Well sirs, I hope for the success of the server, hence my ideas. Irrespective of what i believe is best, if the servers are teeming with people, we will all be most happy.
I back you completely for all your efforts and thank you.
Community leadership is active along with development of the new MTA SA server. I made a 27 page concept that is currently getting reviewed by people in the staff channel to make sure there isn't anything missed or thought about. This is not busy work, this is necessary so we don't fuck up. Player feedback during development will also be asked for as we get further into it. The SAMP server isn't going to be continued to be developed as the MTA SA server is meant to replace it with a new experience led by players and their creativity in San Andreas. We will look for player organizers or role models to help organize groups and get their input on what players enjoy. And what we need to improve on.Thing is, you may focus on MTA SA, but I'm talking about me alone here, I'm not very fond of that idea. Specially over SA:MP, and I know you have reasonable arguments but on a personal level, I'd still prefer SA:MP to MTA:SA. Many making topics about SAMP only want SAMP to return, that's why they're trying for it.
About the 16th Birthday event, there will be a final SAMP update released that will cover some bug fixes and some event content. Other than that, the focus is on MTA SA. MTA SA is not going to be anything like SAMP and should be considered a brand new server while keeping certain cultural elements like properties and maps.
Change that means anything won't happen quickly. My announcement topic will be released behind schedule but will feature the overall concept of the MTA SA server, the final update to SAMP and a RS4 server summer release. If anyone would like to chat with me about where we are heading, contact me on Discord.
Well if you like samp why aren't you active on it right now and contribute to reviving it? It's the perfect timing to have friends in to create a group and grow up quickly since activity is so low, what stops you from joining now? Genuinly asking.Community leadership is active along with development of the new MTA SA server. I made a 27 page concept that is currently getting reviewed by people in the staff channel to make sure there isn't anything missed or thought about. This is not busy work, this is necessary so we don't fuck up. Player feedback during development will also be asked for as we get further into it. The SAMP server isn't going to be continued to be developed as the MTA SA server is meant to replace it with a new experience led by players and their creativity in San Andreas. We will look for player organizers or role models to help organize groups and get their input on what players enjoy. And what we need to improve on.Thing is, you may focus on MTA SA, but I'm talking about me alone here, I'm not very fond of that idea. Specially over SA:MP, and I know you have reasonable arguments but on a personal level, I'd still prefer SA:MP to MTA:SA. Many making topics about SAMP only want SAMP to return, that's why they're trying for it.
About the 16th Birthday event, there will be a final SAMP update released that will cover some bug fixes and some event content. Other than that, the focus is on MTA SA. MTA SA is not going to be anything like SAMP and should be considered a brand new server while keeping certain cultural elements like properties and maps.
Change that means anything won't happen quickly. My announcement topic will be released behind schedule but will feature the overall concept of the MTA SA server, the final update to SAMP and a RS4 server summer release. If anyone would like to chat with me about where we are heading, contact me on Discord.
Hi Hammer_Prefer SA:MP client better, and overall have memories attached to SAMP that can’t be replaced by MTA or any other, just too attached to SAMP in a way you can say. The only thing I’d give SAMP up for is V:MP, but that’s that.
I'm keen to know - why do you want SAMP alone? Why not MTA SA? I mean, as long as you have active players to play with, any version should be good right?
What stops me from joining is pointlessly driving around, with no one who would wanna join. Trust me, I reached out to multiple people, and most of them said “it’s a shitty server, the management sucks and won’t let you do what you wanna with your creative ideas” that’s just a brief summary, but yes I’d prefer SA:MP over MTA:SA, but it’s like you’re shooting yourself in the foot by saying why don’t you join? What difference does it make by me joining, 4/5 of us make these topics, we go in-game, hopelessly drive around and do nothing. I deleted every single game from my laptop some time ago cause of exams, now that they’re over I downloaded SAMP again but still, I’d rather go out with my friends than drive around in a server that’s got 0 players. Even if it’s 5 of us, no one’s gonna join just becsuse they see 5 players. You’re a manager, why don’t you join?
What stops me from joining is pointlessly driving around, with no one who would wanna join. Trust me, I reached out to multiple people, and most of them said “it’s a shitty server, the management sucks and won’t let you do what you wanna with your creative ideas” that’s just a brief summary, but yes I’d prefer SA:MP over MTA:SA, but it’s like you’re shooting yourself in the foot by saying why don’t you join? What difference does it make by me joining, 4/5 of us make these topics, we go in-game, hopelessly drive around and do nothing. I deleted every single game from my laptop some time ago cause of exams, now that they’re over I downloaded SAMP again but still, I’d rather go out with my friends than drive around in a server that’s got 0 players. Even if it’s 5 of us, no one’s gonna join just becsuse they see 5 players. You’re a manager, why don’t you join?
I quit development of the SAMP server due to how awful it is to develop for the platform. I got burnt out. I don't find it fair to call the management awful when there isn't anyone left. JDC and I tried to bring some life to the server that worked for a while but JDC had real life issues and I got burnt out. To me, the server isn't interesting and doesn't hold up nowadays. That is why the MTA SA server is being made. It allows for creative ideas to work easier and better. An idea I have been in love with which was suggested for the SAMP server was towable trailer homes and I would like to see those act like properties. Alot is possible in SAMP but I think we have been trying to "save" this server for like 4 years. This is why we are moving forward with MTA SA. MTA SA is a better client that will allow us to develop better and easier along with possibly recruiting new players that are interested in an English rpg server. I'm hoping for something new and interesting. I tried my shot at the Argonath SAMP server, it's time to move on.
What stops me from joining is pointlessly driving around, with no one who would wanna join. Trust me, I reached out to multiple people, and most of them said “it’s a shitty server, the management sucks and won’t let you do what you wanna with your creative ideas” that’s just a brief summary, but yes I’d prefer SA:MP over MTA:SA, but it’s like you’re shooting yourself in the foot by saying why don’t you join? What difference does it make by me joining, 4/5 of us make these topics, we go in-game, hopelessly drive around and do nothing. I deleted every single game from my laptop some time ago cause of exams, now that they’re over I downloaded SAMP again but still, I’d rather go out with my friends than drive around in a server that’s got 0 players. Even if it’s 5 of us, no one’s gonna join just becsuse they see 5 players.What do you think though are they correct? Is the server shitty as they say? Does the management really sucks? If you think they are wrong by your personal opinion from what you see on forum, discord and also (this should be obvious lol) on the server and not an opinion influenced by someone else, haven't you thought of changing their opinions towards the server or the community as all? If no, don't you think that's just being lazy by throwing shit at HQ and blaming them for it?
You’re a manager, why don’t you join?I am not a manager. I am 25 years old, I don't play any games because of my software architecture engineering degree.
Argo SAMP failed due to poor leadership. But I was keen to know what aspect of poor leadership caused it.Over the years on SAMP we've had numerous people "lead", many filled the role just because they were friends with others or because they filled certain roles in the server while they had no leadership or management qualities, causing positions to be filled by people unqualified, and at times caused the server to turn in to a dictatorship. At other times those that did provide positively to the server and brought stability in their position as leader/ manager were being pushed out by people above them (or at times by people below them that spread lies at a chance to get power out of the hands of others) which in turn caused the positions to just be filled for the sake of having people in the role. It caused a decline in server stability and in turn caused the player base to slowly deplete.
Why were some decisions taken the way they were? What was the need to reset properties for each update? Why are some admin decisions skewed in favor of certain group?
So make it like real life. Elect the server leaders. The players elect the Division Chief and Managers. The Division Chief and the Manager select administration etc. If the players are not happy with administration, the results show in the next election which may be held annually. One important thing - No more than one Division Chief or Manager can be from the same clan / group, from the announcement of their candidature to their exit from the post.This is something I personally disagree with, I don't think players choosing staff positions is healthy for the server as it causes people that might not want to fill a role, or just do so to fill the power position (Which has been a huge issue in previous eras of the SAMP server). I'd much rather see those interested to step forward to leadership and present us with why they'd be good to fill those positions. People are free to do so in groups and of course people are free to recommend others for a position (preferably with something more than "I'd like XXX to fill this role") after they have shared interest in filling a position.
Even if We Start a new server how you guys so sure that we gonna get a player base even if we get some player base but for how long they will stay 1 month or 2 or year same thing gonna happen again some day like samp we start losing player base in my opinion the biggest mistake the samp leadership did was the reset we lost alot of players because of this. if the MTA server get good player base good if not we gonna have other empty server in our hands like samp in my opinion let both server run fix the bugs which need to fixed in samp like badandy said and lets see which server get more player base MTA or Samp or this plan die like the rest once.
Even if We Start a new server how you guys so sure that we gonna get a player base even if we get some player base but for how long they will stay 1 month or 2 or year same thing gonna happen again some day like samp we start losing player base in my opinion the biggest mistake the samp leadership did was the reset we lost alot of players because of this. if the MTA server get good player base good if not we gonna have other empty server in our hands like samp in my opinion let both server run fix the bugs which need to fixed in samp like badandy said and lets see which server get more player base MTA or Samp or this plan die like the rest once.
We can not predict the future but one thing that is for sure is that the MTA:SA server will be different than the SA:MP server, we don't know if people will stay or leave but that shouldn't mean we shouldn't try. Andy and I also would be more than happy to provide a place for people to play at would they wish so, even if the player base wouldn't be huge.
We actually gained players (new and old) after the economics reset as it gave players new avenues to pursue. It was also needed as previous HQs spawned a lot of money and items in to the server that needed to be reset, and it'd be unfair to only reset certain players or groups.,
I'm personally curious as to why you think a economic reset hurts the server, why do you think they should not be done?
Why were some decisions taken the way they were? What was the need to reset properties for each update?
in my opinion the biggest mistake the samp leadership did was the reset we lost alot of players because of this.SA:MP has only had 2 "known" server resets; the one when we transitioned from RS4 to RS5 amd the one that I was responsible for see these links for reference:
@Khm - In case the numbers went up from 10 to 50 players, great. So we had a Ddos and were out of action for a month. But it begets the question- what happened to the 20 or 30 people who disappeared (assuming that 20 people still stayed after a month). Did they find another server? Did they stay here a while till they could find it? Surely, if the server was as much fun as I understand it to be, we should have never had these topics then isn't it? This is why I feel it could, at least partly, be related to the reset. I do not intend to spread any rumours but I do empathize with them - I'd feel let down if this happened to me.The same question that I answered Nathan on discord, I was not present as I left. I cannot speak of the 20 people that talked about out, they can answer themselves why they did not come back.
@khm if your talking about me i was present that whole timeNah, I totally missed your post.
if this message for cutter then sorry to mention you
So please refrain from sharing the same rumour that is coming from the opinion of one person. The same person that initially started it was absent that time (unsure was banned or no) and was not a witness of the activity at that time.
Thank you all for your answers. I'm not going to quote (because I reply on the phone always and it's kinda hard), rather, will direct my answer to specific folks.
@Brian
My first question was only generic, which lead to the question on server reset. Sorry if it was misleading. Regarding the admin decisions question, during a discussion or two I had in 2020 (when the number of players was lower than before), I was given to understand that Straccis' rulebreak was further compounded due to (as I recall) Nitr0x being partial during his tenure as an admin. I faintly remember something regarding Devin but I will not speak more on this as my memory is vague. In any case, if this did happen (as I was not around, I could only resort to discussions to understand more on this), it would help to communicate what went wrong so that no one is in the dark which would spark unnecessary rumours fueling distrust.
On your point regarding elections - Sir, I do understand why you feel how you feel. But my counter argument is this - hasn't it happened previously that server leaders are chosen and their governance qualities are inadequate? My sense is that if governance is not well performed by an elected representative (Division Chief or Manager), the CLs could always remove them, communicate the reasons for it and remedy the situation; however, the players would be reasonably expected to make a rational and fair decision while electing the representative(s). Note, I'm not saying that what you say is incorrect - I feel that both approaches have their respective merits, and since we tried one already in the past, can we try this approach now.
On your point regarding the reset - we aren't an RLRP server, I know. But any economy has the ultra rich and ultra poor, along with middle class. The same holds good here. If large amounts of cash were given, maybe we could have removed that cash through an rp mode for ultra rich players alone (for example, a war with aliens who broke out of Area 51 which requires golden lasers mixed with moondust, hence needing large amount of cash from the ultra rich only OR with the Government raising the tax rates overnight to 75% for anyone having net worth in excess of a specific sum, say 5 million. This was required to fund the Governments efforts to reduce their trade deficit with another country. This would lead to a huge negative balance for the player concerned, which would require them to sell off their props).I don't think that the fact we aren't a RL-RP server should matter too much, we're a video game and we will have an imperfect economy, there'll always be power balances and economy resets don't only reset the power balance but ensures people might try out different RP routes and positions.
I feel differently about a mass reset for this because it results in efforts of those who grinded or spent significant time with making any little amount of cash in vain.
If there is a chance of large amounts of cash being made due to too many businesses, why don't we consider restricting the number of businesses or houses that can be purchased?
I feel differently about a mass reset for this because it results in efforts of those who grinded or spent significant time with making any little amount of cash in vain.I spent years roleplaying as a police officer with little to no monetary profit, I grinded my ass off to give the players a fun roleplaying experience. I never put much value behind money because its the interactions I had with others that meant something to me.
I wasn't too active myself at the time as I was on an extended stay abroad but if I recall correctly there was actually a big role-play event around the economy reset in regards to a lockdown/ pandemic, which is also why players moved to Fort Carson, but Khm would know more about that than me.Yeah I mentioned it in one of the previous posts and referenced these 2 links,
Why did Argo SAMP fail?The answer depends on what you consider to be failure. When did it fail, according to you?
Based on my discussions with players, Argo SAMP failed due to poor leadership. But I was keen to know what aspect of poor leadership caused it. Someone had a view that it was because of autocratic leadership.At some brief point, maybe. Did the reach of this "autocracy" affect things to a greater extent than other factors?
Another felt that the regular property resets drove some people away.While the scale of RS4->RS5 reset was significant enough to affect things, I don't think the reset before (RS2->RS3 ?) is even remembered by somebody here other than me. The reset after RS5? I don't think it matters much.
These are like symptoms of a certain illness but the root cause was not known to me until it became clear that communication was what broke down.Ehhhh, I am not sure that's the case. You need to provide context. Specify time, events, etc.
Why were some decisions taken the way they were?For a long time, definitely most of pre-RS5 era, because they felt like it. That's it.
Why are some admin decisions skewed in favor of certain group? There may have been very good reasons for this and maybe it was shared somewhere. But it does not seem to have been shared well enough. This is, for me, the single most important root cause for failure. This has been my experience from RL as well - if communication breaks down, everything fails. After all, players are human beings who are either having fun or escaping RL drudgery to have fun.If your own question contains "decisions skewed in favor of certain group," how is it that the cause is not bias, but communication breakdown? The answer's within the question, if the question does not distort reality.
if underlying illness stays, how will anything succeed?Why should I, if I am a player, give even a slightest, tiniest little fuck about the server management's power configuration?
Here it is - if autocratic leadership worked well in the past, it doesn't now.
And to try and repeat it again in the hope it will work is not a good idea as we will lose players in the process.And if I want to play a game, and not manage somebody else's admin team? :neutral2:
So make it like real life. Elect the server leaders. The players elect the Division Chief and Managers. The Division Chief and the Manager select administration etc. If the players are not happy with administration, the results show in the next election which may be held annually. One important thing - No more than one Division Chief or Manager can be from the same clan / group, from the announcement of their candidature to their exit from the post.
For the first time alone, the community leaders will need to select the Division Chief, managers and admins. Thereon, it needs to be player decisions.
I am not a manager. I am 25 years old, I don't play any games because of my software architecture engineering degree.Sounds very serious. Do you drive a Dodge Stratus (https://youtu.be/ANE8j5ay_UU)?
we were hit by a massive ddos that brought the server down to the ground for more than a month.Which is also what happens, or at least, used to happen, to up and coming RP servers on MTA:SA. Some people really didn't want competition. I don't know whether that's a thing any more, but this is something that should be taken into account. Almost like a rite of passage of sorts. :dead:
More like living in a dysfunctional country that I have to do crap that gets me busy all the time. :lol:I am not a manager. I am 25 years old, I don't play any games because of my software architecture engineering degree.Sounds very serious. Do you drive a Dodge Stratus (https://youtu.be/ANE8j5ay_UU)?
Oh shush Mario. Topic is already answered and closed :hah:Ah, yes. "Inconvenient post, let's ignore."
Almost right sir. It's not inconvenient. I find it pointless to find fault and be opinionated about every small thing that someone says. Hence.It was irony, man. :cry: