Argonath RPG - A World of its own
GTA:SA => SA:MP - San Andreas Multiplayer => SA:MP General => Topic started by: iMunna on May 06, 2010, 12:42:33 am
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It's over before I actually predicted it would be. The end result? A success. :)
Ideas from the regulars and veterans in order to make a sophisticated community. (http://www.argonathrpg.eu/forum/index.php?topic=55632.0)
Archive:
As Argonath has been facing constant rule breakers and hopeless individuals, I have chosen to take into my responsibility the alteration that Argonath needs. Argonath is a community based off of many cultures and beliefs. Argonath is a community based on free role play and freedom of speech. In exchange, Argonath expects its members to respect and defend Argonath at all accounts. Argonath expects its members to respect developers and admins for their admirable hard work. Argonath expects its members to play fair and treat other members the way they want to be treated. Argonath has been receiving very few of these appeals and instead receives violent disrespect to the community and its members. I seek to change this via investigating a members characteristics and experience at Argonath. I will make sure that each member evaluated is enjoying their time at Argonath and receiving respect from fellow members. For the next few months, I will be working with selected members privately in order to accomplish my goal. I hope to meet many willing members throughout this evaluation. I hope this plan helps create a better Argonath for newcomers, regulars, and veterans.
I believe a member can be disciplined through discussing the issue instead of an instant ban from the server. I hope to prove to everyone that this theory works in the next few months. Selected members will be randomly selected based on status and asked to join my private channel. You will be asked personal questions (which you have the right to deny to answer or take part in) that will help us find identical problems throughout Argonath and hopefully fix those problems. You will remain completely anonymous throughout the research and will be treated equally. If you refuse to take part in the evaluation, you will be left alone with no questions asked guaranteed. If you have any complaints against this or comments, you are welcome to post and debate here.
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Interesting..
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Interesting..
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When I was trying to help a member, by discussing to him and asking what was up, I was pming the admins at the same time asking to let me as a normal player just help.
Instead, the player was kicked, muted , warned, I'm 100% sure this bs didn't help him or the situation or anyone.
I never was able to find out what happened or what was wrong, as he was forced to bottle his rage and feelings.
No one hardly respects anyone any more, everyone thinks myself is just a glory seeking, ass licking noob who wants to be an admin, and simply feel it is ok to flame and go around being macho because there friends are admins judges FBI SAPD or w.e.
When I was much newer I wanted people to stop there constant Bullshit to freecops, but, I did not always gloat 24/7 that the admins understood the concern I had.
When I ran for SF Mayor, I did just to see what people thought of this unique rp, but as I later was shocked to see, Tai made one before me for LS.
I had the idea, but then it looked that i was just a glory whore, and they simply did not want me to rp what I wanted to do.
All the official crap that has to be made by the "state" , it's demotivating and upsetting.
I've lost hopes in the court system, simply because judge = will become admin, or has his views hindered by his chosen career, this may not apply to all, but it does apply to one judge I know.
Don't get me wrong, when I saw someone said "I thought you was smart because you was old" (Old) , I lol'd hard. Thinking "How old does he think he is?", everyone is learning no matter there age.
I've lost faith in the "law structure" rp part, simply because of all the laws, and basic lazyness, which pulls back argonath. the simple things, like laws always changing, people not being allowed to express there opinion regarding anything which would be going on in the future, people just being seen as negative constantly, always being negative, and always taking the game too seriously, not thinking about the consequences.
When I've tried to create and bring up the BCA to be a major helping force, similar to what i9 has been trying to do, I've been put down with people who say I am an annoying spammer with my adverts, who think because Pancher allowed me to use Floor 2 of LS cityhall ( the BCA rather) means I like to regard my self as some top cop big man, although I am defiantly one, no doubt about that.
The blatant disrespect and all these complicated laws, rules and bullshit from some members who think they are all this or that, has not helped me in any way or any form, as a normal regular player.
As I am a Paruni admin, and as I've had to be tough on players on Paruni sa:mp server (83.169.10.249:7777), they feel I cannot rp or I am a complete abuser whilst I want to rp on ArgonathRPG.
The lack of any sign of apreciation for some
Personally I've given up on almost all hopes here. I will consider doing my last bits, then moving on.
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i really like this. goodluck with it.
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Sign me up! Any chance to express how I feel about Argonath today will be accepted by me :D
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At first I thought the topic said "Extermination" I was like "WHAT THE FUCK!? *click*"
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At first I thought the topic said "Extermination" I was like "WHAT THE f**k!? *click*"
I wake up and check the forums "Extermination of regulars and veterans in order to make a sohisticated community.
WTF?
Re-read it and was like "Ah..."
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orlyyy
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Inferno 9 shouldn't be the only group involved in this, everyone in the community should be involved in this. If you're causing issues or problems with both new players, regulars, or even admins, please stop and think about your actions and what it is doing to the community. All of you guys are always talking about the "old days", how things were performing back then compared to now. Stop talking about the old days when you can take actions that can benefit the community.
If there are problems, do not hesitate to ask questions to the community and finding the solution, instead of becoming a grumpy hermit - your attitude influence others in a good or bad way.
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Interesting..
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Frank should not let others use his posts.
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Frank should not let others use his posts.
This was idea of Dwayne, that's why he posted this topic i guess.
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This was idea of Dwayne, that's why he posted this topic i guess.
Could be. However all players should note that this operation is not an official one, cooperation is entirely voluntary and while we will be interested in the outcome, there is no guarantee that the server owners will act on it.
Inferno9 is a group and is no different from other groups like Corleone, Gvardia or any other.
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If this gets done (which is impossible) then I will have a complete different perspective to Argonath.
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Who is a relatively new group like Inferno 9 to judge the whole Argonath server, and many of it's regular players who were here before many of the members in Inferno 9?
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Who is a relatively new group like Inferno 9 to judge the whole Argonath server, and many of it's regular players who were here before many of the members in Inferno 9?
Exactly.
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Inferno9 is a group and is no different from other groups like Corleone, Gvardia or any other.
Well spoken, people sees i9 as they are the "elite" of Argonath.
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Well spoken, people sees i9 as they are the "elite" of Argonath.
And that's what they call themselves. :cop:
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This is bullshit in my eyes, players like myself, Deejay, Curse, Leon_Gvardia, Cofiliano_Gvardia, Giac, and an hell of a lot more help new players every day, then i9 come in and take over that, and a lot of newcomers start refusing our help because Frank can afford to advertise every twenty seconds. And now i9 are going to be "Watching us". I myself do not think Frank should be letting i9 do these things, watching players is the admin's jobs. No offence to Dwayne, but you've been here for like 2 months, and I like you and all, but it was a bad idea for you to post this.
I completely disagree with this, i9 has no right to be "examining the server". Frank, if you want people to do this - "/a anyone wanna volunteer to do this job for me."
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And that's what they call themselves. :cop:
tsk, whats next? All i9 become an admin?
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It's an good idea but not only i9 has the 'authority' to do these things. This project should be open and accessable for all regulars and veterans, not only i9 themselves.
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It's an good idea but not only i9 has the 'authority' to do these things. This project should be open and accessable for all regulars and veterans, not only i9 themselves.
I9 has no authority, just like every other group in SAMP. Admins and Developers are the only ones who have any authority.
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Who is a relatively new group like Inferno 9 to judge the whole Argonath server, and many of it's regular players who were here before many of the members in Inferno 9?
You misunderstood. i9 will not judge the whole Argonath server. it will talk to regular and veteran members of Argonath ( like yourself) and then make a summary of what they found out. Like what do the Argonath veterans and regular players think, what can be done better for the sake of the community. And then they present it to the Administrators team. Then it is already admins team decision, will they act upon it, or not.
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You misunderstood. i9 will not judge the whole Argonath server. it will talk to regular and veteran members of Argonath ( like yourself) and then make a summary of what they found out. Like what do the Argonath veterans and regular players think, what can be done better for the sake of the community. And then they present it to the Administrators team. Then it is already admins team decision, will they act upon it, or not.
This is not something for Inferno 9 to do, this is something for the admin team to do. I didn't misunderstand, I said exactly what they are doing. They are judging us, talking to us, getting information from us, etc. It isn't their responsibility to do this, as most of them aren't even in a position to be judging others, especially those with more experience on the server than them. I'm not saying I don't agree with it, I'm only saying that I won't stand here as a 3 year veteran who has been a part of the Criminal world since then, and be judged by people who don't even remember RS2.
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Could be. However all players should note that this operation is not an official one, cooperation is entirely voluntary and while we will be interested in the outcome, there is no guarantee that the server owners will act on it.
Inferno9 is a group and is no different from other groups like Corleone, Gvardia or any other.
This idea was completely started by me. I requested that Inferno 9 represent me in this cause and they accepted. We also discussed that all groups are allowed to join in and accommodate us throughout the process. This is completely volunteer work, I expect to earn nothing in return.
We will not be "judging" the whole community.
This is bullshit in my eyes, players like myself, Deejay, Curse, Leon_Gvardia, Cofiliano_Gvardia, Giac, and an hell of a lot more help new players every day, then i9 come in and take over that, and a lot of newcomers start refusing our help because Frank can afford to advertise every twenty seconds. And now i9 are going to be "Watching us". I myself do not think Frank should be letting i9 do these things, watching players is the admin's jobs. No offence to Dwayne, but you've been here for like 2 months, and I like you and all, but it was a bad idea for you to post this.
I completely disagree with this, i9 has no right to be "examining the server". Frank, if you want people to do this - "/a anyone wanna volunteer to do this job for me."
You have the right to join us. You have the right to refuse to be examined.
tsk, whats next? All i9 become an admin?
That will not be happening.
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You have the right to join us. You have the right to refuse to be examined.
So you will be allowing others to do this too?
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So basically what you are doing, is saying that the developers share your views. Make your own views up, then hold all other players to the standards that you want them to have, and tell the developers to take action? I don't think so.
Who are you to even think about something like this?
You are not a governing council, and do not speak for all the players, why do you think you have the right to do this?
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So you will be allowing others to do this too?
Exactly.
So basically what you are doing, is saying that the developers share your views. Make your own views up, then hold all other players to the standards that you want them to have, and tell the developers to take action? I don't think so.
Who are you to even think about something like this?
You are not a governing council, and do not speak for all the players, why do you think you have the right to do this?
I will not be basing any opinions off of this examination. I will not be judging members based off of this examination. I will be finding issues within the community, within the individual, and within the leadership.
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This is some test to prove you're a veteran or?...
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I'm only saying that I won't stand here as a 3 year veteran who has been a part of the Criminal world since then, and be judged by people who don't even remember RS2.
Well spoken Maxy.
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This is not something for Inferno 9 to do, this is something for the admin team to do. I didn't misunderstand, I said exactly what they are doing. They are judging us, talking to us, getting information from us, etc. It isn't their responsibility to do this, as most of them aren't even in a position to be judging others, especially those with more experience on the server than them. I'm not saying I don't agree with it, I'm only saying that I won't stand here as a 3 year veteran who has been a part of the Criminal world since then, and be judged by people who don't even remember RS2.
Since when is doing research, judging?
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USAA has decided from the start of its carreer to not judge on people's past except for criminals pasts. Also the Green Rebels give every player a chance to join them, no matter how long you play, we all threat people the same way.
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Jubin, you don't understand, and for your past, you should.
This is not work for i9, this is admin work, always has been, its not all about /ban - its about making sure everyone is happy. The i9 tag seems to be worshipped on this server, all because Frank throws money about.
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Inferno 9 shouldn't be the only group involved in this, everyone in the community should be involved in this. If you're causing issues or problems with both new players, regulars, or even admins, please stop and think about your actions and what it is doing to the community. All of you guys are always talking about the "old days", how things were performing back then compared to now. Stop talking about the old days when you can take actions that can benefit the community.
If there are problems, do not hesitate to ask questions to the community and finding the solution, instead of becoming a grumpy hermit - your attitude influence others in a good or bad way.
So why should i9 suddenly get the right to do what they please? Oh wait we all know.
Because frank is a Community leader - New moderator wave; and i9 is STRAIGHT on, coincidence ?
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So why should i9 suddenly get the right to do what they please? Oh wait we all know.
Because frank is a Community leader - New moderator wave; and i9 is STRAIGHT on, coincidence ?
Get your facts straight and re-read who were the new moderators.
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Get your facts straight and re-read who were the new moderators.
[i9]Jimmy_Cuneo
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[i9]Jimmy_Cuneo
And he got picked because he had what it takes for a possible administrator. Don't start accuse Frank on this one as I don't think you got solid proof that he only got accepted because they both are related to i9. But I know what you are trying to say, but this one Jimmy he is :cool:
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Great idea ill answer.
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"We will not be "judging" the whole community. All of my reports will be summarized and given to developers for further actions."
I'm currently very confused what you mean by your 'reports' about the whole community. I personally think instead of focusing on everybody, everybody has to focus on themselves. Besides, what will developers do as further actions? it's stated before that if you do not like Argonath, you are free to leave. The admins are doing practically everything in their power to keep the server clean from disrespect / flames / rulebreaks.
So if you'd ask me, I think we are doing everything the wrong way.
Why would we need a system that examinates every regulars and veterans? Seriously what could be the actual outcome of this? You will see nothing we, the most of argonathRPG, already know. Sure we make a fuss about something small sometimes, sure we make some wrong decisions sometimes. So? Only prooves we are humans, and humans sometimes make the wrong call, otherwise life wouldn't even be interesting. And why would you limit this judgement towards the regulars and the veterans only. Since you claim your group I9 helps new players (and i'm not saying they aren't). Instead of saying the worlds 'Regulars' and 'veterans' in such kind of context, define those words first.
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This seems to me to be extremely biased. Your looking at players from the "i9" Perspective which seams unfair in my eyes. I dont think people need to watched to see how well they act / perticipate on the server.
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This is not something for Inferno 9 to do, this is something for the admin team to do. I didn't misunderstand, I said exactly what they are doing.
Anyone can watch players, as long as they don't imply that they are admins or special in any way because they are watching.
Besides, you are always watching and judging people based on their actions simply by playing.
and be judged by people who don't even remember RS2.
Why do you need to remember RS2 to judge people? Just another case of a big ego just because you're a veteran IMO..
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Inferno 9 shouldn't be the only group involved in this, everyone in the community should be involved in this.
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[i9]Jimmy_Cuneo
Jimmy always shown the profile of beeing a good Administrator/Moderator even before he was in i9.
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No thank you. We can co-operate like groups should do, but this is ridicules.
Like Brad said, groups have their own ways of helping people, new comers and veterans. We definitely have our own way, and we help develop a lot of good members of the Community today.
But we don't brag about, we don't talk about it, we don't open debates about it. We just work on it.
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Intresting..
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The i9 tag seems to be worshipped on this server, all because Frank throws money about.
Shit you nailed it right there..
i9 is being promoted using admin resources by doing paydays of for example: $9999, or just $9. I don't mind paydays, hell who does? But indeed, using it to promote i9 is a no go if you ask me.
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Y'all jealous.
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Shit you nailed it right there..
i9 is being promoted using admin resources by doing paydays of for example: $9999, or just $9. I don't mind paydays, hell who does? But indeed, using it to promote i9 is a no go if you ask me.
It's not an [i9:PAYDAY], it's an "Economic Stimulus" - I think you're mixing the fact of Frank beeing now a Community leader with the fact of he having a RP group, I9.
I've sponsored $999 paydays while I was in Inferno 9 - mostly paid after winning random lottos :p
For example, you wish to promote your group and you figure the best way to do it It's through a payday.
Let's imagine the group is: Group12, Tag: [G12] - You can sponsor a $1212 payday or even a $12 one but if it was [G10] would you blame admins of promoting [G10] when they do a $1000 payday?
I think it has nothing to do with :)
RegardS
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Hold your horses! :razz:
First of all, let me make it clear that my community leading role strongly differentiates from my membership in Inferno 9 which as far as I'm concerned does not conflict, overlap or prove incompatible. In relations to my influence in Inferno 9, I vacated the Inferno 9 leadership position for other talent (Jimmy Cueno) to takeover and run whilst I prioritised my workload in favour of the greater community. All decisions made in Inferno 9 are based on a group votes for which this proposition was not exempt from.
Inferno 9 is not or never has been an official group. I'm not sure where this rumour came from from but I can confirm it is completely untrue although I wish it was. :rofl: Whilst it may be unique from other groups in consensus, management and tradition it does not benefit from any 'third party hand'.
In the defence of Dwayne, he is enthusiastic, committed to self development and to producing work of a high standard. He works very well with the rest of Inferno 9 and brings a refreshing outlook (being new) from which we all may benefit from. After his initiation period at Inferno 9, he was appointed deputy-leader where Jimmy started to give him responsibility for some aspects within the Inferno 9. In all observations, he is demonstrating a real passion and positive flare for continuous improvement which others may benefit from looking at.
Looking at the original post, I do not agree with it to a certain extent because it was wrong to post it at such an early stage of development. A majority agree, as highlighted through the feedback on this topic.
From what I gather in Dwayne's post, he wants to primarily focus on group leaders who have track records for sustainability and positive contributions. From which he and other interested parties can collate responses in aim of setting trends, scope for improvement and ultimately a submission of results to the owners for evaluation. In terms of ethical consideration, it should use an approach which is operated on a volunteered basis with no penalties imposed for not participating. To avoid bias and unethical adjustments, it would be in the interest of the project to engage a wide audience and controllers which can involve other group leaders.
Whilst I say this, the idea should be calibrated with community input under SA:MP ideas. From my view, this project would complement the yet to be announced A.R.U.N project well. This should be open to discussion where all contributions are welcome in aim of improving the idea.
In relations to the comments about Inferno 9 members becoming moderators as a direct result of my appointment are untrue. All decisions regarding the appointment of moderators are strictly made on a team basis.
Summary:
- There is no conflict between two distinct roles
- Inferno 9 is not or never has been an official group
- Whilst Dwayne is new, he brings an refreshing outlook
- This topic has been misunderstood due to lack of experience and misrepresentation
- This idea should be discussed on SA:MP ideas board
- No decision regarding Inferno 9 moderators/admins have been made on a sole basis.
Frank should not let others use his posts.
He brainstormed this idea independently, which he also posted on his own merits. :razz:
Dwayne, would you like me to move this topic to SA:MP ideas? :)
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So you are saying Frank did all paydays out of his own pocket?
And no, it is not called an [i9:PAYDAY] just like Hitler didn't say he was gassing Jews in cold blood. See where I'm going with this?
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So you are saying Frank did all paydays out of his own pocket?
And no, it is not called an [i9:PAYDAY] just like Hitler didn't say he was gassing Jews in cold blood. See where I'm going with this?
Of course most of them it wasn't from his pocket, but maybe the admin who did the payday (which weren't possibly Frank) didn't think he would be "promoting" i9...
Regards.
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Anyone can watch players, as long as they don't imply that they are admins or special in any way because they are watching.
Besides, you are always watching and judging people based on their actions simply by playing.
Why do you need to remember RS2 to judge people? Just another case of a big ego just because you're a veteran IMO..
Yeah, but I'm not relaying that information to the developers. What he is saying, even in the topic is that he wants to "Examine" or watch, judge, whatever, the veterans to get opinions. To make a "Sophisticated Community" implying that we are doing something wrong, or that it isn't already sophisticated.
It's not a case of me having a big ego, but I don't really know how much a person who has been here significantly less time than me can tell me how to better play on this server and be more "sophisticated".
Argonath is about fun, about doing what you want and about roleplaying to an extent, but it is definitely not about being sophisticated. The fact that something like this is being thought of shows me that under the cover of being helpful, he is trying to reshape the player base in HIS image, so he can have a more comfortable playing environment.
Subsequently the players will look up to him and respect him more, because he remade them the way he wanted to. So what this looks like to me, is a manipulative attempt to make the players follow him.
It once again shows young I9's elitist attitude that so many people who have ACTUALLY been here long enough to call themselves the finest, have come to resent.
I speak for a large portion of the groups when I say that I9 is a young group, that should perhaps focus on it's OWN improvement before trying to improve the whole server.
Post Merge: May 06, 2010, 07:42:08 pm
So you are saying Frank did all paydays out of his own pocket?
And no, it is not called an [i9:PAYDAY] just like Hitler didn't say he was gassing Jews in cold blood. See where I'm going with this?
inb4 "OMG U R SAYING FRANK IS HITLER"
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The idea of Dwayne reflects the idea of (among others) Frank that we should create a citizen council, where regular players can be represented as well as new ones to give and promote ideas. It may have been posed a bit different, but it is a similar idea as has been proposed behind closed doors.
The idea of giving players the chance to tell, in a contributing and positive way, what they see and wish to change is something that we are not blind to.
HOWEVER.
The idea should be organised by the developers and leaders, not by players.
For the I have a very strong reason, which comes from my background of no-nonsense management.
If you create or open a group where ideas, irritations and suggestions for the future are discussed, you have to give this group a real and clear contributing role.
In modern management and politics you often see that there is a group created with no other use or intention then to let people vent their feelings. The group has no realistic contribution, however because people could write something they believe tehy have made one. On Argonath such a group will not be created by the developers as it is totally useless.
If we will create something, it wil have a use and a realistic chance of making a contributions. A.R.U.N. is one of those thngs, which is why it is supported.
Yesterday I discussed with Romeo (yeah shocking, I know), and I told him one of the reasons for the current criminals vs cops debate.
In our original scripts and designs, there were two roles. Cop and Non-cop.
If you take ur current scripts and you compare the part of cop and of non-cop, you will see that the non-cop support is larger as the cop. However over time there are not two roles on server but three. Cop - citizen - criminal.
It will take a better planning and adaptation to that model to make the three roles equal. For this we need to shoot some ideas at the trusted leaders of the official groups, as they are the ones who can give answers on the usefullness, and that will be the main role of A.R.U.N. groups department.
Instead of a citizens council, we have the SA:MP ideas forum. This is a place where people can shoot in random ideas. As you can see, 90% of the ideas are similar or exactly the same, and are countered by our players or scripters.
However the 10% remaining ideas are examined and checked to be useful and feasible. From this 10% in the end only 1% willl make it, leaving 99% of the ideas forum as uselesss junk, and giving the impression that we are not really loking at them.
If we make a citizens council, it should not have the same fate as the SA:MP ideas area, being 99% useless and 1% contributing. We do not want empty promises and sitting in meetings that change nothing. And we certainly will not ever give the control over the direction and vision of Argonath to the players.
We value our players and wish to listen to their complaints. In many cases we see far ahead of them, however that does not mean we should stop listening. The 1% of SA:MP ideas has proven as valuable as contributions from developers and scripters, make no mistake. However we are the ones who decide which 1% is useful, and that will remain.
When the time is right, and we can find a realistic use, we can make a citizens council. Until that time everyone can bring in reports and ideas, and we will thank people for their effort. But do not expect more than 1% to be found back in our sctipts, direction and vision.
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I think we all know that people who don't wana be nice with others will never become one,even by force.So,instead of speaking,let's do something! i9 already began taking actions to get the community a bit better than it was,and we can already see results,although i think they are quite minor.What i want to say,is that words may help,but they do half the job.Actions do the other half.Let's do something about this instead of shouting our mouths off. Anyone disagree?
-Hwaldar Richards
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Before i9, there was nothing like this, yet we had 100+ people on the server, we got official status, everything was going good.
i9 comes and everyone stopped helping new players, 15+ of our 100 players are AFK'ing for the extreme ammount of paydays, give it a week and money will be useless. Before i9 came, there was no need for these "examinations" - so why should they be neccisary now?
But, I'm only one voice, if these do take part, I plead that you make sure everyone you are asking knows they do not have to answer, and don't ask them a thing untill they confirm they want to share this information, as I know some people will just answer because the questions were thrown on them.
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Hold on your Horses FFS...
I Like the idea but every citzen who is interessed in this idea should be apart of this...
I9 Shouldnt be involved on this...
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Before i9, there was nothing like this, yet we had 100+ people on the server, we got official status, everything was going good.
i9 comes and everyone stopped helping new players, 15+ of our 100 players are AFK'ing for the extreme ammount of paydays, give it a week and money will be useless. Before i9 came, there was no need for these "examinations" - so why should they be neccisary now?
But, I'm only one voice, if these do take part, I plead that you make sure everyone you are asking knows they do not have to answer, and don't ask them a thing untill they confirm they want to share this information, as I know some people will just answer because the questions were thrown on them.
Are you blaming [i9] for all argonath problems? Not helping new players? Have you EVER hanged out with them, before you talk, you should do a research, then you would know how wrong your post is.
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Are you blaming [i9] for all argonath problems? Not helping new players? Have you EVER hanged out with them, before you talk, you should do a research, then you would know how wrong your post is.
Did you think there? or are you just seeing red?
I'm not saying i9 caused the problems, I'm saying i9 questioned them, and we all lived happily until they were questioned.
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Did you think there? or are you just seeing red?
I'm not saying i9 caused the problems, I'm saying i9 questioned them, and we all lived happily until they were questioned.
And you're unhappy because of i9 - It's simply a group...
They're free to do whatever they want, as long as they keep Argonath rules, and so are you.
It's not up to you to be judge them.
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Before i9, there was nothing like this, yet we had 100+ people on the server, we got official status, everything was going good.
i9 comes and everyone stopped helping new players, 15+ of our 100 players are AFK'ing for the extreme ammount of paydays, give it a week and money will be useless. Before i9 came, there was no need for these "examinations" - so why should they be neccisary now?
But, I'm only one voice, if these do take part, I plead that you make sure everyone you are asking knows they do not have to answer, and don't ask them a thing untill they confirm they want to share this information, as I know some people will just answer because the questions were thrown on them.
Holy shit dude, you're totally right on this. However a week? Nah..
But indeed, ask one how to earn money on the server, 9/10 of people will say payday/lotto.
The current lotto count is on something like 2500 or so.. which is ALOT!
If every lotto would be just 20K that would be 50million pumped into the 'economy', so far.
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And you're unhappy because of i9 - It's simply a group...
They're free to do whatever they want, as long as they keep Argonath rules, and so are you.
It's not up to you to be judge them.
And is it up to them to be "Examining" me?
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I really don't want anyone to stalk me, and watch every move I take. I'm fine with my actions ingame, as I know I'm not breaking any rules.
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At first I thought the topic said "Extermination" I was like "WHAT THE f**k!? *click*"
thats scary
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Why on earth did this turn into a flame i9 topic? They have done morefor the people than anyone else I have ever seen (excluding creators of server etc). Many people run round this server rich as fuck going 'look at me I'm powerful'. i9 have nevee done, well at least I've never seen them do this. I thinks it's great that a group out there is for the people, because a lot of you go around thinking it's every man for himself. Also, how do you define regulars and veterans. Is regualr someone who has consistently come on for say 1 month, or 6? How can we create specific guidelines on this?
Look guys, i9, like frank said, is not an official group, but their leader happens to be the community leader.
People who were saying jimmy got moderator because of i9 is bullshit. He was a great character before i9. And as a moderator, he has been a fantastic help to me, will always answer, and answers to the best of his knowledge. There's some admins out there, who if they don't know the answer, they say nothing, don't have the decency to reply, jimmy, and also Hwaldar Richards to be fair have been great in answering my questions.
I know some of you may respond saying how dare I talk about this as if I've been here from the beginning, like I'm a veteran. I acknowledge I am not a veteran, but as a regular, and in the relatively short amount of time I've been here (10 months) I have seen a few people come and to, because they don't know what they are doing, so they leave and lose interest. i9 have helped players in this situation more than I've seen anyone else.
Rant over ^^
Regards, Joe
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Why on earth did this turn into a flame i9 topic? They have done morefor the people than anyone else I have ever seen
I read that far, then gave up.
I have been helping new players for a very long time, and only one time has anyone ever thanked me for it (ty Vince <3) I was more than damn happy helping new players, without any thanking, go back in the groups pages. I've never felt the need to make a group to "help people" because its common decency. I wont dispute i9 help people, I know they do, but they make it look like they are the only ones.
I bet if I made an advertisement everytime I helped someone, I'd be in their situation right now. In my eyes, popularization of being a nice person is unneccisary, we should all be helping newcomers anyway.
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I didn't say noone else helps, I said they help more than I have ever seen anyone else. Ie MORE THAN I HAVE EVER SEEN.
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I didn't say noone else helps, I said they help more than I have ever seen anyone else. Ie MORE THAN I HAVE EVER SEEN.
And what you see is law?
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i9 is a joke. it's supposed to be a criminal group, and it's conducting national surveys? i9 is exactly like RI, except with more suspects in play. criminal groups should actually be criminal groups, not corporations. like really, what's up with protests, parades, and fight clubs?
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And what you see is law?
Are you retarded?
I can only judge on what I can see. What you know means fuck all. It's what other people think that they judge you on
Stop twisting my lines into bases to form your lies.
Joe
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I only see talking and talking... nothing is made.
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i9 is a joke. it's supposed to be a criminal group, and it's conducting national surveys? i9 is exactly like RI, except with more suspects in play. criminal groups should actually be criminal jokes, not corporations. like really, what's up with protests, parades, and fight clubs?
#
You're kinda right, to be honest.
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"We will not be "judging" the whole community. All of my reports will be summarized and given to developers for further actions."
I'm currently very confused what you mean by your 'reports' about the whole community. I personally think instead of focusing on everybody, everybody has to focus on themselves. Besides, what will developers do as further actions? it's stated before that if you do not like Argonath, you are free to leave. The admins are doing practically everything in their power to keep the server clean from disrespect / flames / rulebreaks.
So if you'd ask me, I think we are doing everything the wrong way.
Why would we need a system that examinates every regulars and veterans? Seriously what could be the actual outcome of this? You will see nothing we, the most of argonathRPG, already know. Sure we make a fuss about something small sometimes, sure we make some wrong decisions sometimes. So? Only prooves we are humans, and humans sometimes make the wrong call, otherwise life wouldn't even be interesting. And why would you limit this judgement towards the regulars and the veterans only. Since you claim your group I9 helps new players (and i'm not saying they aren't). Instead of saying the worlds 'Regulars' and 'veterans' in such kind of context, define those words first.
I am sorry for a late reply. Good question. I define a regular or veteran as a member who is active here or in game every week. They struggle to make a daily paycheck and understand the rules. And finally, they struggle to fit into the community. I wish to find problems that are common among players at Argonath. These problems can range from players constantly flaming each other in main chat even after being unbanned or kicked to players having issues from a specific script or rule. Why do they do such things knowing that such consequences will occur? Why do players experience violence and hatred towards each other? I will be asking these questions indirectly in my examinations. I will be comparing the answers and writing a brief summary on each issue. The summaries will be sent to developers to examine and eventually work to make the community better, stronger, and safer.
The idea should be organised by the developers and leaders, not by players.
The reason I, as a newbie/regular, have decided to make the decision of examining players knowing I will not gain anything or be promoted is simple. My reputation will not be "destroyed" or "ruined" because I am only new here. I will have no biased against any player because I barely know anyone outside of my group. And finally, I have personal skills in counseling friends and family in real life.
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Damn,but i got quite angry seeing how some guy doesnt like those who help people for some personal reasons. I bet he was badly beated up by i9 and now he does mild nerdraging (i hope he doesnt do that). I find no reason to blame i9 at the moment,so instead of blaming people,take a look at yourself.Answer yourself a question of "Am i a good guy?" and then judge others.
By the way,i wana join this project,i find it interesting
-Hwaldar Richards
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Damn,but i got quite angry seeing how some guy doesnt like those who help people for some personal reasons. I bet he was badly beated up by i9 and now he does mild nerdraging (i hope he doesnt do that). I find no reason to blame i9 at the moment,so instead of blaming people,take a look at yourself.Answer yourself a question of "Am i a good guy?" and then judge others.
By the way,i wana join this project,i find it interesting
-Hwaldar Richards
No one has said they dont like new players being helped.
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Regulars and Veterans will get mad at this for different reasons, not because they dislike I9.
Also, to make this clear, I help every new player that asks me, and I accept many new players into Araatus and turn them into good respectable members, as I have done with my fair share of people. There are many ex Araatus members who are now in high positions, and I won't stand here and be told that I don't help people as much as I9, or god forbid even less. We all contribute our part, albeit in the shadows, or maybe not mainstream. But this issue has been solved already. Just wanted to drop another 2 cents before I go on my trip this weekend.
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Regulars and Veterans will get mad at this for different reasons, not because they dislike I9.
Also, to make this clear, I help every new player that asks me, and I accept many new players into Araatus and turn them into good respectable members, as I have done with my fair share of people. There are many ex Araatus members who are now in high positions, and I won't stand here and be told that I don't help people as much as I9, or god forbid even less. We all contribute our part, albeit in the shadows, or maybe not mainstream. But this issue has been solved already. Just wanted to drop another 2 cents before I go on my trip this weekend.
Have a good weekend :)
You can choose if you want to partake or not, then you'll be not "examinated"
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Why on earth did this turn into a flame i9 topic? They have done morefor the people than anyone else I have ever seen (excluding creators of server etc).
You know that money is not always the solution for problems?, I am not here to rant i9 but I would to know what morefor they have done. I'm confused as the creators of the server created this, how would i9 be playing here if they have not contributed all this time and effort.
What i9 has done for me, some paychecks I think.
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Aight,before i go outa here,here's what i wana say:
Enough speaking useless things,and let's get to work finally! The longer we argue about some nonsence,the more this project will be delayed,maybe even making it fail at some point.
That's why,i'm in this project.When we begin?
-Hwaldar Richards
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The fact that the percentage of regulars helping new players has dropped after the advent of Inferno 9 [i9] is not the group's fault, but rather the fault of those regulars who have gotten lazy simply because a group dedicates itself to helping new players.
As regulars and veterans who know more than the new players, we are all in a position to help them.
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Sooo, to get this straight, you are going to interview different regulars and veterans tooooo... Make them tell a story about how they think of the community on the server?... What is wrong with that? Why moan? :neutral:
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Let him do this, what's up with the argue anyway?
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Aight,before i go outa here,here's what i wana say:
Enough speaking useless things,and let's get to work finally! The longer we argue about some nonsence,the more this project will be delayed,maybe even making it fail at some point.
That's why,i'm in this project.When we begin?
-Hwaldar Richards
oh, the new admin around.
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What the hell is wrong with you people?
You fight for a silly reason here... keep in your minds: Argonath does NOT enforce someone to help people! Groups who help people are doing it just cause they WANT it on their OWN.
If you believe Inferno 9 stole your "help", What the f**k... Everyone is free to help... instead of moaning, just start a group together and help people.. There! The solution.
Why do you even care for who helps people the most eh? Yes, Frank may have the ability to do an /ad whenever he wants due to him being able by funds or so.. but that doesn't mean other groups are not allowed to help newbies!
/ad is not the only way to attract new players.. a good way to do so, is to give them a warm welcome, by standing on LSAP Spawn point ;)
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/ad is not the only way to attract new players.. a good way to do so, is to give them a warm welcome, by standing on LSAP Spawn point ;)
In once did that with Frank, Jethro_Smith and some other guys, I only ot one person who I helped, the others just Dmed us or weren't looking for help. I remember this one guy, he spawned and we rushed at him with 4/5 people and he was like ''WTF?'' We explained him everything too fast and he was like ''... Can I please just play?'' And we all backed off. :lol:
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The examinations have turned out to be a real success. Players offer great information about their experience and honest complaints. I will be announcing ideas and issues directly to the owners of Argonath.
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This is a very unnecessary. All the groups saying they welcome new players, especially Gvardia, are just bullshit to make it look like they are a nice and happy group. When I joined this server, only one person said hi and welcome to the server, everyone else didn't give a fuck.
Then, when I came to Gas Station 9, I heard about it being one of the "elites" of Argonath and being nice and above others. I asked for some help, two of i9 members ignored me and carried on their jobs. Others were passing me and calling me a noob for putting my Taxi on the side of the road.
Then, I went to a meeting with one of the ARU agents. The meeting had some Gvardia members and one of another group. Two of the three were highly ranked, and one of them being Brad. The other made insults and asked me directly, "Do you think I am a n00b, Ralph?". Brad on the other hand was making excuses saying he couldn't be demoted from Gvardia for being so highly ranked.
See where this is going? All the groups and personal individuals keep claiming that they help new players, while in the end, they keep on saying that i9 is a group helping "n00bz" and that their members should not hang around Gas Station 9 area.
Helping new players is a trend, not something that is actually done. What is the percent of those staying on Argonath after there first visit? The supposed helpers usually don't give a fuck and try to say that they are getting something done, but obviously not.
There is one individual who is the best person to take care of the migration on the server. Curse. He is always on the job helping people and he creates great organizations and tries to be on /hduty all the time. Curse was the most sincere person to me and is the only one who answers my questions on public chat.
So all those claiming that they help new players, look again. I am a new person and only one person greeted me. Someone suggested me to come at a busier time. I did, same issue, and even more ignorance in public chat.
And this isn't an issue with role-play. A few days ago, I was flying a helicopter, trying to help some suspects to evade from cops. I was called n00b in PM from one of them, and then a famous officer and the suspects teamed up and took down my helicopter with SMGs, probably thinking I was another nooby who plays and then quits and never comes again.
It's a trend, not something that people do because they want to help.
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There are only 3 possible reasons for regulars and others to help new players.
1. They want to receive more admiration from the community, aka self-oriented intentions.
2. They are going along with the trend, possibly with reason 1 included as well.
3. They sincerely want to help the new players.
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I am working on the project alone. Others are welcome to help. The reason I am "iMunna" in game is because I left Inferno 9 to fully dedicate all of my time on this project. It is not helping newcomers. It is helping regulars and veterans. I will never give up on this project no matter what kind of negative feedback I get. I have been attacked, insulted, and flamed ever since I began this project and don't really care for them. I am dedicated to making this project something members all across Argonath look up to and say, "if he can do it, I can too."
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I'm in too.
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Name changed to evaluation as it has a better tone to the project.
evaluation: act of ascertaining or fixing the value or worth of
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iMunna your project is not supported by anyone (exept admins). Start to read the archive before posting threads.
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iMunna your project is not supported by anyone (exept admins). Start to read the archive before posting threads.
I only look at the positives, not the negatives. That's why I never get muted, warned, kicked, temp banned, or banned. :)
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Don't smile to me, I am speaking for the people your 'project' is concerned about.
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I'd appreciate if you did NOT go around asking people about me, or what your ruitines are. Cross me off your "list"
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Don't smile to me, I am speaking for the people your 'project' is concerned about.
who allocated you as the representative of regulars and veterans. Only speak for yourself because to be honest everyone will have different opinions. So don't insult iMunna for doing something good, completely voluntarily.
As my own opinion as a regular, I have no problems with this Idea, so don't include me in your generalisations Daco...
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iMunna your project is not supported by anyone (exept admins). Start to read the archive before posting threads.
The project is not officially endorsed by the Argonath leadership team. However with this said, Munna is free to continue his research within the boundaries of Argonath rules. All questionaries must be carried out on a voluntary basis with no penalty given for not participating.
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I'd appreciate if you did NOT go around asking people about me, or what your ruitines are. Cross me off your "list"
Im sure many people feel the same way about each person in the community who is a Regular/Veteran. You will have the group of people who are your friends and think you are a good guy. You will have the group that hates you..and frankly you hate them. Then there is the Group in the middle of this imaginary Diagram that notice your pro's and cons. So...idk..this looks interesting but i already know i fit into this diagram where i have friends/enemies/neutral people.
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All player comments are kept anonymous. Complaints against other members/groups/clans are also kept anonymous. All members who refuse to participate are forgotten. No one is treated specially and no one is treated as lower class members. All of my questions are asked in third person view and have no biased in them. I do not specialize my friends, neutrals, or enemies. I have no problem with constantly explaining my motives but it seems unjust that I am being asked questions that I already answered in my introductory paragraph.
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who allocated you as the representative of regulars and veterans. Only speak for yourself because to be honest everyone will have different opinions. So don't insult iMunna for doing something good, completely voluntarily.
As my own opinion as a regular, I have no problems with this Idea, so don't include me in your generalisations Daco...
are u
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All player comments are kept anonymous. Complaints against other members/groups/clans are also kept anonymous. All members who refuse to participate are forgotten. No one is treated specially and no one is treated as lower class members. All of my questions are asked in third person view and have no biased in them. I do not specialize my friends, neutrals, or enemies. I have no problem with constantly explaining my motives but it seems unjust that I am being asked questions that I already answered in my introductory paragraph.
As I said, I suggest you to cross me off your list, as I do not want to be the bad guy here.
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iMunna your project is not supported by anyone (exept admins). Start to read the archive before posting threads.
Are you unhappy that a moderator has taken interest in something that might do a change? Have you done anything to help the community AT ALL?
-Hwaldar Richards
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All player comments are kept anonymous. Complaints against other members/groups/clans are also kept anonymous. All members who refuse to participate are forgotten. No one is treated specially and no one is treated as lower class members. All of my questions are asked in third person view and have no biased in them. I do not specialize my friends, neutrals, or enemies. I have no problem with constantly explaining my motives but it seems unjust that I am being asked questions that I already answered in my introductory paragraph.
I'm in mate,
You're doing a Great/Fanastic Job.Im willing to help/Support you.
Just Ignore the Ones who are abit Jealous/dont like the Idea.
Mate,Anything you need,Just Give me a PM or Contact me in-game or so.
Keep up the Great Work Buddy.
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Have you done anything to help the community AT ALL?
At least I help every new player that asks for support.
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At least I help every new player that asks for support.
It's voluntary... Don't want to partake - just stay off. Why do you have to keep picking on iMunna, give him a break...Geez.
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The evaluations might be coming to an early conclusion as I have discussed with community leaders and owners the issues that regulars and veterans have on a daily basis. As promised, I will be posting many ideas in SA:MP Ideas (http://www.argonathrpg.eu/forum/index.php?board=81.0) for everyone to see and experience the reality of how successful my evaluations have really been. I am open 24 hours and seven days a week to discuss and resolve personal issues that players have in game and in real life. Like always, you will remain anonymous.
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Nobody asked me anything :[.
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same. lol
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As stated in the introductory paragraph, not everyone will be evaluated. :)
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Never gonna catch me being evaluated! By you of anyone. Still think thbis is complete bullshit!
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Jeez, don't get your panties in a bunch. :lol:
Seriously. Can anyone please take the liberty of explaining to me the causes or source behind the conspicuous negative male bovine excrement and personal attacks directed against other individuals in this discussion topic?
(translation: what's with all the BS and flaming?)
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(translation: what's with all the BS and flaming?)
I will allow it. It doesn't really affect me in any emotional or physical way. Just goes to show who really cares about the community and who doesn't. :)
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I will allow it. It doesn't really affect me in any emotional or physical way. Just goes to show who really cares about the community and who doesn't. :)
Wise indeed.
I have to say, that's quite a lot of effort you're putting into this. Thank you. :)
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It's over before I actually predicted it would be. The end result? A success. :)
Ideas from the regulars and veterans in order to make a sophisticated community. (http://www.argonathrpg.eu/forum/index.php?topic=55632.0)
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[i9]Jimmy_Cuneo
..is a great administrator. Don't you dare slag off any of the administration team when they help people out.