Argonath RPG - A World of its own
GTA:SA => SA:MP - San Andreas Multiplayer => SA:MP General => Topic started by: Bilbo on December 27, 2009, 03:52:33 pm
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Well, I've been trying for few times already to get it into the player's heads why an administrator might not always answer to your report or Personal Message... which also has causes lots of moaning and complaints through the main chat and PM. Hopefully this would clear the situation for the players who think admins are just lazy and don't do their work...
Let's start with a situation, 110 players on-line and only 1 admin - which can easily happen now under the Administrator Team Reconstruction and actually has. By average, every minute around 1 player out of 10 makes a report using /report. Along with this, by average 0.1 players out of 10 are PMing the administrator about a problem, fault or just has something to ask him. Which can easily be 2 PM's per minute. Also, there has to be count the server messages, which for this example could be 1 out of 10 players per minute.
So, what does it actually mean? Well, if there are 110 players on-line and only 1 admin - what will the admin get on his chat? Let's make some simple calculations:
• 1 report per minute for each 10 players. 110/10 = 11 reports per minute.
• 2 PMs per minute for each 10 players. 110 x 0.1 = 11 x 2 = 22 PM's per minute. (received & sent)
• 1 server messages per minute for each 10 players. 110/10 = 11 server messages per minute.
So, for a basic administrator it can be 44 only-administrator messages per minute to appear in the chat. And of course, we need to answer on all the PM's, respond on all the reports we're able to and even monitor the main chat for questions by new players and regulars. And, if for example there is a carkiller reported, we cannot just take actions on him. We have to watch the reported player for repeated rule-break which we see with out own eyes. After that we can take action and move onto the next report. And also note, that currently 70 percent of all reports area dealt by talking in PM or local chat... not by using the hammertools we have in our closets.
Now, how about when there are even more rule-breakers, and there are coming 2 reports for each 10 players? What if 2 players out of 10 are PMing the only administrator on-line every minute? What if there is a something going on which causes more server messages, for example 2 of them for each 10 players each minute? PLUS the normal main chat which some of you already find it spammy. You do the calculations...
But, how about Managers and above? The example above was only about normal administrator. And not to mention, everyone rather asks and PM's a Manager or developer than normal administrator or moderator? So yes, for Managers and above the amount of messages can be double, or even triple at busy evenings. I would also want to mention about other things they are able to do, but not sure would that be allowed on my case.
So, next time you report someone, and you don't get answered within 20 seconds, what do you do? You think about starting to moan over the main chat?
Think again... :roll:
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Indeed man, that's why we need more admins on the server. :D
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Fun and Fulfilling?
Sure thing. :)
Easy?
Oh hell no D=.
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Don't constantly report people if yours doesn't get answered as TRY to answer them as quick and as efficent as possible sometimes Admins are dealing with 1-4 reports at a time, plus reports via PM and all the new people asking for help. Don't moan at Admins cause they don't answer your report or PM just be patient we ain't multi-tasking robots. Players expect a warn/kick straight away but that is not how it works we have to spectate them and see for ourselves.
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Well, if the current admin team isn't enough then I don't understand why they kicked 95% of the old admin team in the first place?
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I completely agree with this , Admin work is hard .
:ps: Is right i will be un-banned on 2010 ? just a question :D
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Well, if the current admin team isn't enough then I don't understand why they kicked 95% of the old admin team in the first place?
I guess you do not read news board. Reasons of reconstruction were stated there.
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Some people fail to understand how busy admins is... but for some it's not hard not to spam them.
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that is why i like to help them out if i see one admin online i will pull to the side of the road and watch the main chat and help answer questions
unless a code 30 comes or a 207
i also make ads says New to the ServeR? need help? /pm <my id> <question> and i always respond
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(http://i32.tinypic.com/2vjueyb.jpg)
I'm just kidding :D
And it's not that you always get 22 PM's per minute... Even if you're the only admin online with 110 players, it's rare that 22 people have a question (at least from my personal experience)
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Sometimes when im bored , and I see 1-2 admins and alot of players online, I pm admin that If he needs help , just send new players to me and I will try to answer their questions.
And server really needs more admins...what about make special admins, which cant kick,warn,etc...but they appear in special group in /admins. And when "real" admins are busy , they turn off their PMs , so players will ask these "question answering admins" . :)
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and people ask me where is my phone :lol:
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Arch: I absolutely love that idea! It should be added. :)
cDa: Is your phone missing? ^^
On-topic: Sometimes I report, I think "Where the **** are all admins?!", until, I check the list. It makes me feel a bit bad for them.
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and people ask me where is my phone :lol:
Lol :D I'd imagine, if no contact over PM, They'll just call you lol :P
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Lol :D I'd imagine, if no contact over PM, They'll just call you lol :P
and on login : you have xx sms :p
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And server really needs more admins...what about make special admins, which cant kick,warn,etc...but they appear in special group in /admins. And when "real" admins are busy , they turn off their PMs , so players will ask these "question answering admins" . :)
Like "helpers"?
"The other roleplay server (D:)" has this function, and it works very well actually.
Perhaps people who can like /helperduty and appear on this list, and they are available for PM questions.
Post it in SAMP ideas someone D=. Or I will later.
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IcyAero, you're a great guy and this is no offense towards you.
But why you took the time to write this?
Most of the people will never learn this, so it's spending time on something what is not changing.
The only thing what changed is (sorry, not to offense you), people start to think that you were not strong enough to ignore these moaners and just punish them after continueing.
Making such a topic, is really good with a good intention - but when you know that people will not change, it's only spending your own time on something, less usefull - and it make people think:
"Ah, it's to hard for IcyAero and therefor he need to make a topic?" and "when we make this topics it's moan and when an admin does it's oke" - that are some of the reactions I feel there and and some of them I also .. noticed in conversations in the maintime I got removed as admin and got a lot of questions.
And trust me, I know IcyAero well enough to say he's a very strong, responsible and really active admin, and everyone who thinks what I just explained about any of those admins, can just "f**k off".
And no, I am not saying that was what I though, I am just pointing out other points of people how they will look against it (the moaners).
What I always did when I got moaned at, or shouted at - just refering them to the community email and ignore them (I know you know the same and doing the same, but just repeating).
Unless you are sure that you are doing your job, nothing is wrong and if you were sure and you did not your job, then what's the problem? You will be reminded by your leaders about your things you do wrong, and you can try to change that.
As YOU are the admin, you are the one who have to execute your tasks, and you are doing that very well.
Why caring about this topic, and spending a time to write and explain this.\
Another thing, you can point out in this topic, is to make people think again about getting admin, people who've applied or people who still want to apply.
You are pointing out once again (and that's good), that admin job is not a rank or status or something that makes you cool, it's a pure heavy job what takes a lot of time and roleplay.
You need to be the perfect person for it, and have the capibility to lead (and correct) people in to the right direction with result a peacefull server and a calm atmosphere.
This topic should make people reconsider where there are also working for, to get the job? Or to get the rank?
Last message to you, IcyAero - don't let yourself being affected or don't even care about anyone who moans.
As admin, you are used to it (and I know that aswell) - every single day, you will be moaned at.
Just because one of your actions were unfair in others eyes, but why? Do you know? As I don't.
Just take this from me, aslong as you are sure you are doing well - then there is no problem, and then we are happy with you (I am happy anyways).
NOTE: Nothing in this post is ment as offense towards any admin, basicly only summing up facts to make admins point even stronger.
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Like "helpers"?
"The other roleplay server (D:)" has this function, and it works very well actually.
Perhaps people who can like /helperduty and appear on this list, and they are available for PM questions.
Post it in SAMP ideas someone D=. Or I will later.
Because we feel that ALL players are available to help others, we do not need to assign special people.
If someone asks a quetion in main chat and you know the answer, you are free to help them. If you do not wish to be bothered, that is your choice.
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Because we feel that ALL players are available to help others, we do not need to assign special people.
If someone asks a quetion in main chat and you know the answer, you are free to help them. If you do not wish to be bothered, that is your choice.
I do answer questions, just saying it might be good to have people who are kind of spending "dedicated time" to it. That said, there probably isn't a need for it - main chat is good enough as you say.
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Because we feel that ALL players are available to help others, we do not need to assign special people.
If someone asks a quetion in main chat and you know the answer, you are free to help them. If you do not wish to be bothered, that is your choice.
I believe that new players think that admins know better, and other players might be sarcastic to their questions. Also, admins are much more trustworthy to their eyes.
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I haven't done it in a little while but the next time I am in-game on admin duty I will show the live feed
I hear from people who have watched it that it shows how busy we get, and they were surprised at how busy we really do get
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and people ask me where is my phone :lol:
+1
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That is certainly a lot of work to do for SA:MP admins, Icy, hopefully this will shed some light to people who think admins don't do anything.
I think the maximum reports I've ever had to deal with all coming at around the same times was 4, and even that is tough at times because people will keep bugging you to help them.
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Guess why i resigned as MTA:SA Admin.
I found myself way to inactive to continue. I Have a decent job with responsibilities. That has the top priority what makes me probably loosing contact with Argonath.
That's what some people need to learn here. It's not about the power... If you cannot handle the job, just follow your heart, not your brains.
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Admin work is fun, admin work is easy, you need to have a big knowledge of which situations to use what commands or what verbal warnings to give, and once you have learnt how to do that over many months/years, you can RP while doing admin work because most situations require little thinking...
Admin work is all a big experience...I enjoyed it, by the end I could be in the middle of a 207 and also dealing with a hacker, a DMer, a carjacker and a flamer in main chat, all while still negociating and coordinating units...
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Yeah right GiacJr, Did you also have time for a donut break? :cop:
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Pancher "and coordinating units..." he got his units to shove them down his throat instead.
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You people can make the admin work easy by....
STOP MOANING or respect the rules O.o
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Admin work is fun, admin work is easy, you need to have a big knowledge of which situations to use what commands or what verbal warnings to give, and once you have learnt how to do that over many months/years, you can RP while doing admin work because most situations require little thinking...
Admin work is all a big experience...I enjoyed it, by the end I could be in the middle of a 207 and also dealing with a hacker, a DMer, a carjacker and a flamer in main chat, all while still negociating and coordinating units...
Some people would remember JDC in his FBI Jacket, on his mountain bike, bunnyhopping from roof to roof while dealing with Admin Reports. (I miss my bike :<)
Admin Duty is fun, but it is not easy. However, I always thought the job was worth all the spams, false reports, abuse accusations and shits that come with it. What matters is that Admins help players. :)
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I think admin job IS easy, but that might just be me...
As Gandalf stated, I type faster then most autotypers... :lol:
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I think admin job IS easy, but that might just be me...
As Gandalf stated, I type faster then most autotypers... :lol:
You were good admin. Its very bad that they canceled you.
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And it's not that you always get 22 PM's per minute... Even if you're the only admin online with 110 players, it's rare that 22 people have a question (at least from my personal experience)
Maybe not 22 received, but received and sent. As if 0.1 players out of 10 ask you something, you also have to answer it which makes it 2.
And believe me, I've had even more PM's per minute...
Another thing, you can point out in this topic, is to make people think again about getting admin, people who've applied or people who still want to apply.
You are pointing out once again (and that's good), that admin job is not a rank or status or something that makes you cool, it's a pure heavy job what takes a lot of time and roleplay.
You need to be the perfect person for it, and have the capibility to lead (and correct) people in to the right direction with result a peacefull server and a calm atmosphere.
In fact, it was one of the points I tried to point out to the people. It might be easy for some people (referring to the post of Giac's), but to be really effective, to do the best effort possible, to help everyone within reasonable time, you don't have time for much more than work itself. Good example of this case is me, yes, me. When is the last time you've seen be involved in a big roleplay as an administrator? Once? Twice for the last 17 months? Maybe - in fact I don't even remember it myself. Of course you'll have time for some minor role-play in the side, but when someone needs help, you need to help or respond on it. And if you cannot sacrifice role-play when someone is in need of help - you've came for the wrong job.
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It's even possible to get an even more flooded chat then what IcyAero explained. But then it's so nasty that you cannot read it all that's comes up or remember what you are talking to others about. :neutral:
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I still don't get the point of this topic.
Too hard, so you want to tell others why not applying?
Well, screw them, they'll get what they wanted.
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Fun and Fulfilling?
Sure thing. :)
Easy?
Oh hell no D=.
I'll just go ahead and agree on this. Pretty much sums it up.
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i understand these topics pretty easy hes not telling you not to apply but he is telling you are you sure you want to apply ??
Don't do it to rank hunt don't do it to feel powerfull
Admin duty comes even befor a friend
and yes you even have to ban your own friend if he rule breaks
Rp for admins wil be like zero expect allot of complais moans even when your bussy
so in short term are you sure you want to be a admin ?? and can you handle it
thats kinda where this topic is about what i see ;)
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And i thought it was to make people understand that we cannot always respond to you report within 2 seconds cos in some periods we have alot to do and we are no machines that can handle alot of reports, answer questions and etc at the same time..
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And i thought it was to make people understand that we cannot always respond to you report within 2 seconds cos in some periods we have alot to do and we are no machines that can handle alot of reports, answer questions and etc at the same time..
At least here's an idea.
PM from Daco_Araatus(xx): hey pancher i need your help pls
After 2 seconds:
PM to Daco_Araatus(xx): hold on daco
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At least here's an idea.
PM from Daco_Araatus(xx): hey pancher i need your help pls
After 2 seconds:
PM to Daco_Araatus(xx): hold on daco
That'll stop moaning and "wdfomg ur lazy admin u not reply". Maybe a command? - /onit ID
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That'll stop moaning and "wdfomg ur lazy admin u not reply". Maybe a command? - /onit ID
We already have that command, and we use it...
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We already have that command, and we use it...
You probably use it well, however not everyone does use it.
Which is totally correct.
People should KNOW that administration members are busy. If there are only 3 people for 100 people.. Then you know there is alot of stress. It's kind of the same like running a restaurant.
However from the other side, i think aslong you know you can handle alot of stress (I mean it, there are alot of admins that went loose due to the pressure.)
Then apply.
As for the current admins, keep up the good job, but don't disband yourself from the others like saying 'We're hard workers'. People prefer to judge on that theirselves; not getting it thrown to them.
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Stress my ass, if an admin goes on admin duty (turns to red) he'll be ready for this stuff.
Maybe a little bit of music, a cup of coffe will releave the stress.
By the way, there is already a command for off-duty admins which is /setpm off and maybe /setphone off.
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Wow Icy, you helped me see the light.
I See what admins go through and why reports get unanswered sometimes.
I Had a good idea as of why, but i see exactly why now.
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Stress my ass, if an admin goes on admin duty (turns to red) he'll be ready for this stuff.
Admins are not robots, they are players too, and the Admins Team is the group in Argonath that has the most stressful occupation, only surpassed by the Developers and Owners.
Some Admins have actually resigned in the past due to the fact that it was getting too much for them to handle. Not because they are pansies, they did try their best, but sometimes people can only handle so much.
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(http://i244.photobucket.com/albums/gg31/EliteTerm/sa-mp-752.png)
(http://i244.photobucket.com/albums/gg31/EliteTerm/sa-mp-753.png)
Hopefully this will change your views on us doing our jobs.
I'm the only admin on the server when these pictures were taken. I was talking with 5 players, handling 3 reports, and keeping an eye out for hackers.
On Christmas Eve, I had to stay on the server all night with a migraine alone because of the gravity scripts. I was overwhelmed with 30 killdeath messages in a second, more than 3 times, along with the main chat going WTF and reporting some players who thought triggered the gravity scripts.
On more than one occasions I even considered leaving the A-Team after the new waves of Moderators.. but this job is addicting :). To those players who applied for the A-Team, you'd better hope you are prepared to sacrifice your times to help players and protect the servers.
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Admins are not robots, they are players too, and the Admins Team is the group in Argonath that has the most stressful occupation, only surpassed by the Developers and Owners.
Some Admins have actually resigned in the past due to the fact that it was getting too much for them to handle. Not because they are pansies, they did try their best, but sometimes people can only handle so much.
Some of us even tried to resign and failed....
Try this....
Admin work, Developer, and SAPD Chief, and not one will let me go without a fight...
Its also why I am now a hidden Admin to try and reduce some of the workload, but I wont give up...
Yesterday I was for a while ONLY admin on, and at a time when I expected more. I tried to manage things, I even made mistakes.
I went online at 2100z and left after midnight, and managed about 2-3 minutes of 'play'.
Was I sad/annoyed that I didnt get much time to play, well not really...
Did I ask help from others, yes and they helped, thanks even thought I had to pay.
Did I use the Red name.... almost permantly, did this stop players from trying to rob me... no
Did I do any 'Dev' work, technically yes...
Can I multi task .... no, this means I can deal with one thing at a time, and can sometimes get slowed by too many requests from help.
Is it nice to joke about with an admin, when there are many it can work but when there is one or two do not, they will get more stressed and react negiavely, I did yesterday and I hope some players understood that ignoring admins is not wise even if you think its funny.
Yes I am stressed.. and this is not a joke, I am on RL Medication to reduce extreme reactions and I believe my roles as before mentioned are part of the cause, but only part, not the full cause.
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may i add, that your ingame character will also change.
with this i mean, for example if i talk from personal experience.
i lost pretty much all my friends since i became admin, do i care? no...
its sad , but it happends.
why do i loose them?
pretty simple, i treath everybody equal
i don't care if your a friend, enemy, respected person or what so ever.
i hope the people who applied are aware, of the equal treathment to all.
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I was an admin on some server and a admin on NinjaPies one - before it came to Argonath and set up shop here.
It wasn't so fun (Very Demanding and time consuming -still rewarding and enjoyable at some times.) :P , especially as we did not have block pms and such thing, so, most admins would just go on another account.
I've learned to treat everyone impartially from my time in FBI and CMB , If you do a crime, I will go after you :P.
Post Merge: December 29, 2009, 07:39:26 pm
Stress my ass, if an admin goes on admin duty (turns to red) he'll be ready for this stuff.
Maybe a little bit of music, a cup of coffe will releave the stress.
By the way, there is already a command for off-duty admins which is /setpm off and maybe /setphone off.
:flame: .
First of all, you have broken enough rules in game and annoyed enough players and admins (i'm sure) , and yet they work hard to ensure even you get a good gaming experience... with all respects, grow up (This moaning is a load of bobba), as harsh as you may think this text is, its true. I was rping with masa, if he had his pm's off and phone off, how the hell would he and me be able to rp properly? I don't think you've thought this through.
Post Merge: December 29, 2009, 07:41:43 pm
Like "helpers"?
"The other roleplay server (D:)" has this function, and it works very well actually.
Perhaps people who can like /helperduty and appear on this list, and they are available for PM questions.
Post it in SAMP ideas someone D=. Or I will later.
Then you'd just have a bunch of people being glory cows.
If people want to help others, they are free to join the CMB , LSDS, AVDS and BCA as it happens :) And of course they can go on cop duty for a rp way.
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Good idea to create such a topic. People need to realise that admins are really busy in-game and are trying to look into every report.
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and people ask me where is my phone :lol:
no rly i tried to call you many times but you got no phone D:
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I already experienced these problems and I had dealt with some of them Successfully and some of them not.I am a human being ,right!
I was an admin on a minor SA:MP server and I know administrating very well...As It was a minor server ( 40 players max ) I can be sure and I know this duty is challenging and I think I'm competent for this duty.I am administrating a warez forum already,Moderating in L4D server.Administrators job is not ban/warn/banana/power/fulfilling members wishes.its about listening to members thoughts and applying it..Well that policy I ran when I was an administrator..It can get strenuously sometimes,but patience and sedulity are the main key...
Another point is that every member has the same treatment,no one benefits from your position !
and you must be indifferent which is sometimes hard to accomplish
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Admin work is fun, admin work is easy, you need to have a big knowledge of which situations to use what commands or what verbal warnings to give, and once you have learnt how to do that over many months/years, you can RP while doing admin work because most situations require little thinking...
Admin work is all a big experience...I enjoyed it, by the end I could be in the middle of a 207 and also dealing with a hacker, a DMer, a carjacker and a flamer in main chat, all while still negociating and coordinating units...
Ninja :x?
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Ninja :x?
No.....Jcstodds is a ninja :D