Argonath RPG - A World of its own
GTA:SA => SA:MP - San Andreas Multiplayer => SA:MP General => Topic started by: JayL on May 18, 2009, 06:32:14 pm
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Once again, I might look that I can't say much because I'm not very active on SA:MP, but still I noticed this happening frequently...
What I noticed? What are you talking about, Jay?
It's the hostile mood when new players get close to a couple of regulars. I know, sometimes you just can't give them some attention, but please, do not say things like 'STAY AWAY DON'T RUIN MY RP', or killing and flaming back the new player when he attacks you. Doing so will not get him to stop his acts, but otherwise, will just encourage him to carry on them and they won't like when admins interfer. You will probably enjoy helping the guy, I see people saying 'I'm bored', but then just spend your time helping and you won't be bored at all.
Yes, I used to do that too when I was an active regular in SA:MP, I admit, but I've learned not to do it, and it would be good that the others learn it as well. Try to help the guy, it will be one more friend for you, who might be a big help for you later... If you just can't help the player at all, report him to admins or PM him 'Deathmatching is not allowed, read rules here: www.argonathrpg.eu'.
:ps: Helping others also increases your reputation towards the community, I'm not saying this in an ambicious way, but just pointing out as a benefit that you get for helping those who need it (after all many people want to become an admin and help others further)...
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No offence, I've helped alot of new players. But most new players are DM'ers, or hackers. So yes, if they attack us they get pwned. Battle of the fittest.
There are some good new players which are able and more importantly want to learn about roleplay. I also think that you're looking at this from one side, as you've said you're not that active as some players on SA-MP, players like me who have seen hundreds of new players coming by since we play on Argonath, 95 percent of them being DM'ers/hackers/severe flamers/advertisers etc.
But it seems like you've missed alot of new players actually being helped, driven around to places where they can do things. Just take a look at the mainchat, when a player asks 'How can I be a cop?' You have almost instantly got a few players saying: 'Go to a police station' etc.
But it can also bring alot of dissapointment for us when we see a new player which has been helped by you, that later gets banned for hacking. Or if you're randomly attacked by some new players. It takes away the spirit of helping them.
So in my opinion, new players are being helped. But most of them screw up themselfs, you can't blame us for that.
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Sometimes yes, it can be players faults even if they are told, but I've seen loads of people on SA:MP asking how can I do this, can someone please help me, and they are just ignored.
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Full agreement with Mafs.
Once i saw a guy in a newbie skin, DMing around. I PMed him twice, firstly without caps and second time with them with the following: Please, this is an RP Server, if you continue DMing, you'll get banned, after which i've been sent to hell with an F word.
I agree, some of them MAY be a potential roleplayers, but 80% out of 100% are rulebrackers and DMers, which came to the server just to hit and run everyone around, or even hack.
Sad, but true.
EDIT:
By the way, about this "Hostility and aggressive attitude over newbies".
Continuing my point: Regulars' basis is over those 80% of newbie rulebrackers, that's why they are always trying to get them away from RP because of fear that it's another rulebracker/Dmer/another bad guy. It's not only about regulars that always remain on the server, but it's the fault from those 80% of rulebrackers, who are coming to the server each day.
IMO
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I agree with your point as well. But what I want to say is, it's not exactly needed to be hostile when a new player turns up. Just PM/report if it's the case. Yes, there are also many players who help the newcomers, but there's a group who just behave hostily towards the 'newbies'.
There are many other ways than being hostile. If you don't think you fit teaching others - report them or PM them, then go away... If you like to spend your time trying to teach them, do what I told you... It's your choice...
By the way, I didn't miss it, Mafs, I want to try to convince those who are unneccessarily hostile to the newcomers...
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That's what I've been saying from months, check the freecops topic aswell... I doubt this could be changed thought.
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Well, true that u may have a few hackers/dmers, true that you would feel bad when a player you help gets banned. But guys, be wary, not hostile. Most of the time, admins spot out the weapon hackers before they get to players.
And with regard to ruining your fun, well why not try and include them in your roleplay?. The reason they ruin your fun is cuz they dont understand the commands or there is a language barrier. Instead of being hostile and firing warning shots, simply pm an admin, if u are not interested in talking to him.
:ps: The hostile nature is noticed by me on my non admin account. People who are very friendly to me on the admin account run away or DM me on the non admin when i just move close, not to mention bad language. Totally unnecessary. Kudos to the ultra few who have had no qualms to teach me(yes i acted like i was new) in my non admin account. My respect has increased manifold for them.
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40% of the time, when you help a new player you are bound to EAT SHIT. Like, when you offer a stranded new player a lift, he carjacks you.. blah blah. :hit:
20% of the time, when you help a new player, they will require a lot of warnings (constant PMs.. etc) to stop rulebreaking.
40% of the time, when you help a new player, on the understanding of the rules/what to do on the server - they listen.
You cannot state that we're(who ever you're refering to) hostile and aggressive. We're not. As DarkRaven just said, it's the fear of basically.. dunking your face in a cow patt by helping someone.
Personally, I feel the majority of the server likes to help new players. The easiest way they do this, is over the main chat when a new player asks for help; as there is no fear factor.
I know that reporting doesn't really do much.. Don't waste your time reported a new player. Your chances of your report being answered is around 20%, unless you spam/flood report.
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In my opinion, being afraid isn't really a reason to react on the guy, but maybe avoid him?
It's just a hint, it's not needed to be hostile... At all.
That's what I've been saying from months, check the freecops topic aswell... I doubt this could be changed thought.
Who knows this opens the eyes of 2 or 3... :)
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Who knows this opens the eyes of 2 or 3... :)
Indeed ... but there's still half server who's doing it.. :razz:
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I know that reporting doesn't really do much.. Don't waste your time reported a new player. Your chances of your report being answered is around 20%, unless you spam/flood report.
And a almost 100% chance of getting kicked yourselfs :)
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when a new player askes for help i will do my best to help but if i being chased by cops i ignor not that i want to it coz i don't wanna surrender/die
but i see what you are saying Jay
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damn it again such topics
i have been playing on another server lately, and all i can say: BE HAPPY with what we got,
all what happens there is flaming, noob throwing to faces everywhere, we are not a hostile server
far from
at other servers you dont have such a big community
also if they attack you, dont attack back?
no way, just attack and kill, will learn them enough
warning them wont help anyway
once a dmer, always a dmer
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I feel that the majority of the new players can't speak English at all.
A Lot of them imagine SAMP to just be DM, And Only DM. I told someone off [in RS3] for carjacking and they gave ME a lecture - in default chat - on why I shouldn't play GTA if I don't like carjacking in pigeon English that only a person with a brain the size of a Leprechaun's testicle could understand.
If I remotely help a new player all I get is abuse hurled at me. One person was kicked and he came back [kick reason 'Learn rules at argonathrpg.eu'] and said "F*ck tht y shud i reed sh*t this is a game - just kill peeps right" on main chat. The majority of the time they take advice as an insult and to be frank, I dare to use the word idiotic to describe them.
Sometimes you get people who do this:
'HOW DO I BE COP??????????????????????????????????????????????' 15 Times in main chat, totally ignoring people explaining it.
What I am trying to say is the majority of new players just take advice as them being criticized and throw it back in the advisers face.
[Rstar]CBFasi Summed it up on TS: The majority of our new players are too young, they are under 16 - never had a REAL chance to live life and are used to getting their own way.*
*Thanks CBF, I am using your quotes - they are so true
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Everyone start out as DMers, that's a fact. New players should be given the best opportunities to get into roleplaying and after that it's up to themselves if they wanna carry on roleplaying or go back to DMing.
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Everyone start out as DMers, that's a fact.
It is? I didn't start as a DMer.. and when I started I would of been what.. 15?
: o
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Out of all new players there have been, ive seen only a handful come out to be roleplayers day after day (good example: Bill_Guarene, Louis_Keyl, and Spartan)
I mean seriously its ridiculous sometimes. I try to help new players, but sometimes I am in a rush and it gets annoying when they bother you. For example, I was giving someone an AVDS exam and I drove through LV strip, big fucking mistake. I got carjacked, beat up, my car got destroyed, THEY WERE LIKE ANIMALS. If it was 1 person, thats ok, but it was like 5+ people ganging up on me! I thought they would turn on each other but they just went after me and my student. Going through the strip LV is a fucking death wish im telling you.....
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Out of all new players there have been, ive seen only a handful come out to be roleplayers day after day (good example: Bill_Guarene, Louis_Keyl, and Spartan)
Are you serious?
I prefer the hacking deathmatchers.
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once a dmer, always a dmer
Noooooot. if so, once a murderboy, always a murderboy. :rofl:
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Out of all new players there have been, ive seen only a handful come out to be roleplayers day after day (good example: Bill_Guarene, Louis_Keyl, and Spartan)
Spartan is not a new player.. He was argonath MTA:VC before, or something.
As Panda said, I prefer the hacking deathmatchers when it comes to Bill_Guarene.
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damn it again such topics
also if they attack you, dont attack back?
no way, just attack and kill, will learn them enough
warning them wont help anyway
once a dmer, always a dmer
It's because of attitudes like yours that things will not change. Ever considered the people who at start DM but can get the point of the server if someone helps them? I am not whinning, I am just trying to open some eyes here...
How are you so sure on this 'Once a DMer, always a DMer'? I'm pretty sure that there are many regulars who were DMers at first and now follow the rules properly, also I'm also sure that people can change.
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Pancher is an excellent example.
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I hate when i tell new players , what is allowed and what is not and they still keep doing it. : /
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A Lot of the problem is everyone knows everyone on the server [Active people]. We don't like people threatening to change that.
Next lines are not to dow with new players but new player which flood questions.
If someone new, who we don't know comes online and asks a question someone will eventually answer, but most of the time they will just ignore it.
IMO - We cause people to flood chat. If we don't answer they ask again, again and again.
There are times when we don't cause it. Like when the new player cannot speak English well.
I.E: [SD]xXxXxD[DS]: (21) HOW DO I BE COP AND WHO FROM ROMANIA HERE COPS WHAT. < That sentence flooded chat 8 times. Resulted in a kick.
In my opinion the guy couldn't understand what warning meant.
Another reason, like my previous post, is to do with a players age.
I prime example is RPG_Police. [Just illustrating my point, not flaming/picking on]. He used to attempt to speak English (often with an ambiguous result), I told him to learn to speak English a bit better [only advising] and I got a round of f*cks. I said 'Don't be childish' and he goes [Exactly as written]: I Not childish I live life like adult.
In his unban request is 'man i have 11 years and best englisher in class'
That annoys regulars because they can speak English to a modest standard and he clearly thought he was adult but when sh*t hits the fan, he uses age as a defence mechanism.
[Summary]
The points I am making are:
1. Players are too young. [can't do much about that :(]
2. Players don't speak English properly results in hostility from regulars. [They do it inadvertently]
3. So many don't read the rules on login [little red box]. (That applies to regs and newbs)
I know, not the most structured writing ever, but it's writing.
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But what to do with two players which stealing all Gvardia Mob cars and parks them Behind Vank Off Hotel roof / SF City Hall or just leave them around SF. + They are cops at theirself. I asked why you are doing this, they said they want money. I explained them that you wont earn any by selling owned cars. They just keep coming back, many admins have been dealing with them and FBI.
At start i asked nicely if you can stop doing this, they just wont listen and keep doing it :/.
Yeh and i usualy say new people: Dont DM , Even if you say Deathmatch they might not understand what is it.
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Valid points all.
I however tend to disagree with most of you.
During my stay at Argonath, I’ve been blessed to meet so many inspiring players in the making. I personally joined Argonath only to be DMed continuously, scarred and beaten to a pulp. I never knew the rules and they were never explained to me. Every time I reached for a glimmer of help, I was hit down with the Argonath website. Whilst I feel this may be a good source of information, I wasn’t willing to visit the site just to learn the rules. I resorted to learning the ropes, by starting off as I would in real life.
It was my core aim to find out the role of people. For example, I would watch some of the Corleones whilst they were dusting a player off, and on the other side of the road I would meet an ARPD officer busting a criminal. I approached players to learn and build my skills up. I was profoundly intrigued and overwhelmed by the sheer content of information open to me such as phones, PMing and the /me command.
We must remember that we all started off as unknowledgeable players; however in time we grew the fundamental tools to fit in line with the community. For me, Hank_Rafferty has always been my mentor along with Toven. They taught me how to act as a cadet and what was expected of players. Through this, I spot an opportunity to create a business and here I am today.
Whilst many people here don’t like to take people under their wings, let me remind you that Cane (who’s recently left) started out as a RI. Cane was a bright individual with a keen eye for shooting and blabbing his big mouth off. Pete and I mentored him and put his skills to good use, honing his skills and building awareness of others. Until recently, and as many of you know Cane turned out to be a large profile player and loved by many. This is a typical example of nurturing within Argonath – the potential is limitless.
I also believe that the argument of age is flawed for the particular reason that many of the top RPers are approximately the age of 16. For example one of the highest and most admired admins was roughly that age last year. Also – I’ve met many good RPers under the age of 16 such as Collin Hawk, who has really started to impress me.
I believe we have already set our expectations without realising what Argonath RP is all about. RP in my perspective is all about creative, innovative and imaginative belief. All of us have a role to play in Argonath, in line with this; we should remember that sustaining our RP content is the single most important element of making Argonath work for us.
I admire you all for the work you do, and the effort you put into this game. It’s truly sparkling what we all achieve together despite our age differences, beliefs and cultural restrictions.
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If you just can't help the player at all, report him to admins or PM him 'Deathmatching is not allowed, read rules here: www.argonathrpg.eu'.
People keep saying stuff like "Report him to admins", "PM him the rules" blahblah. Admins rarely respond on minor rulebreakers due to them being busy etc.
I've gotten carkilled over 9000 ((http://www.google.ee/images?q=tbn:qG3kU1ZRJbc-2M::pic.dawnbox.com/files/vegeta-9000.png)) times even though I've PMed the newbie that carkilling isn't allowed in this server and he could get punished for it (Calmly, without caps, mind you). He just ignored me and kept trying to run me over. Then I get suspected for killing them so I get killed by coppers :( .
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Screw helping new players.When I was new all I got was abuse from everyone. I tried talking in main chat and got ignored, when I used caps or !! to get attention I was banana'd or kicked for Spamming. I PMed admins and they ignored me, I got frustrated and ended up being kicked ect.
So no, I wont help new players. If they really want to play on Argonath they can stick in there long enough to be aknowledged like I had to do :)
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Screw helping new players.When I was new all I got was abuse from everyone. I tried talking in main chat and got ignored, when I used caps or !! to get attention I was banana'd or kicked for Spamming. I PMed admins and they ignored me, I got frustrated and ended up being kicked ect.
So no, I wont help new players. If they really want to play on Argonath they can stick in there long enough to be aknowledged like I had to do :)
ffer because o your own selfish reasons? Think about it, man.
Now that's just bad, man....
Think about it... Do you want other people to go through what you went? Do you want other people to su
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To all the people that aspire being admin sometime - helping new players is one of the biggest reasons of being chosen.
Even if it is for intrest, good help is still the same for a new player.
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Everyone start out as DMers
Yes.. i started DMing...
Good times... :lol:
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Yes.. i started DMing...
Good times... :lol:
I started out as a DMer too, 2 years ago. I went on cop duty, drove to Grove Street and randomly blasted everyone till I got banned for constant DMing D: .
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I started out as a DMer too, 2 years ago. I went on cop duty, drove to Grove Street and randomly blasted everyone till I got banned for constant DMing D: .
omg...
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Yeah when I first started I didnt DM, but I did money cheat. About 40k to be precise. :(
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My mistake was that I deathmatched Carhartt and Aragorn and I had two options - either learn how to roleplay by the best or be banned .... Chose first one! :D
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My mistake was that I deathmatched Carhartt and Aragorn and I had two options - either learn how to roleplay by the best or be banned .... Chose first one! :D
I had similar situation, but i only shot Carhartt :razz: But i got banned to :(
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rofl nice to see some old players first experiences. I remember on mtavc ghost stopped me cuz he was a cop and we did some rp which i found very bugging. i felt that power was abused and i think i flamed ghost, not too sure. gotta tempban D:
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Lol at my first time i got og loc skin and i bought shotguns and randomly shot people, Kaltsu kicked me for DMing. Then i came back and said ''I WAS RPING A GANGSTER'' and wanted my disappeared shotguns money back from Kaltsu lol :lol: And he said that he doesn't give money to random newbies :D
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I've actually never been a Dmer, because it was my friend that got me into this server, and he told me not to kill for no reason. He was inactive when I just started, but I met shitix and his old gang, and joined them, and he tought me some stuff too.
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I think I got once kicked by Kitsune (Geoffrey back then, I think?) when I first joined for accidentally putting "wwwwwwwwwwwwww" into chat. I did get to apologize before he finished the kick command though : ).
I know what you mean by hostility though. I first joined SA-MP, and I saw an event on Mount Chiliad (a marathon). This was back in the days when you had specific spawnpoints for each skin, and Dave refused to teleport anyone up there.
So, I grabbed a hydra and flew up there. Immediately, a couple guys went "HYDRA DMER!!?!" and started shooting M4s at me. Surprised, I accidentally crashed (spectacularly) into the starting line, given that I had no control of my damaged hydra.
Good times ;).
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I know what you mean by hostility though. I first joined SA-MP, and I saw an event on Mount Chiliad (a marathon). This was back in the days when you had specific spawnpoints for each skin, and Dave refused to teleport anyone up there.
So, I grabbed a hydra and flew up there. Immediately, a couple guys went "HYDRA DMER!!?!" and started shooting M4s at me. Surprised, I accidentally crashed (spectacularly) into the starting line, given that I had no control of my damaged hydra.
Good times ;).
Lol :lol:
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I got kicked be Flameman when I first started.
I went and dutied and blasted everyone in sight. Including Flameman.
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Hey, for me it started like this. Two friends of mine invited me to Argonath and taught me the rules and told me their rivals. I had my own rival as well, Everyone has their own rival and someone they hate. My two friends were 1. Silver 2. Gillie. Despite the hate I have been getting from others cause of my [C] Crips gang. I went inactive to let the hate blow over. Yes I started out as a dmer, but took the time to learn the rules.
I also see where Jay is getting at!
By: Moe Ross
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I started as a flamer, telling everyone to suck my dick and get fucked in the arse, sorry blanc
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Are you serious?
I prefer the hacking deathmatchers.
LMAO :lol:
Screw helping new players.When I was new all I got was abuse from everyone. I tried talking in main chat and got ignored, when I used caps or !! to get attention I was banana'd or kicked for Spamming. I PMed admins and they ignored me, I got frustrated and ended up being kicked ect.
So no, I wont help new players. If they really want to play on Argonath they can stick in there long enough to be aknowledged like I had to do :)
Well, you know how it feels to be ignored as a new player, so you should be more inclined to try and help them. That's very selfish of you.
I think I got once kicked by Kitsune (Geoffrey back then, I think?) when I first joined for accidentally putting "wwwwwwwwwwwwww" into chat. I did get to apologize before he finished the kick command though : ).
I remember that. ^^
I was a dmer the first time I joined Argonath (MTA:VC server), but that was only because I just got the game a few days before and when they told me "no deathmatching", I had no idea what that meant. After they actually explained what deathmatching was, I stopped doing it. :D
I think the only major thing I did wrong when I started on the SA:MP server was using my MTA:VC police methods there (went straight to cop work because I like cop work :P). If you played on both servers back then, you'd know how different the two departments operated.
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When I first joined, I remember asking in the main chat "How do I make money here?" So, I met up with a Grove Street guy, and he went and took me to grow some weed, after we had picked it up, we went and sold it for a small amount of cash. One of the biggest parts I remember is blowing almost all of my 10k on buying Ak-47's and shooting cops with some other GSF guys.
-Good times :D
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I think the only major thing I did wrong when I started on the SA:MP server was using my MTA:VC police methods there (went straight to cop work because I like cop work :P). If you played on both servers back then, you'd know how different the two departments operated.
Both departments are way different, but you can get used to both, MTA:VC Policing is more of a relaxed style. :razz:
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Ah, so thats why all the hardcore SA-MP cops seem so silly to me.
I'm looking at it from a VCPD perspective. Get in, kill criminal, get out! No faffing about with surrenders and stuff.
Heck, I still play like that. And I still don't like the police codes..
MAN WITH GUN!
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On VC, all you need to do to be a decent cop is to ask to surrender a couple of times and shoot down if the criminals prefer to ignore you, we don't put a lot of details on it but we also do put some RP on it.
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In my opinion thats a much better approach, and thats my approach on SA-MP.
1) Find Criminal,
2) Ask surrender,
3) Check response,
4) Arrest or obliterate based on 3).
Done!
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If you're gonna help a new player, be patient and take time to do it. If this new player doesn't wanna listen to me I just move on. His loss. If he does listen, I don't mind giving him money, guns, phone, cbradio etc.
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In my opinion thats a much better approach, and thats my approach on SA-MP.
1) Find Criminal,
2) Ask surrender,
3) Check response,
4) Arrest or obliterate based on 3).
Done!
thats the same as SAMP works..... except reporting on radio and jailing process,
but also jailing process isnt always done
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I don't think there's "Hostility Towards New Players", I just know people are, most of them, busy and think that they'll never be great roleplayers - so most of them don't even bother.
It happened to me when I was seeking help and I'm sure it has happened to most of you.
I started my Argo adventure as a flaming/provoker little bastard who just played for shoot and kill(Which is normal if you've played Single Player mode).I never needed people to tell me : "Roleplay instead of deathmatching" - It was something I had to learn on my own because I was constantly being kicked, which, clearly, isn't fun and it made me think.So I doubt people can use it as an excuse because everyone is capable of observing - thinking - acting.
Kind Regards,
DeRossi.
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If I see a player who has asked for help log in the day after registering I will help, that to me shows they are interested.
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I am happy to note that some people are taking the initiave to help new players! Lex_Alterlis for example has started a little organization where he puts an ad to help new players, awesome work Lex!
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telling everyone to suck my dick and get f**ked in the arse, sorry blanc
LOL