Argonath RPG - A World of its own

Argonath RPG Community => Forum and site ideas and information => Topic started by: Teddy on April 10, 2016, 03:14:33 am

Title: Reputation take 2
Post by: Teddy on April 10, 2016, 03:14:33 am
Hi,

We've added a new reputation system that actually shows who is giving rep and negative rep. For those of you cry babies, you can also hide your reputation publicly.

Changes:

- This is per post and you need to add a comment to why you are voting that specific way.
- You need to have reputation power to perform reputation actions.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Salmonella on April 10, 2016, 03:28:25 am
Is this also an experiment?

If not, the function seems unnecessary and useless, unlike the emoticon stuff you added. I like the concept of giving likes/respect to POSTS -not users- on certain forums but in this community even that will only serve to personify grudges, hatred and ''negativism''.  :neutral2:
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Axison on April 10, 2016, 03:32:54 am
Considering changing the forum theme too?
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Teddy on April 10, 2016, 03:33:45 am
This is something I would like to keep based on user input on the last experiment. This is "per post" but collective for the poster.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Teddy on April 10, 2016, 03:34:22 am
Considering changing the forum theme too?

I would love too =)
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Salmonella on April 10, 2016, 03:38:05 am
The collective thing doesn't really serve a good purpose, though. What use does ''Teddy has no influence'', or ''Axis is looked down upon'' have next to people's profiles? What do you want users to do with this? Do you want them to aim for better rep, please a certain crowd that gives it out by making posts filled with popular opinions? Is this to do away counterweight to certain topics in the community like Monte was doing in the other topic?

Lots of stuff comes to mind but to say I see any good aspect of it would be a lie.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Teddy on April 10, 2016, 03:42:16 am
I believe with a good balance we can use this to really begin to separate the trolls from the legitimate users of this forum. The way it is setup, those who want to simply use this to troll and abuse won't get far with it. Only reputable people can actually contribute to this system.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Salmonella on April 10, 2016, 03:54:22 am
How?

How would you define 'legitimate users of this forum' by their use of this function? Is there such a thing as an illegitimate opinion on Argonath forum posts? What would trolling with this system consist of and who are really ''reputable people'' in this community? The ones online enough to get a ''veteran'' status? What kind of consequences will those who give negative rep to someone for no clear reason, where there may be a very good one, face? Will the forum administration actually keep up with everything that's going on in this oh so vivid, multi-platform community to be able to effectively judge what's legitimate and what's ''trolling''?

No, what happens is people are going to look at someone's profile, see they have a low or high reputation and with that, draw some sort of a conclusion about them based on that, depending on who it is and what kind of relation the two in this scenario have. It helps to fuel a very human character trait; prejudice.

Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Teddy on April 10, 2016, 04:01:30 am
How?

How would you define 'legitimate users of this forum' by their use of this function? Is there such a thing as an illegitimate opinion on Argonath forum posts? What would trolling with this system consist of and who are really ''reputable people'' in this community? The ones online enough to get a ''veteran'' status? What kind of consequences will those who give negative rep to someone for no clear reason, where there may be a very good one, face? Will the forum administration actually keep up with everything that's going on in this oh so vivid, multi-platform community to be able to effectively judge what's legitimate and what's ''trolling''?

No, what happens is people are going to look at someone's profile, see they have a low or high reputation and with that, draw some sort of a conclusion about them based on that, depending on who it is and what kind of relation the two in this scenario have. It helps to fuel a very human character trait; prejudice.

We'll see how the community feels about it before making any more choices. I am totally fine with people using their reputation to determine credibility of a poster. This also isn't a matter of opinions as opposed to people who just spread and talk shit without any signification contributions. Not per-say trolls, but people who don't add to the value of conversation or do just run around trolling.

We will deal with consequences of those who give negative rep without legitimate reason. We will ensure the forum staff is aware of the responsibility and actually enforces it.

Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Conk on April 10, 2016, 04:15:09 am
If we can downvote users, we should be able to downvote topics... like this one  :gand:
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Teddy on April 10, 2016, 04:17:30 am
I've added a poll, people can share their opinion on it there.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Salmonella on April 10, 2016, 04:18:32 am
How is it not a matter of opinion, though? Should those giving out reputation points look at posts objectively and somehow determine if they're worthy of a point regardless of how they feel about it?

Determining one's credibility using a system like this can be extremely deceiving. That's one lesson the previous 'take' on this system taught us.

Definitions of trolling differ just as much as definitions of contributions. I think all voices should be heard, however contrarian, anti-establishment or pleasing to one's ass they may be and this implementation gives a whole dimension to the kinds of sounds we'll be hearing on the forum from now on. It's not gonna be very diverse I'm afraid.

I understood that things will be dealt with, I was just wondering how, since without a proper understanding of the entire social cohesion in Argonath that's gonna be nothing but double-sided razors and rectifications.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: [NP]Monte Montague on April 10, 2016, 08:46:39 am
I voted no.
This reputation system is just pleading to be abused & will encourage bad girly high school politics into Argonath RPG.

"Oh that guy has like 100 reps... he is like... big cajones and all... We should totally give him hugs & kisses"
"Oh look that cunt has -100 (hopefully you will all vote me down so I can be the first with -100 :D and be special), fuck him and everything about him, you know what? we should go and tell him hes worthless and he should fuck off; clearly the reputation system tells us its ok "

I'd say a vote no on this poll equates to a vote yes in the fight against bullying, prejudice, hatred, and fear mongering.  But hey ho we will see that in the way people vote.

We don't want Community where hatred and discrimination is justifiable and I think that allowing this will just cause more harm then any possible good.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: hunteD. on April 10, 2016, 09:00:01 am
I'm voting No



In my eyes it's useless and it will be abused a lot, they'll tell their friends to go give them +rep or give someone else -rep for no reason, It's useless and in my eyes it will turn into a bullying lol. Some people can't handle getting this shit on them, people will spam skype's and such to give -rep to their enemies. It's literally useless and time wasting. Loads of groups that are rivals will flood eachother with -rep.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Leon. on April 10, 2016, 09:18:50 am
No.

I believe people here should form their opinions on others by themselves, not based off of what other people say about them - which is in this case is in the form of positive or negative reputation. Not to mention favoritism/bias, one-upping, so on...
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: TrotlDebilni on April 10, 2016, 09:21:49 am
I can be the first with -100 :D and be special
Don't worry Monte, you will always be special in my eyes.

How is it not a matter of opinion, though? Should those giving out reputation points look at posts objectively and somehow determine if they're worthy of a point regardless of how they feel about it?

Determining one's credibility using a system like this can be extremely deceiving. That's one lesson the previous 'take' on this system taught us.


Well it's a matter of opinion because you can always look past these rep points and ignore them since they are useless internet points (just like the money in RS4).

The only issue that exists is people not really knowing how to use them, on other forums people get +rep when they do something helpful, and -rep when they do something stupid (may it be begging for points, or whatever Monte just did), here the points are very opinionated, people +rep their friends and people like Teddy, who work on the site like insane, but -rep the people they dislike, like Devin if he denied their unban appeal, or an admin that warned them.

I think the rep system is a great idea, because it gives an insight on who is contributing to the community, it's just that people here aren't using it for that, so maybe adding a comments function will fix it.

For example, you deserve +rep for what you just said because it was well written and it contributed to the discussion.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: eymas on April 10, 2016, 09:51:10 am
The misuse cannot be avoided but you can trust the staff team to combat any abuse of it.

Furthermore, if this system is to stay, then we do need to be vigilant on said prejudgments and conspiracies. For instance I can expect monte to get negativity thrown at him even if he has a perfectly constructed argument against a change on whatever. Because men like to follow the bandwagon and pick on him because he made himself a target in the past/present.

I'm neutral on the poll; can't vote yes/no because it's the people that will form the reason to vote. If the community uses it proper, then it can stay. If not, then not.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Huntsman on April 10, 2016, 10:46:30 am
Well, my negativity fell from -18 to -14 out of the blue. Just like it rose out of the blue  :lol: . I can't really be arsed to care at this point. I'm neutral.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Kaze on April 10, 2016, 10:47:08 am
I voted yes because I find it funny.

In all seriousness no, it's pointless. Am I meant to hang a rope around my neck because I am not liked by 8 people? This community still have minors which can not control their emotions as much as the olders and veterans can. I can see chaos with this.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Stivi on April 10, 2016, 10:56:01 am
Where do I see who voted and why?
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Huntsman on April 10, 2016, 11:14:31 am
How do I even vote?  :rofl:
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: eymas on April 10, 2016, 11:16:42 am
Where do I see who voted and why?
And what would you do with the people that voted then?
Pretty sure those who voted negative upon you will get a personal vendetta from you then  :lol:

Which is the exact reason why it would be hidden.

How do I even vote?  :rofl:
So far there's a heart button on everyone's "profile" on the left of each post.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Sweeper on April 10, 2016, 11:30:44 am
- For those of you cry babies, you can also hide your reputation publicly.
- This is per post and you need to add a comment to why you are voting that specific way.
- You need to have reputation power to perform reputation actions.

The wishes of our babies have now been met, and guess what... Still crying about their virtual reputation.

Keep the system.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Gandalf on April 10, 2016, 11:38:23 am
I never chyecked in to the systems since a year or 5 ago, but with the release of SMF 2 there was a system that did not alllow negative reputation, meaning it is only possible to give a positive mark.
While I see such systems more as a popularity contest as a genuine way to see if someone is a valuable contributor, removing the negative will at least keep everyone above 0.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Kaze on April 10, 2016, 11:40:55 am
What do the different color codes mean? Some people have blue, red etc
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: [NP]Monte Montague on April 10, 2016, 02:00:01 pm
I never chyecked in to the systems since a year or 5 ago, but with the release of SMF 2 there was a system that did not alllow negative reputation, meaning it is only possible to give a positive mark.
While I see such systems more as a popularity contest as a genuine way to see if someone is a valuable contributor, removing the negative will at least keep everyone above 0.

I believe in that case it would defeat the purpose as to why it was added.
It seems like the attempt of a pursuit of consensus for the justification of some modus operandi against certain people whilst the existence of substance for the justification could be lacking... Let's also just disregard the fact that sometimes some just hate for the sake of hate, or that grudges are genuinely regarded as sound reasoning for persecution. So even if it went one way if anything it'd just give justification for someone with a bigger e-dick to say something to another person and get away with it whilst the victim who may be considered by some as a bitch is unable to make the same sort of comment in return without facing serious backlash for not being accepted as part of the clique. You know... #Argonath ?

Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Gandalf on April 10, 2016, 02:03:45 pm
I believe in that case it would defeat the purpose as to why it was added.
It seems like the attempt of a pursuit of consensus for the justification of some modus operandi against certain people whilst the existence of substance for the justification could be lacking (let's just disregard the fact that sometimes some just hate for the sake of hate, or that grudges are genuinely regarded as sound reasoning for persecution).
That seems to be your idea. In reality is is just a way to see if some people are seen as more cridible than others.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Huntsman on April 10, 2016, 02:04:22 pm
I believe in that case it would defeat the purpose as to why it was added.
It seems like the attempt of a pursuit of consensus for the justification of some modus operandi against certain people whilst the existence of substance for the justification could be lacking (let's just disregard the fact that sometimes some just hate for the sake of hate, or that grudges are genuinely regarded as sound reasoning for persecution).

....
....
What?
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Devin on April 10, 2016, 02:26:21 pm
I believe in that case it would defeat the purpose as to why it was added.
It seems like the attempt of a pursuit of consensus for the justification of some modus operandi against certain people whilst the existence of substance for the justification could be lacking (let's just disregard the fact that sometimes some just hate for the sake of hate, or that grudges are genuinely regarded as sound reasoning for persecution).

The contemplation based on the complication of your vocabulary is extraordinary I wish I could write sentences in outstandingly long paragraphs that hold no value but I prefer to get to the point. The perspective of the community when one creates a nonsense post is often the same which in the overall mindset of the world obama because potato and potassium cohesion.

Your justification is rather flawed when you say the purpose of the system is defeated when you personally run around trying to get the most negative votes when you don't even have to try to be brutally honest. The comprehension of your request for negative votes is somewhat senseless but every person for their own fetish.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: TiMoN on April 10, 2016, 02:32:48 pm
gonna make a new account and rep my posts so i become most popular person in argonath
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Toreto on April 10, 2016, 02:42:22 pm
at least negative vote should be removed.
only ( +1 ) will be nice, as if there is something helpful you can vote "+"
if its not just leave it.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: TrotlDebilni on April 10, 2016, 02:54:39 pm
What do the different color codes mean? Some people have blue, red etc
If you hover over it, it tells you, for example everyone can see you are hiding your reputation, green means it is above 0, red means it is below 0. blue? Haven't seen it yet.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: [NP]Monte Montague on April 10, 2016, 03:01:27 pm
That seems to be your idea. In reality is is just a way to see if some people are seen as more cridible than others.
That could be the case but perhaps its also evident that people just would still think someone with a bigger e-penis is better all round, and when that person with the biggest e-penis gets a bigger ego, they also then forget humility and such.
If it were possible to see every up-vote a person got and why for the public then maybe they can make the informed decision on who is credible and who isn't without delving into the school ground "he's a cunt, a bad girl, fuck dat, I do dis.

Donald Trump is getting all the votes with the Latinos, with the blacks, etc etc, but when it comes down to it, he has no strategy, he has no real plan, it's just one of fear mongering, hatred on others, and "we're great aren't we?" "we have a good time huh?". Argonath could build the best wall with the best new immigration policies but that doesn't necessarily mean it will work. The fact that even if a third of people from the result of the poll do not find the idea as one of positive, a third is still a powerful part. Total consensus or see bust.

A person could pay a pretty penny to quickly become Argonaths' most reputable person. Means jack shit when it comes to the real world where its reliant on the actual substance and not a few charts on the persons credibility.

Argonath does not need cliques and pursuit of controversial things just to raise attention of people, this reputation system was avoided before because of the knowledge of the rampant abuse that could come from it. At-least people will be above 0, yes, but inflation and deflation of the value of $1 could perhaps be significant? no? Someone has 10000 rep points because he is good at drawing stuff and thus he becomes a genius over night and the peoples tzar when he posts in a topic like this.

Personally not against encouraging people to feel good about themselves but when it means you risk making others feel down then its not worth it, unless it is VIP members club and not a Community.

Read what Eymas said. People will be quick to not focus on the substance and just get caught in politics.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: .James on April 10, 2016, 03:05:00 pm
Idk why yall still discussing about it, just vote and it will be decided by the majority whether to keep it or not, and if you dont like it just dont use or do anything related to it, dont just complain about anything and just be thankful
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Killanic on April 10, 2016, 03:06:04 pm
No.

I believe people here should form their opinions on others by themselves, not based off of what other people say about them - which is in this case is in the form of positive or negative reputation. Not to mention favoritism/bias, one-upping, so on...
Agreed, voted no.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Norrage on April 10, 2016, 03:07:00 pm
and just be thankful

For?
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Devin on April 10, 2016, 03:09:41 pm
For?

For popcorn!

(http://www.junkmail.co.za/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/popcorn-machine.jpg)
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: [NP]Monte Montague on April 10, 2016, 03:13:08 pm
For popcorn!

(http://www.junkmail.co.za/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/popcorn-machine.jpg)

Fuck that shit, it gets stuck in your teeth. I prefer chewing on chalk sticks =D

Idk why yall still discussing about it, just vote and it will be decided by the majority whether to keep it or not, and if you dont like it just dont use or do anything related to it, dont just complain about anything and just be thankful

Oh heavenly Sauron for art thou in Middle Earth...
Sometimes discussion may be too much for some but some are constantly looking to learn and discuss. It's what communities do dude. When it becomes petty and people point scoring against each other, then there are issues. But once again, Oh heavenly Sauron for art thou in Middle Earth. Keep us on the right path. The holy path. The path of the elvish and not the orcs. The path from where the great legends once wondered.

For?
Rejoice! For his name is Sauron.

No.

I believe people here should form their opinions on others by themselves, not based off of what other people say about them - which is in this case is in the form of positive or negative reputation. Not to mention favoritism/bias, one-upping, so on...
Also this.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: DinoKid23 on April 10, 2016, 03:18:13 pm
For popcorn!

(http://www.junkmail.co.za/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/popcorn-machine.jpg)

bruh
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Marcel on April 10, 2016, 03:20:37 pm
I believe the users' actions reflect his/her reputation, not a number. Based on that, I voted for the removal of such a system entirely.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: spn1725 on April 10, 2016, 03:21:28 pm

No.
How would you define 'legitimate users of this forum' by their use of this function? Is there such a thing as an illegitimate opinion on Argonath forum posts? What would trolling with this system consist of and who are really ''reputable people'' in this community? The ones online enough to get a ''veteran'' status? What kind of consequences will those who give negative rep to someone for no clear reason, where there may be a very good one, face? Will the forum administration actually keep up with everything that's going on in this oh so vivid, multi-platform community to be able to effectively judge what's legitimate and what's ''trolling''?

No, what happens is people are going to look at someone's profile, see they have a low or high reputation and with that, draw some sort of a conclusion about them based on that, depending on who it is and what kind of relation the two in this scenario have. It helps to fuel a very human character trait; prejudice.


Also that might not just stop trolls, but will scare minority to express their own opinion every other day, just not to be downvoted by majority.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Mikal on April 10, 2016, 03:40:48 pm
just not to be downvoted by majority.
Is it just me, or is there no down vote button? :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Salmonella on April 10, 2016, 03:44:19 pm
Also that might not just stop trolls, but will scare minority to express their own opinion every other day, just not to be downvoted by majority.

Yeah exactly, like I said, a new dimension to ''freedom of speech''.
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: [NP]Monte Montague on April 10, 2016, 03:55:06 pm
"Voting closes: 24 April 2016, 03:16:56"

 :uhm: Two weeks huh?
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Jeremy. on April 10, 2016, 04:23:35 pm
No.

Also that might not just stop trolls, but will scare minority to express their own opinion every other day, just not to be downvoted by majority.
Since when it's wrong to fucking state your opinion?
Title: Re: Reputation take 2
Post by: Teddy on April 10, 2016, 04:31:09 pm
Based on overwhelming disapproval, will remove the system now.
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