Argonath RPG - A World of its own
Argonath RPG Community => Forum and site ideas and information => Topic started by: stormeus on August 08, 2012, 01:25:33 pm
-
I went into my profile to edit something and found a strange and unadvertised tab for an "SMF Social Network." For some reason, I'm able to tag people in my posts and rate threads. And now, when I make a post, there are buttons for spoilers and Pawn code. There are bookmarks for threads. There are pages like "About Us" that use entirely separate packages for things that can easily be done with the SimplePortal software that's already been installed.
I think this hype of installing packages for packages' sake needs to stop. I feel there's too much functionality being shoved into this forum when little are bound to use it. The Pawn BBCode benefits only scripters who work on Pawn-based servers (aka SA:MP and SA:MP Stunt only; VC:MP is already bound to move away from it). The "Bookmarks" plugin seems frivolous since every modern browser already supports bookmarks. I see no practical purpose for tagging people in threads when they can be messaged about it. Then there's the "With us since" package that's probably going to end up being flaunted like /whenmade is in SA:MP.
I lost it at the social network though; I know that attempts to make some sort of "Argonath Social Network" have already been made, and failed at that. The forum itself is virtually the heart of the community. I see no reason why we should cheapen it further with a social network mod that nobody is going to use. And as I already mentioned, ADDITIONAL packages are being used when those tasks can be accomplished with the tools we already have at our disposal.
As for the Downloads system, I'm largely indifferent. I know it's a feature I'm likely never going to use since there are already established websites for GTA mods and the GTA:MP download links are widely available already, and hosted by the mod developers themselves. It just seems like something else to use our bandwidth on. Same thing applies to the auction house, though it may make auctions more orderly. We'll see about that.
To reiterate, what annoys me is that we're installing all of these packages for what looks like the sake of having them. The forum looks more cluttered and cramming as much as possible into the forum makes us look like a modern version of a 2002-era webmaster adding as many GIFs, MP3s, and
glowing headers
as we can.
In my opinion, the way the forum is administrated and modded should be looked at the same way we would in-game.
"How does this mod help improve the forum?"
"Will this package actually improve the way our website looks and feels?"
"Will this be inefficient? Will it be left unused?"
"Do we already have a way of doing what we want to do?"
On top of that, there are other issues that could be focused on. There are entire forum boards that some groups cannot see because of bad setups. Some people have to be set as board moderators for some boards, like SA:MP Managers in unban requests, because their group doesn't inherit those privileges automatically, leaving some boards' moderators to be neglected until brought up. (e.g. In the VC:MP boards, there are some board moderators who aren't even active anymore; Tai is inactive and doesn't seem to have authority over the site anymore but still moderates this board). The helpdesk still doesn't allow scripters from one server to report bugs in another.
TL;DR (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=tl%3Bdr) Instead of forcing all these gizmos and whatnot into the forum, we should just start thinking practically about what we want/need and what we don't.
-
If you don't like it, ignore it.
They are great functions that really refresh the forum.
-
In theory we are turning into Facebook... :lol:
-
Don't like them? Don't use them :)
-
Don't like them? Don't use them :)
So instead we simply install every irrelevant feature we can possibly find, then leave the forum to fragment into billions of glittery pieces since people can simply ignore the sections they don't like. :roll:
In theory we are turning into Facebook... :lol:
-
Additional to an extra modify button under the posts. Yes, we are turning into Facebook with all these 'social' functions - I don't see the purpose of using these functions here while there are plenty of good social websites such as Friendster, oh wait.. It's closed due to the owner has developped a fail bank system. Well, the only ones left are Twitter and FB - use them!
-
So instead we simply install every irrelevant feature we can possibly find, then leave the forum to fragment into billions of glittery pieces since people can simply ignore the sections they don't like. :roll:
Why not? I and others use them :)
-
Why not? I and others use them :)
Rather than installing thousands of features to each satisfy a few users, we should be installing a few features to satisfy thousands of users.
-
Rather than installing thousands of features to each satisfy a few users, we should be installing a few features to satisfy thousands of users.
Such as...?
-
Such as...?
Such as the new portal feature that was installed to replace the decaying home page (which should probably be tweaked a bit to look a little nicer) and restoring "Politics and religion" into "World and local news" instead of wasting our time with a silly social network that has already been tried and proven to be abandoned and neglected and badges for doing nothing but being here longer.
-
Such as the new portal feature that was installed to replace the decaying home page
Well you've got it.
(which should probably be tweaked a bit to look a little nicer)
Things take time, and it's not all about aesthetics ;).
and restoring "Politics and religion" into "World and local news" instead of wasting our time with a silly social network that has already been tried and proven to be abandoned and neglected and badges for doing nothing but being here longer.
Haters gonna hate...
-
Haters gonna hate...
I'm just saying, how does a forum-integrated social network benefit anyone? This forum practically IS the social network, and even if you wouldn't consider it as such, we already have a Facebook group for it.
And how does a forum-integrated bookmarks system benefit anyone? My browser already supports bloody bookmarks.
How does Pawn BBCode benefit a wide audience? Only SA:MP/SA:MP Stunt scripters are going to end up using it anyway.
We already had small-size BBCode for spoilers, but I guess spoiler tags are cool too.
-
I don't hate the new forum. And why are you so bothered? You're only talking points which can be replaced with others, not how they are bad.
-
why are you so bothered? You're only talking points which can be replaced with others, not how they are bad.
Because I wouldn't try to add a script that I can already do with /me and /l, and I certainly wouldn't do the same to a forum.
-
I'm just saying, how does a forum-integrated social network benefit anyone? This forum practically IS the social network, and even if you wouldn't consider it as such, we already have a Facebook group for it.
Perhaps those who don't feel comfortable about revealing themselves via the Facebook group, or creating a fake Facebook account would like the chance to be able to interact with others from Argonath in a similar way...
And how does a forum-integrated bookmarks system benefit anyone? My browser already supports bloody bookmarks.
I use around 8 devices regularly, and surf websites and this forum on all of them. I don't want the hassle of adding bookmarks to each device, when I can bookmark useful topics on the forum, enabling me to keep abreast of what's happening, regardless of which computer I'm on.
How does Pawn BBCode benefit a wide audience? Only SA:MP/SA:MP Stunt scripters are going to end up using it anyway.
As SAMP is the most populated of the servers, I don't see any problem with this being here. It makes perfect sense, for script support, or submitting ideas.
We already had small-size BBCode for spoilers, but I guess spoiler tags are cool too.
(which should probably be tweaked a bit to look a little nicer)
-
I really like the new features. :)
-
Perhaps those who don't feel comfortable about revealing themselves via the Facebook group, or creating a fake Facebook account would like the chance to be able to interact with others from Argonath in a similar way...
This is what the forum is for.
As SAMP is the most populated of the servers, I don't see any problem with this being here.
(http://i.imgur.com/sSD8Z.png)
-
This is what the forum is for.
(http://i.imgur.com/sSD8Z.png)
No need to get butthurt about it... SAMP is the most popular and most populated Argonath server.
Haters gonna hate...
-
No need to get butthurt about it... SAMP is the most popular and most populated Argonath server.
But why is there an underlying need to focus everything on SA:MP? There are other servers. I honestly don't give a rat's ass about how many play on SA:MP because there are other servers that should be considered as well.
-
But why is there an underlying need to focus everything on SA:MP? There are other servers. I honestly don't give a rat's ass about how many play on SA:MP because there are other servers that should be considered as well.
Everything's proportional. Until other servers reach the popularity of SAMP, there's no need to give as much attention and time to them. The very fact that servers have a board here is consideration.
-
1. If there are errors to fix then report them on the Helpdesk (another feature that you might not find useful).
If you can not, then report here with a [BUG] tag so we can move them.
2. The old website had a Community Builder, which is equal to the Social Network. It was not used because of people being more on forum as on the main site, however the feature itself is useful and there for ntohing new.
3. If available we can add LUA and Squirrel BBC code. So far I have not noticed them being an option, so either you can use the PAWN tag or the Code tag if you need it.
4. The BBC Spoiler is pretty useful for those users who are on moblie devices and might not want to load the 5Gb images.
5. We have 10Tb bandwith of which we currently use 0.5Tb for all that is running here. No need to talk about wastage.
6. Often players are linking to downloads on sites that require registration or offer severly limited bandwith. Those who are creating mods (or get permission from the creators) have the option to download them here from a stable and free source without a lot of hassle. Sorry for offering,
We have indeed loaded a large number of packages, for the simple reason that they accomplish something simple and fast. Without this we could not have ported everything with 12 hours downtime only.
Those that we find to be double functionality or are better done in another way will be removed when we update to all themes.
We have not added any feature just to add one. All packages were tested and evaluated for usefulness. The only thing we decided on was a different portal as before, so we need to explore the SimplePortal possibilities to see if we can replace some packages.
In fact we have a number of packages that may be installed later or places on subsites, as we are not yet convinced of the usefullness.
-
/topic
-
Gandalf, I'm all for improvement, but the social network plugin seems over the top. I can't really see any additional purpose to it since it seems like an overglorified version of Facebook added to SMF when the forum provides enough social functionality as it stands. Social networking is about meeting and chatting with other users, correct? Then I don't see why we should go beyond the forum to do so.
If the purpose of spoiler tags is to reduce bandwidth usage for bandwidth users, I don't think that would necessarily work. If I recall correctly, the browsers would load the "5Gb images" regardless; the only difference is that Javascript hides it until the user decides to show it.
As for Lua/Squirrel/Pawn BBCode, I don't see much purpose in it regardless of the languages offered. We still have [ code ] tags, and as far as I can tell, very little physical code sharing in that manner is done on the forum, at least not enough to warrant syntax highlighting for each language supported by the game servers.
EDIT: As for the "About us" mod you have installed, it might be worth looking into the "Staff List" block that SimplePortal offers, and perhaps using portal articles for the about page itself, or offloading that content to the wiki.
-
An explanation was given, and you still see the need to maintain an argument?
-
An explanation was given, and you still see the need to maintain an argument?
It seems like you see this thread as an argument to be won, instead of an improvement to be suggested.
-
Suggestions were aired and have been answered. I see nothing more to be done...
-
Suggestions were aired and have been answered. I see nothing more to be done...
Those that we find to be double functionality or are better done in another way will be removed when we update to all themes.
I'm sorry for answering the response, Janek.
-
You quote my answer about the answer with the answer? Tautology lives!
-
Gandalf, I'm all for improvement, but the social network plugin seems over the top. I can't really see any additional purpose to it since it seems like an overglorified version of Facebook added to SMF when the forum provides enough social functionality as it stands. Social networking is about meeting and chatting with other users, correct? Then I don't see why we should go beyond the forum to do so.
What you may forget is that some people might wish to share some things with others at Argonath, but keep their social network separate due to possible repercussions if a friendship goes wrong.
This way the 'slow chat' part of the forum can be moved to the Social Network.
If the purpose of spoiler tags is to reduce bandwidth usage for bandwidth users, I don't think that would necessarily work. If I recall correctly, the browsers would load the "5Gb images" regardless; the only difference is that Javascript hides it until the user decides to show it.
Possible, though different mobile browsers act differently on this.
But it has more useful features.
As for Lua/Squirrel/Pawn BBCode, I don't see much purpose in it regardless of the languages offered. We still have [ code ] tags, and as far as I can tell, very little physical code sharing in that manner is done on the forum, at least not enough to warrant syntax highlighting for each language supported by the game servers.
At the same time, it does not eat a lot of resources and is a very minor modification.
I offered you the same, so do not be jealous of PAWN packages if you see no use for others.
EDIT: As for the "About us" mod you have installed, it might be worth looking into the "Staff List" block that SimplePortal offers, and perhaps using portal articles for the about page itself, or offloading that content to the wiki.
Actually we removed the Staff List block as it was utterly crappy in look.
And while we are re-organizing the link to the Wiki is not instantly found, although I will add it to the "help" menu.
-
What you may forget is that some people might wish to share some things with others at Argonath, but keep their social network separate due to possible repercussions if a friendship goes wrong.
This way the 'slow chat' part of the forum can be moved to the Social Network.
I'm still not convinced that having an in-house social network would really have much benefit though. It seems like almost all of the content on it is publicly available and only consists of status updates the players make (still publicly available), comments, and likes and dislikes. The only way to send a message that would be private would be to send a PM marked to a certain group of players and simply use that, which is already built-in and not even provided by that package.
I feel like down the road, the social network will fall out of use (if it picks up) and be left with players offering deals for weed on SA:MP.
And while we are re-organizing the link to the Wiki is not instantly found, although I will add it to the "help" menu.
Fair enough.
As for the other elements and modifications, I suppose I can accept them.
-
Suggestion to code packages: add one for each of the languages that are used in Argo game servers. Not like it will be used very often but then, seems like it doesn't hurt to have it either.
-
I like the spoiler tags.. :redface:
Oh, and the downloads section is nice.
-
Suggestion to code packages: add one for each of the languages that are used in Argo game servers. Not like it will be used very often but then, seems like it doesn't hurt to have it either.
That's the thing, though. It would be useful for a forum that would use syntax highlighting extensively (scripting help forums, mod websites, etc.), but the gains here are modest. I've seen little code posted here, but knowing that SA:MP will probably get the vast majority of the attention anywhere about anything, chances are they're doing something with it there. On the three servers I script with, code just seems to be shared by uploading them to the server and letting everyone else know what's been changed. The small snippets of code that I do post on the forums are too small to really warrant syntax highlighting since they would be easy to read through and understand anyway. Having seen the installation of packages left and right on the ARPD Forum for marginal gain, only to lead to the site being down for a couple of hours because of errors installing and uninstalling them because of the intense modification, the cons seem to outweigh the pros in my eyes.
-
Maybe a scripting tutorial board can be added to put it to use.
And still I don't see why you are upset by the changes, they don't hurt you.
The spoiler function is an amazing future, no more slow loading on my phone.. :)
-
That's the thing, though. It would be useful for a forum that would use syntax highlighting extensively (scripting help forums, mod websites, etc.), but the gains here are modest. I've seen little code posted here, but knowing that SA:MP will probably get the vast majority of the attention anywhere about anything, chances are they're doing something with it there. On the three servers I script with, code just seems to be shared by uploading them to the server and letting everyone else know what's been changed. The small snippets of code that I do post on the forums are too small to really warrant syntax highlighting since they would be easy to read through and understand anyway. Having seen the installation of packages left and right on the ARPD Forum for marginal gain, only to lead to the site being down for a couple of hours because of errors installing and uninstalling them because of the intense modification, the cons seem to outweigh the pros in my eyes.
We are not ARPD forums, and installation has basicly finished. There is one page not working, all others are fine, as before installing here we tested them.
-
Because I wouldn't try to add a script that I can already do with /me and /l, and I certainly wouldn't do the same to a forum.
I find that funny.
-
badges for doing nothing but being here longer.
u jelly brah?
It's about time we got some recognition for our "loyalty", although I prefer cake.
*flashes badges*
(http://pearlsinvinegar.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/aw-yeah-4943_preview.png)
-
Further provoking will result in more warnings being issued, or worse. I suggest you guys keep to the topic, and stop bumping it with trolling images and negative responses towards other users.
-
I'd have to agree with a good part of this topic.
Some may look at it like an "attempt to prevent enhancement" or "sticking to traditional ways", but I for one am always pro-development and keen on new ideas.
However, I think many of the new features, and especially those that have no effect on gameplay or readership on this forum, but are 'just there' may hinder us than help us move forward. Some of the most popular, interactive forum and blog pages out there are often without a whole collection of little gadgets and features that may look and sound cool but don't add a lot more for the forum regular.
We don't want to lose out on professionalism, especially catering for such a wide range of ages. Many of the features look like a bit of fun - rating topics, a 'whenmade' kind of feature - but do we need them on an already good forum like this one? Or do they just take up more space and clog up profiles? :)
Alright, but some people may really like those, and after all you may say that they're not going to get in the way, and sure we could hang on to them perhaps. Also, things like the auctions area, downloads, they all sound like good ideas if we can maintain them for a long period of time. I'm hoping the bug reporting feature also gets its chance in the spotlight, although it was released a while ago, as was the Argonath Media Center.
Many people have gone by with "if you don't like it, don't use". Sadly, some things can't be ignored, and do seem obstructive.
As I posted over here (http://www.argonathrpg.eu/index.php?topic=88509.msg1418467#msg1418467), there are things which seem like obstacles - having to change your topic design or format extensively due to little 'widgets' and disadvantageous features would be a shame.
-
Its not our fault people maake designs in a way that is not supposed to be.
The extensive use of large images is not allowed on most forums, but if we would prohibit them a lot of topic would get messed.
As for the new features, as long as they are supported by their developers we intend to carry them.
-
Its not our fault people maake designs in a way that is not supposed to be.
The extensive use of large images is not allowed on most forums, but if we would prohibit them a lot of topic would get messed.
As for the new features, as long as they are supported by their developers we intend to carry them.
I was thinking about certain topics' colour schemes, which now may not fit at all with the altogether different theme colouring we have as default.
That could pose a number of problems, and of course, with the theme options varying quite a lot, and with users using different things getting optimum viewability is a challenge.
And with the left panel, isn't a good part of it already available elsewhere (or in parts, immediately above the main web page)?
I was having a look at when people use tables, and the left/right/centre positioning tools which are commonplace on many SMF forums. Topics containing these tools seem to have had their formatting gone a little out of place.
I think once things like an official theme has been confirmed, much of the generic issues could be solved.
As for the new features, some of them are good fun to play with (I do enjoy them :P), but would we need them or would they just make the forums look less professional, less to its quality values?
Rating topics, for instance, hardly gets in the way of any other things as far as I can see, but some work on a more large scale.
P.S. Was just testing a few things quickly, and seems like scroll bars are appearing on all sorts of posts & topics?
Also, just had a look at the Members (http://www.argonathrpg.eu/index.php?action=mlist) tab. I think some of the content there has gone out of format. Just thought it'd save a lot of trouble without certain new additions, especially if they are having an impact on already existing and in the past working areas of the forum.