Argonath RPG - A World of its own
GTA:SA => San Andreas - Capital Building => SA:MP - Business & Government => SA Capital Building Archive => Topic started by: JoshThePenguin on April 28, 2014, 12:15:31 pm
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Many people think the Firemissions are made pretty unfair.
Today, its all about keeping the location for yourself and rushing towards it for the most money.
Here is an example:
Some firemen stationairy at LSFD, the alarm goes of, I check the location... Willowfield LS.
Thats not even 30 seconds driving from LSFD.
When I arrived, the mission was already completed for 87%! One firesource Remaining: 15%
After the missions, many guys just say what they got from their mission.
Here is an example of just a few minutes ago:
(http://i57.tinypic.com/o5utsp.png)
This is just.... Ridiculous.
The money diffirence between Lil_Mama and Domic_Vendito is $4750!!!!
I understand all the complaints about the firemission, now that I'm playing as a fireman through the day.....
What is your opinion about the Firemission-system?
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The system,
1. Doesn't encourage teamwork
2. Doesn't encourage Roleplay
3. Unfair payments for firemen who chose to teamwork and help others.
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The system,
1. Doesn't encourage teamwork
2. Doesn't encourage Roleplay
3. Unfair payments for firemen who chose to teamwork and help others.
This is exactly the opposite of what they promised us during the closed beta.
I suggest returning RS4's fire mission styles, at least everyone was getting a fair chance, and people actually do preform teamwork.(Which is not splitting the mission percent by the amount of firemen online, btw.)
Oh, WB LIL MAMA
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I don't like the whole ''moneyfarming''. Roleplay should be the main focus.
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The system,
1. Doesn't encourage teamwork
2. Doesn't encourage Roleplay
3. Unfair payments for firemen who chose to teamwork and help others.
agreed.
went on fireman duty today as there was nothing else to do and all I can say that unfortunately most of the firemen are moneyhungry, instead of team working and driving each other to the fire location every one gets in his truck and doesnt let anyone get in, when there's a mission people start carjacking and carkilling each other just for that cash..lol
in my opinion it should be like 500$ or 1k for every firemen joining the mission, doesn't matter how many fires you have extinguised.
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This have been a long problem since RS5 Beta indeed.
Sorry to modify but it should be "ARFD Fire Missions"*.
What I see, as a SAFD Captain, is that some of the ARFD Voluntary Firefighters are not willing to roleplay and show teamwork and professionalism in the mission. Furthermore, this is a roleplay server, roleplay should be prioritised instead of money-making.
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Like TiMoN says... They should bring back the old Rs4 system, Engines to hold the fire on a low level and firemen on the ground to extinguish them. In Rs4 we had like all the same ammount of money from missions :cowboy:
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This have been a long problem since RS5 Beta indeed.
Sorry to modify but it should be "ARFD Fire Missions"*.
What I see, as a SAFD Captain, is that some of the ARFD Voluntary Firefighters are not willing to roleplay and show teamwork and professionalism in the mission. Furthermore, this is a roleplay server, roleplay should be prioritised instead of money-making.
This is what the truth is, no one can deny it and what's even sadder is that players who do roleplay actually spend less time on the fire, therefore they actually earn less than the one who didn't roleplay. Not only that but a lack of script ideas that we asked for were failed to be recongised and cast aside.
Also guys if you could open a topic on the ARFD Forums regarding this, this idea should be forwarded there as SugarD has stated multiple times.
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This have been a long problem since RS5 Beta indeed.
Sorry to modify but it should be "ARFD Fire Missions"*.
What I see, as a SAFD Captain, is that some of the ARFD Voluntary Firefighters are not willing to roleplay and show teamwork and professionalism in the mission. Furthermore, this is a roleplay server, roleplay should be prioritised instead of money-making.
Nicely said. :app:
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This is what the truth is, no one can deny it and what's even sadder is that players who do roleplay actually spend less time on the fire, therefore they actually earn less than the one who didn't roleplay. Not only that but a lack of script ideas that we asked for were failed to be recongised and cast aside.
Also guys if you could open a topic on the ARFD Forums regarding this, this idea should be forwarded there as SugarD has stated multiple times.
The Thing is... The Rs5 test server for admins didn't support 'us' players to test the server, there were like 5 admins max online or 3... they couldn't know there would be 30 firemen, rushing to the fire for the money only... They Should have invited players to the test server to report bugs by theirself instead of admins trying to find them.
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The Thing is... The Rs5 test server for admins didn't support 'us' players to test the server, there were like 5 admins max online or 3... they couldn't know there would be 30 firemen, rushing to the fire for the money only... They Should have invited players to the test server to report bugs by theirself instead of admins trying to find them.
A major issue since that closed beta wasn't done for long enough obviously and that they didn't invite the correct players. If I am correct; only one person in the ranked structure of ARFD actually was allowed to participate in the closed beta, that number should've been higher.
Also guys move here please; http://www.arfd.argonathrpg.com/forum/index.php?topic=2147.0
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A major issue since that closed beta wasn't done for long enough obviously and that they didn't invite the correct players. If I am correct; only one person in the ranked structure of ARFD actually was allowed to participate in the closed beta, that number should've been higher.
Also guys move here please; http://www.arfd.argonathrpg.com/forum/index.php?topic=2147.0
If they can't change it to the old RS4 mission system... They should At least make more firesources and bigger missions that take a longer time to Extinguish
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The Thing is... The Rs5 test server for admins didn't support 'us' players to test the server, there were like 5 admins max online or 3... they couldn't know there would be 30 firemen, rushing to the fire for the money only... They Should have invited players to the test server to report bugs by theirself instead of admins trying to find them.
Admins were not the only testers.
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Admins were not the only testers.
If I am correct; only one person in the ranked structure of ARFD actually was allowed to participate in the closed beta, that number should've been higher.
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Let's discuss some things of RS4 FD system
Pros
1. Without teamwork , it was a nearly impossible mission
2. Locations were set such that, you feel the hardness
3. Heli's and others made it to look pro
Cons
-Low Pays
- Known locations
- Firemen went for drugs instead of missions
- High time interval
- Cant use engine
Best Remedy
1.Making locations tough
Gosh, it's damn easy to find a location of pager and run there like cats and dogs
[a] Add new locations. Make some like, reaching there on vehicles is impossible
2.Equal Pays for "On foot" and "On engine"
You may think this is already stated but heavens sake the situation now is totally different. Till you spray like 3% of mission, 97% is done by engine and they earn much. So there is always fight for trucks.
Suggestions-
[a] Increase percent, while spraying we do like 3% in one spray. It must be raised to 5% equal to engines
Engines must not be able to spray on more than one source at a time.
3.Equality of places.
[a] Same number of missions in each city and they must take place regularly. No mission must come in the same city twice in a row. This won't make firemen goto other stations. Well, if once in LS, it could be in red county too.
4. Refreshing Look
[a] Add helicopters so that "on foot" players can reach there easily too while the engines run away.
5. Fueling up
[a] There must be working GS on the fire stations .
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Well many good points were stated though many things should be taken in consideration aswell.
Me myself also kind of hate the corrent state of the job. The main problem though is not the luck of RP, this is everywhere after all, even at places where the script gives you many possibilities. The main problem is that the Fireman Job is plainly borring.
I mean I play this game in general to have fun, and like it or not for many RP scenarios a minimum ammount of budget is needed, so I get to work, which is normal in an RPG server. But especially being a fireman is the most borring job in our server. Why? Well I believe that the reason is mainly because of its corrent state, I mean to get a decent ammount of income from the job you gotta stay about 30 minutes infront of the pager, being totally bored and waiting for the alarm, then /pager, rush to a truck, and go arround like crazy to find the fire with the sirens off in order to actually hear it. Once you get there you try to extinguish as many firesources at the same time in order to actually get a decent ammount of money from the mission. While being there it will take less than 3 minutes to finish the mission and return to the station and wait again for about 30 minutes for the next one.
So yeah, anyone who wants to find a new way should also consider this fact, the job needs to give possibilities to the RPers to RP and also make it less borring.
Idea:A simple but dramatically usefull one would be to set the missions to happen more offen. Like starting the next mission 10 minutes after the last one was over. I do understand that for this to work the payment needs to get lower but still I'd like to hear what you think about it. I mean if the missions now give a total of arround 10k a hour with one every 30 minutes => 10/2=5k a mission , then like make it 10k/5= 2k a mission.
Commending on your idea:Making every participants income same.
Well this idea is actually pretty good but has a very basic flow. It will for sure give the ability to everyone to get paid but many firemen could just go there, extinguish a little bit with their extinguisher and ride away waiting for their payment.
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2.Equal Pays for "On foot" and "On engine"
You may think this is already stated but heavens sake the situation now is totally different. Till you spray like 3% of mission, 97% is done by engine and they earn much. So there is always fight for trucks.
Suggestions-
[a] Increase percent, while spraying we do like 3% in one spray. It must be raised to 5% equal to engines
Engines must not be able to spray on more than one source at a time.
Your ideas were pretty good but this one has two wrong things in it.
First of all even if the extinguisher had a 5% impact like the trucks it still is not abled to cover more than one fire at once. Changing the way the trucks work to make them take only one fire at once adds up to the second problem.
Second Problem: If both the extinguisher and the truck had the same impact, and especially if the max sources for both were one at once then, there would simply be no reason why someone would ride with a truck, people would just use faster vehicles such as sport cars or even choppers/planes to get there faster.
So yeah this idea would just lead to a fire force full of fast vehicles(just like it was in RS4 btw).
And I just noticed that I double posted...
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So yeah this idea would just lead to a fire force full of fast vehicles(just like it was in RS4 btw).
What's the problem there actually?
Some people are too lazy to spray on foot too.
So they will use trucks
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Second Problem: If both the extinguisher and the truck had the same impact, and especially if the max sources for both were one at once then, there would simply be no reason why someone would ride with a truck, people would just use faster vehicles such as sport cars or even choppers/planes to get there faster.
So yeah this idea would just lead to a fire force full of fast vehicles(just like it was in RS4 btw).
And I just noticed that I double posted...
Easy, make the fire have a "scripted area" and if no engines/ambulances/battalion trucks are inside it, the player makes no money.
What's the problem there actually?
Some people are too lazy to spray on foot too.
So they will use trucks
Make the fire only allow 1 engine to spray the source, if another is spraying the source, the script will detect it and repeat in the players screen that they aren't making any money.
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Easy, make the fire have a "scripted area" and if no engines/ambulances/battalion trucks are inside it, the player makes no money.
So do you mean that there simply needs to be a truck at every fire? If yes then okay this will force atleast one of them to take it, and everyone would wait till one Truck is on scene but still this wouldn't stop people from free roaming and only getting to the mission when it starts, go there fast, wait for the truck and start working afterwards, when its over they are free to go and do what ever they were doing.
Make the fire only allow 1 engine to spray the source, if another is spraying the source, the script will detect it and repeat in the players screen that they aren't making any money.
Didn't quite understand what you meant with this post, mind explaining either in pm or here? Thanks.
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So do you mean that there simply needs to be a truck at every fire? If yes then okay this will force atleast one of them to take it, and everyone would wait till one Truck is on scene but still this wouldn't stop people from free roaming and only getting to the mission when it starts, go there fast, wait for the truck and start working afterwards, when its over they are free to go and do what ever they were doing.
Didn't quite understand what you meant with this post, mind explaining either in pm or here? Thanks.
Sure,
Basically what happens with my improvised idea, is that we resort to the old RS4 system where at least one engine HAS to spray the source. Therefore needing at least one engine to reach the "scripted zone" to allow the fire to start being extinguished. Whilst it won't control other firefighters using other ways of getting there that's why I've heavily recommended but again it's been rejected multiple times for FD command staff to suspend Volunteer Firefighters. Once on scene, in order to stop people from being lazy and constantly spray sources with engine, force 1 person to use the engine to spray one source, if someone else sprays with an engine, it'll tell them in their chat that they are not earning any money and should join on foot.
tl;dr
-Force One Engine to be within a "scripted zone" to start the actual extinguishing
-Suggestion of SAFD Command Staff to suspend Volunteer Firefighters
-Allow only 1 engine to spray a source to stop annoyances to on foot firefighters
-Use RS4 System, making engines a VITAL requirement in extinguishing.
Any improvements, opinions, comments, ideas?
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Putting it all together:
The best way to put it all together is this.
1. A fireengine needs to maintain a fire in order for it not to make explosions and to be extinguished(working the wya you said)
2. Each fireman joining a mission gets a standard payment, but he will need to stay within a radius till the end of the mission(so you can't just go there and extinguish a single fire)
3. I think we should find a way to enforce FD vehicles, as it is plainly unfail when I for examble simply go arround the missions with my private vehicle.
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I personally believe that combining the RS5 mission locations and no map markers with RS4's missions style will make something really nice. /pager will still be needed, no magical textdraws popping up telling you to /mission and the payouts should somehow depend on an equal calculation, so people won't prefer on-foot extinguishing over fire engine maintaining.
I also support Duelist's idea of having a base wage for everyone who extinguishes a single fire and stays in the mission radius.
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There should be 10k max of one mission so we can do teamwork everyone will get good share.(10firemen=10k)
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I like the standard wage idea, but to prevent more money hungry, if you earn OVER that wage limit, you do not receive the additional wage to your payment.
There should be 10k max of one mission so we can do teamwork everyone will get good share.(10firemen=10k)
I would support making this 5k, not 10, that's too much for one fire. And this 5k should be scaled depending on sources, so if like 4 sources, make maximum payout like 1-2k, whilst big fires like at LSAP 5k.
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I have no issues with the current system, I can make 20k in 1-2 hours doing missions.
My suggestion to firemen: Start RPing more and then ask for more money.
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There should be like this if one fire fighter is doing all the mission will not get more than 3k, so everyone will do teamwork and 1000$ is good for one fire fighter...
Edit:5000$ are not enough for 10 fire fighter if he's waiting 30-40mins.
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Edit:5000$ are not enough for 10 fire fighter if he's waiting 30-40mins.
It's not all about money.
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When I said 10k I was just saying a number out of nothing to present my examble.
I have no issues with the current system, I can make 20k in 1-2 hours doing missions.
My suggestion to firemen: Start RPing more and then ask for more money.
So yeah you just said that you don't care about the rest of the firemen and go there first taking almost all the fire. As that's the only way to make 20k as a fireman in 2hours
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There should be like this if one fire fighter is doing all the mission will not get more than 3k, so everyone will do teamwork and 1000$ is good for one fire fighter...
Edit:5000$ are not enough for 10 fire fighter if he's waiting 30-40mins.
Boy would you like chips with that as well?
And I think so, the server already has too much money from the current unfair system.
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The money is not "too much". In fact, the earnings from this job are adequate. What is lacking are the earnings from the other jobs.
Problem with people is that they try to solve problems by taking away from what "does not lack" instead of adding to what "lacks", thus lowering the quality of everything in general. Such an approach only creates mediocrity.
Earnings are out of the question, they are fine as they are. (and in some cases, too small)
Talk instead about the conduct of firemen. Personally, I believe admins should be given direct authority to punish any "moneyhungry" firemen who refuse to let their fellow players have a fair chance at earning from the same job.
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The problem is not within the system...it is within the people. If people would stop being greedy and abusing something that was created for fun, we wouldn't be having this conversation right now.
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The problem is not within the system...it is within the people. If people would stop being greedy and abusing something that was created for fun, we wouldn't be having this conversation right now.
IS the perfect case for you something like the so called FD Teamwork? Which means that firemen get to share the fires to get equal payment? If yes then what was said in this topic can bypass the will of the people to teamwork and simply make it happen. I really would like to see what you find wrong in the main idea of the topic.
Which is to make it easy for every parttaking fire fighter to get the same money as everyone, and to kind of enforce a better use of the FD trucks?
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The problem is not within the system...it is within the people. If people would stop being greedy and abusing something that was created for fun, we wouldn't be having this conversation right now.
You can't change what it has been there for ages.
The money is not "too much". In fact, the earnings from this job are adequate. What is lacking are the earnings from the other jobs.
Problem with people is that they try to solve problems by taking away from what "does not lack" instead of adding to what "lacks", thus lowering the quality of everything in general. Such an approach only creates mediocrity.
Earnings are out of the question, they are fine as they are. (and in some cases, too small)
Talk instead about the conduct of firemen. Personally, I believe admins should be given direct authority to punish any "moneyhungry" firemen who refuse to let their fellow players have a fair chance at earning from the same job.
I agree with you on this. Unfortunately that's not the view that the administration is having, as afterall everyone has their right to do whatever he wants when he performs his duty as long as he do it without committing any type of rulebreak. To let know that is even allowed to /pickpocket others right after the mission is over, there's really no good signs for us to receive a better income neither to perform a well roleplay while doing it for the aforementioned reasons.
And I think so, the server already has too much money from the current unfair system.
I haven't seen a person with a personal good/stable economy doing something else apart from fireman duty, there's no money in that only but to a few people.
There should be like this if one fire fighter is doing all the mission will not get more than 3k, so everyone will do teamwork and 1000$ is good for one fire fighter...
Edit:5000$ are not enough for 10 fire fighter if he's waiting 30-40mins.
You can't think on any better suggestion that does not implies money?
I have no issues with the current system, I can make 20k in 1-2 hours doing missions.
My suggestion to firemen: Start RPing more and then ask for more money.
Yeah, you don't have issues with the current system, yet you are not the only one playing in the same system. Try to share a better opinion and maybe a proposal of an idea instead of just drop some selfish comments. And yeah, they should roleplay more, but I'd like you to make them understand that.
What's the problem there actually?
Some people are too lazy to spray on foot too.
So they will use trucks
Oh well, if they are lazy and still they ask for money, there's nothing much that the system can do for them.
The system,
1. Doesn't encourage teamwork
2. Doesn't encourage Roleplay
3. Unfair payments for firemen who chose to teamwork and help others.
1.- The system was made to encourage teamwork. That's the reason of the percentage that each fire mission has, yet everyone decided to mislead this into a greedy race for a few bucks.
2.- The system was made to encourage roleplay. This is why you can find some particular things in this missions along with some of the locations, yet again, everyone just runs for the money.
3.- The payments are fair, the moneyhungers are not.
I don't like to share negative but I'm always honest; As a fire cadet I say that as long as the players doesn't think about the real purpose of this, there's always going to be problems in relation to the incomes and the lack of roleplay that the scripted job and the perfomance of duties might try to give.
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The problem is not within the system...it is within the people. If people would stop being greedy and abusing something that was created for fun, we wouldn't be having this conversation right now.
Indeed. I remember when I started playing RS5 "serious", if we were like 6 firemens we shared the money between us. If someone gained more then another, he gave to the other so they gained the same ammount.
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I don't like to share negative but I'm always honest; As a fire cadet I say that as long as the players doesn't think about the real purpose of this, there's always going to be problems in relation to the incomes and the lack of roleplay that the scripted job and the perfomance of duties might try to give.
No offence but I'm just hearing what SugarD said, the commisioner of ARFD, in different words from a Cadet.
Also remind me if I'm wrong but in the most ideas posted on the forum the main factor why they get denied is one.
They can be easily abused. Now can you explain me why such a big script like this is so easily abused when tiny others were denied for the same reason?
Indeed. I remember when I started playing RS5 "serious", if we were like 6 firemens we shared the money between us. If someone gained more then another, he gave to the other so they gained the same ammount.
That's absolutelly true, I started working as a fireman durring that "stage". Do you find anything wrong into scriptly enforcing teamwork to everyfireman on scene? So firemen would get a base wage nomatter how many join a mission, therefore no one would worry about waitting a few minutes for everyone to extinguish a little bit of the mission, as everyone would get the standard 1k(just saying) payment after all.
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-long quotes-
I am not selfish at all, I do not understand how people are moaning about money money money and only money, it is quite easy to make money if you know the ways.
As I said, I do not have issues earning 20k in a couple of hours, so how can someone else have them?
And why should I propose something if I think everything is going fine.
And I do actually try to get the firemen RP scenes, but every time I call them over the radio all I hear is 'waiting for mission'. So please do not come and say these kinds of things to me if you do not know what I actually try to do for them.
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When I said 10k I was just saying a number out of nothing to present my examble.
So yeah you just said that you don't care about the rest of the firemen and go there first taking almost all the fire. As that's the only way to make 20k as a fireman in 2hours
Actually, I went on firemen duty a few times.
What we did is we end the mission and split the money fair with everyone attention, not 'rushing' and take all the money.
Again, stop saying things before you actually know the truth.
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Actually, I went on firemen duty a few times.
What we did is we end the mission and split the money fair with everyone attention, not 'rushing' and take all the money.
Again, stop saying things before you actually know the truth.
I said things based on what you said. You said that you made 20k as a fireman in 2 hours.
Now my answer is that you either lied or did what I said, which is to go alone on teh missions and take almost all of them in order to get arround 5k a mission. By sharring the mission you cannot make 20k in 2 hours even if two people take place.
Now if you things of other things than the ones you right it is totally not my concearn, I didn't commend on the truth, I commended on your post.
And again. No offence but are you sure that you got enough experience about the mater to say that there is no problem with the script as it is at the moment? A few times is not enough, I have been on PD duty a few times in RS5, does it know that I know how everything in there works? No, why? Because I got no idea how for examble the AD and ASID work in RS5.
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I understand your case too, theres a lot of people that just rush in and want money, which is annoying. But then again, I can make a lot of money by just RPing too.
Honestly, this is not aimed at you or anyone else. But out of the maybe 20 calls I make a week to the FD, maybe only one responds, he comes to the scene and then leaves again since he does not see 'money' come out of it.
And for Air Division, we earn atleast -1k per day on a good day, due to our expenses and there is no way to get money for us (We do not jail suspects very often).
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I understand your case too, theres a lot of people that just rush in and want money, which is annoying. But then again, I can make a lot of money by just RPing too.
Honestly, this is not aimed at you or anyone else. But out of the maybe 20 calls I make a week to the FD, maybe only one responds, he comes to the scene and then leaves again since he does not see 'money' come out of it.
And for Air Division, we earn atleast -1k per day on a good day, due to our expenses and there is no way to get money for us (We do not jail suspects very often).
Someone should cover your expenses,I believe.
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More support on bringing the old Rs4 system Back!
(http://i60.tinypic.com/wrxc20.png)
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The problem is not within the system...it is within the people. If people would stop being greedy and abusing something that was created for fun, we wouldn't be having this conversation right now.
Still would like a clear answer to my questions especially from you, as you seem to have greatly contributed on teh creation of the system, yet you are totally against this idea.
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Still would like a clear answer to my questions especially from you, as you seem to have greatly contributed on teh creation of the system, yet you are totally against this idea.
Quite seriously, it has been HQ/Developers who ignored our suggestions and failed to allow anyone else to test the closed beta before it went live. It is not solely his fault.
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Where are you getting this information from, Pulse?
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Quite seriously, it has been HQ/Developers who ignored our suggestions and failed to allow anyone else to test the closed beta before it went live. It is not solely his fault.
Do tell, do tell.
(http://i433.photobucket.com/albums/qq59/crayzie/IMG_37327350960357_zps279208a7.jpeg)
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Do tell, do tell.
(http://i433.photobucket.com/albums/qq59/crayzie/IMG_37327350960357_zps279208a7.jpeg)
I can see the shirt is bought at ZIP! :lol:
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Quite seriously, it has been HQ/Developers who ignored our suggestions and failed to allow anyone else to test the closed beta before it went live. It is not solely his fault.
Must been a very good stone you have been sleeping under.
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Funny how many Attention of the HQ this topic got the moment it was accussed. Still I really do think that we got to find a solution to this problem.
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Funny how many Attention of the HQ this topic got the moment it was accussed. Still I really do think that we got to find a solution to this problem.
People tend to get bored of being accused and blamed for certain things when they are not true, case in point.
The public beta was open for around two months and no one magically thought that there was an issue to report to us, now suddenly HQ ignored them? :app:
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Not here to be arrogant, but the last few weeks/months of Rs4 when Rs5 was in construction, I haven't seen any invite to the server... I had the server in my favourites list and it was locked all day.
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Funny how many Attention of the HQ this topic got the moment it was accussed. Still I really do think that we got to find a solution to this problem.
Because i hadn't seen this topic before i got it linked to me.
Not here to be arrogant, but the last few weeks/months of Rs4 when Rs5 was in construction, I haven't seen any invite to the server... I had the server in my favourites list and it was locked all day.
We had an open beta for over 2 months before RS5 was released.
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Well, propably then people had many complaints about some systems and had great idea's how to improve them, propably better and more funny/teamworkwise ways to complete a firemission for example....
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Wasn't the fireman system changed since BETA ?
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Wasn't the fireman system changed since BETA ?
The salary system was changed many times
1. 5-6k for a goot 60-70%
2. Then, money was lowered
3. It became like
1 fireman present- 1k max amount
2 -2k
....
5-5k is last
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That's only money changes.....
Did realy noany player suggest the old RS4 system? (the firemission) (not the earnings)
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Look let me get this straight. I am not saying that my idea is the best. And I actually don't really like the idea of getting back to the RS4 system. I think the system needs to change though.
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Well, the thing right now is, Firemen on the ground with normal extinguishers are useless and its all about rushing to the fire with Engines right now for the most money...
This just has to change... The system AND the players need to change this with each other
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What's the point of a new server if all we're going to use is old systems?
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What's the point of a new server if all we're going to use is old systems?
I'm not saying to bring the old systems back? Just something that's more fair and requires more teamwork for equal payments and more fun!
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I'm not saying to bring the old systems back? Just something that's more fair and requires more teamwork for equal payments and more fun!
Like TiMoN says... They should bring back the old Rs4 system
:uhm:
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What's the point of a new server if all we're going to use is old systems?
That's a good but not perfect point. Some of the RS4 scripts had a very good thinking, we shouldn't totally deny them. Still I personally think that none of the two scripts should be used ... not rs4 not rs5 , we should find a new one.
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That's a good but not perfect point. Some of the RS4 scripts had a very good thinking, we shouldn't totally deny them. Still I personally think that none of the two scripts should be used ... not rs4 not rs5 , we should find a new one.
Thats the perfect Idea i've been searching the words for :cowboy:
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Ok you can script your own system
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Ok you can script your own system
I didn't expect such a useless reaction from an admin/scripter.....
We are only bringing in idea's here....
Sorry.
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Ok you can script your own system
You know that we do not want anyone to end up giving such an answer.
"We can script our own system"
It's like throwing us a rock in the face with a paper saying: You only care for yourself. No we don't, we want it to get everyone for everyone and not only for ourselves. If the Management of the server does not wish it to become better than you guys just have to let us know. Because I don't know about the others but I'd rather do something else than write long ass posts trying to find a solution for the server's problems.
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I didn't expect such a useless reaction from an admin/scripter.....
We are only bringing in idea's here....
Sorry.
Why don't you actually come up with a system that is better than the current one?
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Why don't you actually come up with a system that is better than the current one?
Is it even worth it after such answers? I mean seriously! idk sorry for trying to help!
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You tell me you want RS4's system back, that is not throwing a rock in my face? A much better idea would be to create a topic in the idea section with ways to improve the system rather than say "We want RS4 back", "No, we don't want RS4 but we don't want RS5", that is not constructive at all.
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You tell me you want RS4's system back, that is not throwing a rock in my face? A much better idea would be to create a topic in the idea section with ways to improve the system rather than say "We want RS4 back", "No, we don't want RS4 but we don't want RS5", that is not constructive at all.
I never said that I am a fan of the rs4 system. Josh did. All I said was that neither of those systems are what we should have. I said that we SHOULD put our heads down as a team and create a new more constructive and less abusable fire script. As afterall it is one of the most famous jobs in our server.
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neither of those systems are what we should have.
This is what I am talking about. This whole topic seems to be aimed at removing the system. Create a topic in the ideas section and post ideas rather than this useless topic
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1. I only said I preferred something like the rs4 system..I mean the teamwork part by that.
2. Some guys already posted some idea's on this topic and we discussed some IG..
3. We are only bringing idea's into the community.
4. Don't just say "make your own script" .. I don't even know how to script. Thats were scripters are here for.
5. Bringing idea's doesnt mean you have to put them in the game directly so dont feel like we can do better...
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1. You were clearly talking about the RS4 script at the beginning of the topic. Teamwork is not script related
2. Discussing RS4 scripts IG and having 1 other player is not discussing ideas
3. Doesn't seem like it
4. Don't shit on us and we will be nice back
5. It would help if you were posting in the right section
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Why don't you do like this: With water canon we can only do the 2 percent of the source at the time and with the extinguisher we can do 5 percent of source, so everyone will use the extinguisher and mission will take time to finish and everyone can come at the mission, and the new system will be usable like /ladders etc..
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Totally agreed with Ken. This system will encourage the team work. And there will be a lot of time to roleplay if the firemen want. And in this system there will be a role of Medics to heal wounded Firemen.
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I didn't expect such a useless reaction from an admin/scripter.....
We are only bringing in idea's here....
Sorry.
That's funny. Last time I checked, 99%+ of useless posts and reactions came from people who are complaining about the current state of script, bugs, and ideas, while none of them raised a finger or gave a f**k when we had an Open Beta for more than 2 months.
Admins and scripters are humans too. Just like you, we get annoyed by lag, frustrated by rulebreakers, and excited by new features and bugfixes. So do not expect us to smile perfectly at people who point fingers and complain that we haven't been doing any work for them, when the opposite is true.
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That's funny. Last time I checked, 99%+ of useless posts and reactions came from people who are complaining about the current state of script, bugs, and ideas, while none of them raised a finger or gave a f**k when we had an Open Beta for more than 2 months.
Wasn't the fireman system changed sine Beta ?
Reading at Ken's post, maybe we should just equal the percentages a fire truck and a extinguisher extinguish. Add a few choppers so people can use ranchers and choppers as well.
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What's the problem of wanting an old - teamwork related system back? Or something like it.
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What's the problem of wanting an old - teamwork related system back? Or something like it.
Why do we need old? The new system is scripted for a reason?
It is up to developers+ If they want to change it or not, you could post this as a idea.
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Why do we need old? The new system is scripted for a reason?
This topic started with the statement that the new system needs to be adjusted a bit so it will be fair for other fireman to have an equal payment...
People in-game are saying they liked something like the old rs4 system.. If you are playing as a fireman for a while you will start to understand the complaint.
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There's just a whole lack of RP in the system because of the fact that's its about rushing to the fire, SAPD tried to do something with Bike escorts to the fire but firemen still kept rushing to the fire without telling SAPD the location for the escort...
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This topic started with the statement that the new system needs to be adjusted a bit so it will be fair for other fireman to have an equal payment...
People in-game are saying they liked something like the old rs4 system.. If you are playing as a fireman for a while you will start to understand the complaint.
I have been a fireman for much time and the system isn't bad? and about the equal payment, there shouldn't be grades in real life of jobs? and everyone get equal payment?
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I have been a fireman for much time and the system isn't bad? and about the equal payment, there shouldn't be grades in real life of jobs? and everyone get equal payment?
IRL: 1 fireman doesn't get 100$ per month and another gets 5000$ per month (by that I mean Mission)
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IRL: 1 fireman doesn't get 100$ per month and another gets 5000$ per month (by that I mean Mission)
Oh what? and IRL, a fireman who reaches first at mission doesn't wait for all to come at mission and let all the civilians/things burn out? and by this way everyone get the share of mission? No.
If the system should be like real life then everyone should get a monthly payment but Let's do not take this as real life, just as a game who reaches first at mission has fully rights to start dousing the mission and that's all, nothing bad in the system It is all about the luck, except the lazyness that who reaches first at the mission can start doing the mission, but still mission ends in a short time, for this I agree with Ken's idea.
Why don't you do like this: With water canon we can only do the 2 percent of the source at the time and with the extinguisher we can do 5 percent of source, so everyone will use the extinguisher and mission will take time to finish and everyone can come at the mission, and the new system will be usable like /ladders etc..
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If they can't change it to the old RS4 mission system... They should At least make more firesources and bigger missions that take a longer time to Extinguish
By "The old rs4 system" I didn't realy mean the System completely copied back to Rs5 but, Something just what requires RP and Teamwork instead of spraying the fire for a few seconds and moving up to the next one, we got ladders now.. I haven't seen anyone get the chance to use them because of all the engines.
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There's just a whole lack of RP in the system because of the fact that's its about rushing to the fire, SAPD tried to do something with Bike escorts to the fire but firemen still kept rushing to the fire without telling SAPD the location for the escort...
Remember guys, you are here, in Argonath RPG SA:MP, for ROLEPLAYING and for FUN. Money is the second priority. If the script is encouraging RP in any way, I would thoroughly agree with it. Since we have brought in a new era called "RS5", we will not and should not go back to the past. Face the problem. I am not blaming anybody but everyone's support is required.
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Just had a mission, we discussed how to play fairly.
Firemen waited for the other ones before starting to spray!
This is a vision that we can change the system by ourselfves to encourage teamwork....
Guess, closing this topic right now is the best thing?
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Solved, easy
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Sorry for all the commotion! :dead:
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Guess, closing this topic right now is the best thing?
No
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No
Its only being seen as moaning I guess.
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Its only being seen as moaning I guess.
Still interested Josh? After the previous SF experience ?
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Still interested Josh? After the previous SF experience ?
I'm always interrested in some changes....
But, Just had a mission, we discussed how to play fairly.
Firemen waited for the other ones before starting to spray!
This is a vision that we can change the system by ourselfves to encourage teamwork....
Guess, closing this topic right now is the best thing?
If the firemen could keep it up, it would be fine as it is...
But No.... last mission, the firemen totaly changed again, didn't say any location again, rushed towards it, started ramming each other...
This is just a huge failure again.
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Only a bit unfair.
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Greed destroys roleplay. Simple as that.
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The firemen script is perfect in my opinion, but it just doesn't in the server.. since the reset, everyone is looking more for some cash then roleplay and the script is mostly based on earning money, thats why people rush towards the mission and try to extinguish fires as much as they can before other firemen arrive which is sad.
just give 500$ or 1k for every fireman joining the mission and it will be fine
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Guys you are missing a big point here. No this topic is not for moaning. This topic is to create something better. I don't like this script for one single reason. It lets it to the firemen to decide how to act, and this is wrong. Yes the firemen can make this script work well. Infact every fucked up script out there can work almost perfectly if the players want.
The thing is that I see one thing in this script for which many others were denied. It is very easily abused. I mean seriously, every single individual can fuck it up in his own way. That's why we need a new one, and not because it has no Teamwork and so on, the RS4 script didn't have teamwork either, wanna know why? Because I alone could finish almost any mission out there. It just needed skill for an individual to finish a whole mission alone, while this one needs fairly less skill.
Anyway, I will probably today start a new idea topic about a new system. Hopefully the community itself will manage to make a better system than the one we got. Gandalf is wise and has good ideas, but this one was probably not the one he should come up with.
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Called fire service today cause I was stuck on the top of a big sign. 10 firemen on duty. None responded :D
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Called fire service today cause I was stuck on the top of a big sign. 10 firemen on duty. None responded :D
Like it or not most firemen including me join the duty mainly for the income. Now if the system could asure them that they can also do other things between the missions, it was morelikely that one of them would proceed to your call and hurry in order to get his part in the upcomming mission.
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Like it or not most firemen including me join the duty mainly for the income. Now if the system could asure them that they can also do other things between the missions, it was morelikely that one of them would proceed to your call and hurry in order to get his part in the upcomming mission.
Yes that would solve it.
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Just had a mission, we discussed how to play fairly.
Firemen waited for the other ones before starting to spray!
This is a vision that we can change the system by ourselfves to encourage teamwork....
I was active as a fireman until the properties came back (as I had to focus on ARISE, and eventually, admin duties). We did this just about every mission, and it unexpectedly became one of the things that inspired me to go on duty.
Like it or not most firemen including me join the duty mainly for the income. Now if the system could asure them that they can also do other things between the missions, it was morelikely that one of them would proceed to your call and hurry in order to get his part in the upcomming mission.
Script duties and income will always be inseparable, unless you move money and the necessity to use it.
What the current system needs right now, aside from something else for firemen to do, are additional safeguards.
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Greed destroys roleplay. Simple as that.
Yes, but what about the script.
It favors the most greedy and the most fast one to reach there. If HQ can't encourage role play in FD script, we get accustomed to only money factor.
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Just had a mission, we discussed how to play fairly.
Firemen waited for the other ones before starting to spray!
This is a vision that we can change the system by ourselfves to encourage teamwork....
Guess, closing this topic right now is the best thing?
Make sure that everyone want to teamwork...lol
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Make sure that everyone want to teamwork...lol
They all supported the idea's. Like, waiting for each other before starting to spray etc.
But then the other firemen came online and it was a hell again
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They all supported the idea's. Like, waiting for each other before starting to spray etc.
But then the other firemen came online and it was a hell again
Greed destroys roleplay. Simple as that.
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Yes, but what about the script.
It favors the most greedy and the most fast one to reach there. If HQ can't encourage role play in FD script, we get accustomed to only money factor.
There is nothing wrong with the script, it is the players.
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There is,
The person who reaches there fast gets the maximum money
Keeping this factor in mind, he would use clever tricks to misguide others.
Rp can be done b/w missions but getting back on topic, script doesn't favour teamwork
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The flaw with the current "teamwork" is that it becomes much harder to maintain the more firemen are online, especially in times when fire duty floods with more "new" firemen.
Something that could help would be changing the earnings-percentage ratio so that it is affected by how many firemen are on duty. For example, a fireman could earn $5000 for doing 50% on a fire when there are 2 firemen, and earn $2,500 for doing $5 percent on a fire when there are 20 firemen. However, the maximum possible earning will still be the same for both.
Of course, the other jobs must be boosted as well or the imbalance among jobs will continue.
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For example, a fireman could earn $5000 for doing 50% on a fire when there are 2 firemen, and earn $2,500 for doing $5 percent on a fire when there are 20 firemen.
This will only increase greed. Why would a fireman opt for teamwork if he could 100# and earn more?
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This will only increase greed. Why would a fireman opt for teamwork if he could 100# and earn more?
Was editing my post. One way to discourage the greed would be your maximum earning (regardless of percentage) being the same regardless of the amount of firemen, pretty much like now.
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I took the time to create an idea topic on the idea board. As they think that this is not the right place everyone is free to post his ideas there or even better commends on mine and add something better. It is an open discussion for every one with a worthfull post to use.
http://www.argonathrpg.eu/index.php?topic=105525.msg1677080#msg1677080
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To those who keep asking me to clarify my responses, Emmett pretty much summed it up.
There is nothing wrong with the script, it is the players.
It does not matter how you make the system. Players are the sole reason why it keeps failing. No matter how fancy or advanced things may be, players will always find a way to abuse it if given the chance.
If you guys want a solution to this common problem, don't look at the scripts. Look at each other. Look at your friends. Start thinking of ways to change player attitude. Think about how you can curb this negativity in the field. Try to come up with ways we can punish those who purposely refuse to let others enjoy their fun, and ways we can reward those who assist others, causing them to thrive.
Just like with politics...no matter how perfect of a system you may have, it only takes the corruption of a single person to bring the entire thing to its knees. In our case, the corruption lies within players' greed and self-centeredness.
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To those who keep asking me to clarify my responses, Emmett pretty much summed it up.
It does not matter how you make the system. Players are the sole reason why it keeps failing. No matter how fancy or advanced things may be, players will always find a way to abuse it if given the chance.
If you guys want a solution to this common problem, don't look at the scripts. Look at each other. Look at your friends. Start thinking of ways to change player attitude. Think about how you can curb this negativity in the field. Try to come up with ways we can punish those who purposely refuse to let others enjoy their fun, and ways we can reward those who assist others, causing them to thrive.
Just like with politics...no matter how perfect of a system you may have, it only takes the corruption of a single person to bring the entire thing to its knees. In our case, the corruption lies within players' greed and self-centeredness.
You are not completely wrong, yet the current system is easily abusable. It's like crying for having your car taken but never ever removing the keys from the ignition. This system simply has its weak points at plain sight and that's why i think that we need a new one.
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You are not completely wrong, yet the current system is easily abusable. It's like crying for having your car taken but never ever removing the keys from the ignition. This system simply has its weak points at plain sight and that's why i think that we need a new one.
The system itself could use some improvement, that is true. But with the right players, any system becomes easily exploitable and prone to abuse.
That's why players make the best betatesters, because they are the best abusers.
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You are not completely wrong, yet the current system is easily abusable. It's like crying for having your car taken but never ever removing the keys from the ignition. This system simply has its weak points at plain sight and that's why i think that we need a new one.
That is incorrect. The amount from which it can be abused is not the reason why it is abused in the first place. Although I agree that we should prevent the abuse in scripted form also, the cause of the problem we are discussing is nothing more than greedy players. Take away the abusive player issue, and you won't have the system being abused.
Now I understand in the real world it is impossible to prevent every single abusive user, which is where script abuse would be handled directly, but the problems we have today never should have gotten to this point to begin with...and that is a problem created by the players, not the scripts. This issue existed long since before SA:MP RS5, or even the FF career choice. Anyone remember the issues we had with Freecops/ARPD Officers?
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Well said, but by just sitting here and says that it is all on the players, which is for sure right. Why not to try to make something less abusive? With more scripted limits maybe, or I don't know. All I know is that by admitting that something is abusable you don't stop people from abusing it.
And again. Many ideas were denied for being easily abusable. Why not work out this one aswell?>
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Greed destroys roleplay. Simple as that.
(http://i59.tinypic.com/kd71i0.png)