds does not help improve role play, rather it makes everyone robotic. Since it would be unrealistic to have pre-programmed implications and actions for every scenario, every interaction between each player. If this is allowed, then we would have people taking advantages in role play over others. Instead of actually building a situation equally with another player, it would totally languish the way we role play in Argonath.
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Implying this server is realistic
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I could make random lines that spell out faggot but I don't want to waste my time, will just straight tell you that you are a faggot.
You really dont wanna start it with a psycho like me
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You really dont wanna start it with a psycho like me
I see, but nobody is a bigger psycho than me, I'm sorry.
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I see, but nobody is a bigger psycho than me, I'm sorry.
And who did tell ya that shitload of bullshit?
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Enough off-topic.