Argonath RPG - A World of its own
Argonath RPG Community => Forum and site ideas and information => Topic started by: Antonio. on February 07, 2013, 09:08:14 pm
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This is really taken from another forum, but it's a good idea and I don't see why it shouldn't exist; a "non-english board" which will have sub-boards, for example Albanian, German etc. For a language to be added, it must be requested and only if the community has a decent amount of speakers of the requested language.
Thanks.
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FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU,
I was litterly thinking abt this 1 week ago, and now was typing a good explanation in notepad,
Supported <3
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FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU,
I was litterly thinking abt this 1 week ago, and now was typing a good explanation in notepad,
Supported <3
I had this in mind long ago, but seems like Hevar posted it a little bit earlier. xD
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With this Idea I was thinking you can talk about things that are happening in your country, in the language you would like, but also in english. Like local news, its sometimes not big enouf for the boards of news, but good enough for the lets say 'dutch' boards, you can speak both languages english and dutch there for example, you can talk about things that is happening in your country, like Queen leaving, etc. I think this is a good idea!
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With this Idea I was thinking you can talk about things that are happening in your country, in the language you would like, but also in english. Like local news, its sometimes not big enouf for the boards of news, but good enough for the lets say 'dutch' boards, you can speak both languages english and dutch there for example, you can talk about things that is happening in your country, like Queen leaving, etc. I think this is a good idea!
Like Svenssons family topic but with proper title yes? :rofl:
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Supported , this way people who have problems with communicating with other from other countries it will help him to communicate with people with same language and understand some points they can't understand about game or even to have fun, much easier for all
but there is one problem that it may lead to falming in other languages and end with some fights
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Supported , this way people who have problems with communicating with other from other countries it will help him to communicate with people with same language and understand some points they can't understand about game or even to have fun, much easier for all
but there is one problem that it may lead to falming in other languages and end with some fights
Country moderators in those sections!
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I'm sure there's a mature representative for each country that can maintain peace in the sections. But, as long as others don't stick their nose deep into discussions of other languages, no problems should really happen. As I saw them on the other forums, everyone was getting along there; the only "fights" that were happening were when people from other countries started posting provocative stuff.
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Seems to be a nice idea for me.
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Very Nice idea!!
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Like Svenssons family topic but with proper title yes? :rofl:
:lol: :lol: :lol:
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This has been suggested earlier, actually. I don't support the idea of using any other language than English, simply because I think everyone should be able to read everything they have access to on these forums, without having to use a translator. The sole concept is just not something that fits into the idea I have of Argonath: A very international gaming community.
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This has been suggested earlier, actually. I don't support the idea of using any other language than English, simply because I think everyone should be able to read everything they have access to on these forums, without having to use a translator. The sole concept is just not something that fits into the idea I have of Argonath: A very international gaming community.
For the first time in years, I totally agree with Salmonella.
Players ingame can use different languages in the private chats, and keep in mind that it is of no use to add this idea in order to introduce non-English speakers to this community, as we cannot help them integrate into the entire community of Argonath as a whole if they cannot provide some semblance of communication in the global lingua franca.
If you think this is utterly discriminating, remember the cases of players who came here with barely any English, but became more fluent after some time spent here.
As it is, Argonath is a world of its own where everyone can understand content posted by everyone else, to some extent. Let's keep it that way instead of making it into an amalgamation of sub-groups with a lower overall quality of efficient communication as a whole.
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And what exactly are you going to speak about? Your language?
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That would be interesting.. but useless.
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This has been suggested earlier, actually. I don't support the idea of using any other language than English, simply because I think everyone should be able to read everything they have access to on these forums, without having to use a translator. The sole concept is just not something that fits into the idea I have of Argonath: A very international gaming community.
The speakerbox is still there for the whole community to discuss anything in English to understand. There are somethings that can be discussed about your country, music, culture etc. with people who know more about it and speak the language. If I post something in Albanian on speakerbox where everyone can understand, I could just imagine the ignorant comments and O.o faces. Yes, we are an international community, and this shows all the different type of nationalities that play on the server.
Players ingame can use different languages in the private chats, and keep in mind that it is of no use to add this idea in order to introduce non-English speakers to this community, as we cannot help them integrate into the entire community of Argonath as a whole if they cannot provide some semblance of communication in the global lingua franca.
They will still learn it, as they will need to use the rest of the forums to get through with the server. Do you really think this will just take everything of the forums and make it into another language? No. This would be just for discussions that community members start to be able to discuss it with their own people. And somethings aren't for everyone to understand, since some are just very ignorant and have no clue of the certain topic. This does not effect the server, since if a player gets banned, he will still have to use the unban request and request an unban in English, if a player wants to sell something, he would have to use the selling board and communicate in English as well as many other examples.
As it is, Argonath is a world of its own where everyone can understand content posted by everyone else, to some extent. Let's keep it that way instead of making it into an amalgamation of sub-groups with a lower overall quality of efficient communication as a whole.
Everything that Argonath has made is not applicable for everyone; I'm sure you heard about the new Russian server. I wonder how many non-Russians will actually be able to play there. So, even with your statement, I find it highly incorrect that this will "separate" the community since it hasn't done so in even larger community forums that I've seen.
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And what exactly are you going to speak about? Your language?
With this Idea I was thinking you can talk about things that are happening in your country, in the language you would like, but also in english. Like local news, its sometimes not big enouf for the boards of news, but good enough for the lets say 'dutch' boards, you can speak both languages english and dutch there for example, you can talk about things that is happening in your country, like Queen leaving, etc. I think this is a good idea!
Talk about that :)
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And what exactly are you going to speak about? Your language?
Go to a forum where your language is spoken and see what others are discussing.
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The speakerbox is still there for the whole community to discuss anything in English to understand. There are somethings that can be discussed about your country, music, culture etc. with people who know more about it and speak the language. If I post something in Albanian on speakerbox where everyone can understand, I could just imagine the ignorant comments and O.o faces. Yes, we are an international community, and this shows all the different type of nationalities that play on the server.
That's not the point. The point is that everyone should be able to read anything that's being posted on these forums, which is why there should only be one allowed language. Don't forget that you can still talk about your nationality('s 'music, culture, etc.') in the English language, although I really don't see why you would talk about the first and latter of the three in general. Yes, we are an international community, and this is why we should take into account that what others can read, others will want to understand.
I understand why you would want this, but there's other forums where you can find other people from your country, that you can talk to about the subjects you'd want to talk about. In fact, I already found one for you, assuming you wanted to talk about music in Albanian:
http://www.forumivirtual.com/muzika-shqiptare-dhe-e-huaj/ (http://www.forumivirtual.com/muzika-shqiptare-dhe-e-huaj/)
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Like Svenssons family topic but with proper title yes? :rofl:
Haha, damn right! :lol:
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That's not the point. The point is that everyone should be able to read anything that's being posted on these forums, which is why there should only be one allowed language. Don't forget that you can still talk about your nationality('s 'music, culture, etc.') in the English language, although I really don't see why you would talk about the first and latter of the three in general. Yes, we are an international community, and this is why we should take into account that what others can read, others will want to understand.
That's why others will also have a topic to have discussions in their own languages as well, so no hard feelings. The point is, most of the time if the person doesn't speak your language, he's pretty ignorant on the topic. And this is just to have discussions among people of that country, not everyone.
I understand why you would want this, but there's other forums where you can find other people from your country, that you can talk to about the subjects you'd want to talk about. In fact, I already found one for you, assuming you wanted to talk about music in Albanian:
I don't care about the members of other forums; I want to know more and discuss things with the people of this community that can speak my mother language.
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The point is, most of the time if the person doesn't speak your language, he's pretty ignorant on the topic.
Ignorant, or just being right about telling you that it's not allowed to speak another language than English? :D
This is an international server, please speak English in the chat. :D
I don't care about the members of other forums; I want to know more and discuss things with the people of this community that can speak my mother language.
Make a Skype group.
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Ignorant, or just being right about telling you that it's not allowed to speak another language than English? :D
This is an international server, please speak English in the chat. :D
You misunderstood. If you start a discussion about your country, most people that are not from it will be ignorant about the topic/discussion.
Make a Skype group.
No. If I wanted to do something else other than what I stated on the topic, I wouldn't have made it.
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Go to a forum where your language is spoken and see what others are discussing.
Sorry to burst your bubble, this is my language.
Talk about that :)
The news boards are not just for international news.
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You misunderstood. If you start a discussion about your country, most people that are not from it will be ignorant about the topic/discussion.
Oh, like that. So basically you're saying that you want a board where there is no negative criticism and only people that will support whatever you post will reply? Not everyone who's not from Albania is ignorant about Albanian subjects, not even a majority here is, as far as I know. Anyways, I see where you're coming from, I just don't believe Argonath's forum is the place for it. Reasons already given.
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Oh, like that. So basically you're saying that you want a board where there is no negative criticism and only people that will support whatever you post will reply?
No, just people who can express their selves better on the subject and have more knowledge of it.
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Oh, like that. So basically you're saying that you want a board where there is no negative criticism and only people that will support whatever you post will reply?
There is a difference between disagreeing and making negative comments.
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Everybody should be able to read everything on the public forum.
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There is a difference between disagreeing and making negative comments.
Yes, but there's also something called generalization, which is what I tried to adress with that post. We can't just assume everyone, or even anyone, will act like the way Antonio described.
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Yes, but there's also something called generalization, which is what I tried to adress with that post. We can't just assume everyone, or even anyone, will act like the way Antonio described.
No, but I'm sure that more will be for the idea than against it.
inb4argoisn'tademocracy
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Indeed, it's not a democracy, but even if it was, it doesn't look like you've obtained even 50 percent of everyone who's posted here their support. :razz:
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Indeed, it's not a democracy, but even if it was, it doesn't look like you've obtained even 50 percent of everyone who's posted here supports it. :razz:
I really want to know where you learned how to record statistics.
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16 Different people have posted (before me), 5 supported the idea, so Salmonella was right as that would be 31%.
Any way, I'd rather see people speaking English as that is what makes the community feeling here, if people were to use their own languages on the forums I feel some people may create small communities away from the rest of the population.
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16 Different people have posted (before me), 5 supported the idea, so Salmonella was right as that would be 31%.
Any way, I'd rather see people speaking English as that is what makes the community feeling here, if people were to use their own languages on the forums I feel some people may create small communities away from the rest of the population.
What about boards, where you speak english. But about things in your country / with people of your country, as for the small things. Like a murder / court case. Things like these, or even arrange meetings.
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What about boards, where you speak english. But about things in your country / with people of your country, as for the small things. Like a murder / court case. Things like these, or even arrange meetings.
Just make a topic? Why does it need a dedicated board? No member should be excluded just because they aren't from a certain country.
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Just make a topic? Why does it need a dedicated board? No member should be excluded just because they aren't from a certain country.
Never said that, but some people would moan like 'This isnt important blabla'
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16 Different people have posted (before me), 5 supported the idea, so Salmonella was right as that would be 31%.
Any way, I'd rather see people speaking English as that is what makes the community feeling here, if people were to use their own languages on the forums I feel some people may create small communities away from the rest of the population.
A lot of people didn't even state whether they were for or against the idea. :poke:
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Never said that, but some people would moan like 'This isnt important blabla'
I doubt it, and even if they would, so what? Ignore them, and if they actually start to paint the topic black, report them.
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I'm against!
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I'm against!
Pas de mal, soutenu par moi.
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Pas de mal, soutenu par moi.
Please post in English on the forum. :evil:
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I'm against!
Please explain why you are against this idea.
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Why does it need to be explained ? Common sense.
When I come here, I want to be able to read everything that is on public forum. It's an international community and the main language is English.
If you want to speak Albanian or any other language, go on an Albanian forum or create a private one.
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When I come here, I want to be able to read everything that is on public forum
Sure.
It's an international community and the main language is English.
No problem.
If you want to speak Albanian or any other language, go on an Albanian forum or create a private one.
You are not being forced to read other foreign languages. If Argonath is indeed an international community, where is the harm in supporting foreign communities? There are people here that don't understand or have less knowledge of English. I even see players getting kicked asking for help in their native language in game. Argonath, which is a great international community from the beginning, can contribute positive to these people, by making board for other languages. This way, players can communicate with other people who have knowledge of their language, and not be left out alone. Whether it by sports topic or seeking assistance.
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If you can't understand or speak English, I'm sorry but I don't see how you can play in a server/community where everything is in English. Either you learn English or you find an other community in your language.
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If you can't understand or speak English, I'm sorry but I don't see how you can play in a server/community where everything is in English. Either you learn English or you find an other community in your language.
There are groups that consists of majority of one region such as Gvardia, which used to consist of mostly Eastern European players. Similarly, there are other groups that players try to climb on. They didn't need to learn English but rather they were helped by people whom could understand them. Same way, this community could do better if we banded together for helping these players, rather than relying on their knowledge of English or individuals to help them.
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Ok, let's make 260+ sub-boards for every languages.
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http://translate.google.rs/?hl=sr&tab=wT (http://translate.google.rs/?hl=sr&tab=wT)
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Ok, let's make 260+ sub-boards for every languages.
Doesn't necessarily have to be, but if you are keen on it, go ahead. :)
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Sure. [...] You are not being forced to read other foreign languages.
You're contradicting yourself. First you agree with Cyril that everything he has access to on these forums, he should be able to read in English, and then later you tell him he doesn't 'have to read it'. It's been said many times now, by different people, that everything on the forums that's public, should be in English, so that everyone will be able to read it.
Also, if a board was made for one single language, that would bring a lot of complications. For one, there would have to be a capable trustworthy moderator for each board, to moderate everything that people discuss there. If not, then these boards would just become places where people will provoke those who don't understand the language into translating stuff that might get said about them, for example. Moderation would be needed.
That's not a huge issue if we were talking about 4 boards max, but if there would be an Albanian board, Serbs will also demand one, then the Greek, then the Dutch, then the German, then the French, then the Macedonians, then the Swedish, until there are demands for at least 100 different boards for 100 different languages. I don't blame them for demanding these boards. They'd have just as much rights to have boards for their language as the ones that would already have boards for their language. However, they'll all need moderation. Let's just hypothetically say this will actually happen (it won't.), then we all know there won't be enough moderators that would get a seal of approval from the HQ.
If Argonath is indeed an international community, where is the harm in supporting foreign communities?
As far as I know, everyone who requires support here in Argonath, gets it, no matter where you're from. Even those who are and have been community banned are no exception. ;) Support however, doesn't have to mean making these boards.
There are people here that don't understand or have less knowledge of English. I even see players getting kicked asking for help in their native language in game.
That's a good thing, not a bad thing. When I joined Argonath, I barely spoke English, and now some people even think English is my native language. It's primarily because of Argonath that I can now speak English the way I do. Do you really want to take that away from people and slow their learning process down? It's a skill that'll remain useful your entire life. When I see people ask for help in their native language in mainchat, I see regulars asking admins wheter or not they can speak to them in that language, to inform them that they should only speak English in mainchat, and perhaps even give them their help there, or in PM. I've never seen someone get punishment for that, unless they ignore the admin or people that inform him about the rule of speaking English, which is nothing but reasonable.
The basics of English aren't hard and anyone will make progress as they try. I guess I'm the living example of that.
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If you can't understand or speak English, I'm sorry but I don't see how you can play in a server/community where everything is in English. Either you learn English or you find an other community in your language.
Yea, pretty much. If you can't speak some english then you can't really operate the server scripts anyway..
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Yea, pretty much. If you can't speak some english then you can't really operate the server scripts anyway..
Not necessarily. Some people can speak it, just not that well. They may prefer their own language where it's allowed because they can speak and understand it perfectly. That's the same reason why Argo has always allowed private and local chats in the servers to be in other languages besides English, if they so choose to use them.
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As it is, Argonath is one big international community where anyone can literally fit into just about every group or sector.
All that this idea will serve to do is create numerous inner circles that would serve to alienate players on the basis of their ethnicity and linguistic ability.
Argonath would never have reached where it is today if players from many countries across the globe were not able to form bonds through the few things that everyone has in common. The splitting of the community into language-exclusive sectors would only erode that global factor.
Therefore, in the end it is only more detrimental to this community as a whole, rather than beneficial.
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As it is, Argonath is one big international community where anyone can literally fit into just about every group or sector.
All that this idea will serve to do is create numerous inner circles that would serve to alienate players on the basis of their ethnicity and linguistic ability.
Argonath would never have reached where it is today if players from many countries across the globe were not able to form bonds through the few things that everyone has in common. The splitting of the community into language-exclusive sectors would only erode that global factor.
Therefore, in the end it is only more detrimental to this community as a whole, rather than beneficial.
But some people can actually communicate with others in english, but it's very hard for them, due that, they use forum very rarely.
But if we try this idea, they will have an opportunity to talk with people from same country out of game and have fun on forum too.
Of course, many people who can speak english and who knows none player who can't speak it well will obviously vote no, as they don't see it usefull.
Ok, let's make 260+ sub-boards for every languages.
Or just make board in speakerbox like "Native chat boards" and let people create their native topic if there is none yet. Simple as that.
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If you can't understand or speak English, I'm sorry but I don't see how you can play in a server/community where everything is in English. Either you learn English or you find an other community in your language.
I'm sure that as an admin you should know we don't judge players by their knowledge of the English language; especially considering how many players we have that don't speak English very good. I don't remember anyone not being allowed to play in the community because they didn't know how to speak English...
And like Voores said, some people that don't speak English very good can't even be fully part of community and know what's going on because some don't even know how to register on the forums! So yes, you can say that if they don't speak English they should not be playing, but like JDC said, let's not forget about those players who learned English very well during the time they spent on Argonath.
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I'm just throwing this idea out there, but what about a single board, called something along the lines of "International Language Discussion", or something similar which can host any language in it? Global moderation across the forum could stay the same, and the board would simply be meant for any language to be used in there, rather than specific sub-boards. Then if anyone feels the need to discuss things together in another language, they have the option. It could be seen similar to the way Argo only allows English in the main chat in the servers, but doesn't mind about other chats in the game. Same thing with TeamSpeak's stance on public versus private channels. We have enough moderators to easily handle a single place like that, and with Google Translate being decent enough to get the basic idea of what they are saying, it wouldn't be hard to find rulebreakers and deal with them, just as we always have before. Those who don't speak English well could also use it as a place to get help and learn the community better while they study our "main community language".
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Not a bad idea.
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Google translator doesn't work for everything. We will still require someone who knows the local language being discussed to get a general idea of what's being said.
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Google translator doesn't work for everything. We will still require someone who knows the local language being discussed to get a general idea of what's being said.
Believe it or not, Google Translate can still give you a pretty good idea these days. I have to use it all the time when moderating the LU Forums, (Testers for the mod are also forum moderators), and I've never once had an issue with it. We've also used it here for years here in Argo when questioning things said by users in-game or on the forums that wasn't in English.
Yes, translations are often rough...but it's pretty clear as to what the poster's intentions are in their discussions.
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Believe it or not, Google Translate can still give you a pretty good idea these days. I have to use it all the time when moderating the LU Forums, (Testers for the mod are also forum moderators), and I've never once had an issue with it. We've also used it here for years here in Argo when questioning things said by users in-game or on the forums that wasn't in English.
Yes, translations are often rough...but it's pretty clear as to what the poster's intentions are in their discussions.
I suppose they are. Don't get me wrong; I'm all for this, I just think it will be fairly difficult to moderate these.
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Even if google translator isn't able to help you at some point, you could always ask a community member.
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Ok, let's make 260+ sub-boards for every languages.
Or you could just create one sub-board, containing various non-English topics.. :roll:
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Or you could just create one sub-board, containing various non-English topics.. :roll:
Which is what I suggested a page back, and nearly everyone tried to combat it with the Google Translate argument. :P
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Which is what I suggested a page back, and nearly everyone tried to combat it with the Google Translate argument. :P
I should really try to read the whole topic before commenting.. :roll:
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I should really try to read the whole topic before commenting.. :roll:
At least you admitted it! <3
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If the demand is there and the need is a good one, why not?
Argonath RPG is generally pro-development and advocates positive growth, so I think providing such features may enable us to cater more widely around the world.
The "universal" argument is a good one. Like our servers, the forums for the best part have remained fully English, making it a common bridge of communication. But if new language (http://www.argonathrpg.eu/index.php?topic=94185.0) servers and sub-communities are on the way then it would be natural for Argonath to adapt and be ready for more.