The upcoming laws of Liberty City!

[James Conway]

Hello citizens of Liberty City,

Today I will present you with the upcoming new laws. You all have the opportunity to review it and have the ability to suggest the removal, adding or editing these laws. Please PM or post a reply about if you want one of these laws removed, edited or adding a new one. After 14 days from the start of this topic these laws will be implemented.

With kind regards,
Temp. Judge James Conway

See the attachment for the upcoming laws.

[superh2o]

great great, hope to see more FBI/LCPD cases in courts after this is approved

[Younes]

Great. I hope we can see improvement in roleplay now, from both sides

[rid]

I like most changes, but here's what I believe could be improved:



1:

Act 6.9
A person who attacks another person, with or without a weapon, is guilty of assault.dw
A person who attacks another person with a vehicle is guilty of vehicular assault.
If the attacked person is a Law Enforcer, the punishment shall be more severe.

I believe the punishment should be the same regardless of what profession the person is part of. In other words, no distinction betwen Law Enforcers and Civillians.



2:

Act 6.9
A person who attacks another person, with or without a weapon, is guilty of assault.dw
A person who attacks another person with a vehicle is guilty of vehicular assault.
If the attacked person is a Law Enforcer, the punishment shall be more severe.

Again, same thing as mentioned above.



3:

Act 6.13
​ ​ ​ ​ Acts 6.9, 6.10, 6.11 and 6.12 are punishable by up to 5 minutes of imprisonment.

There has been some confusion with this. Some people believe that accidental car kills are considered vehicular assault. Wouldn't it use the following act instead:

Act 6.4
A person who could do nothing to avoid the accidental death of another person is guilty of
manslaughter.


Speaking of which:

Act 6.6
​ ​ ​ ​ ​ Acts 6.1, 6.2, 6.3, 6.4 and 6.5 are punishable by up to 5 minutes of jail.


I hope they can still be investigated and be deemed innocent if that is the case, and are not automatically going to jail, as some officers seem to think that is what it means.
If it really means they all should be jailed (even if it is not their fault, such as a pedestrian jumping in front of a moving vehicle on purpose), then I completely disagree with it.



4:
Last but not least, I ask for an extension of the 7 days and make a sticky thread at IV:MP General subforum that redirects to this one, as I believe not many players have had the chance of reading this thread and express their opinions (I was completely unaware of it), since it is buried down in this subforum (even though it is correctly placed).


Also, i recommend that in the future the rules are placed on the thread itself and not a PDF file. Some players might not even notice the attachment, and it does not show up to people who are not logged in. It's about making it more user-friendly, for all the population of Liberty City. (I understand that there may be formatting issues by posting the PDF content on a thread, and that might be why the PDF format has been chosen, but still).

[Younes]

If it really means they all should be jailed (even if it is not their fault, such as a pedestrian jumping in front of a moving vehicle on purpose), then I completely disagree with it.

I believe this is what it means, and I personally agree on jailing someone who killed, whether by his intention or no. The Investigation still should be done before jailing though. The difference should be the jail time, which I hope to see implemented in the server. This means, if you kill someone without your intention to kill; and which should not be a carkill that is against rules, this includes the player throwing himself intentionally on your road in order to make you wanted; you should be jailed. I don't agree with removing the charges of someone who killed because of "It was an accident".

[superh2o]

The rules of server exist and do not clash with laws of LC.

If players wish so (police officers) (or same player using different character e.g victims brother)

They can open court case against the player who did something against the law.

Laws are used for RP and should if you do RP.

Rules apply to all and come in front of laws every time.

[James Conway]

I agree with Wheel that 7 days might be a bit short. I will extend it with another 7 days. 30th of August these laws will be the new laws. I will move this topic to General board untill the 30th and it will be stickied during that time. All suggestions are noted and will be taken into consideration.

[William Carter]

I like most changes, but here's what I believe could be improved:



1:

Act 6.9
A person who attacks another person, with or without a weapon, is guilty of assault.dw
A person who attacks another person with a vehicle is guilty of vehicular assault.
If the attacked person is a Law Enforcer, the punishment shall be more severe.

I believe the punishment should be the same regardless of what profession the person is part of. In other words, no distinction betwen Law Enforcers and Civillians.



2:

Act 6.9
A person who attacks another person, with or without a weapon, is guilty of assault.dw
A person who attacks another person with a vehicle is guilty of vehicular assault.
If the attacked person is a Law Enforcer, the punishment shall be more severe.

Again, same thing as mentioned above.



3:

Act 6.13
​ ​ ​ ​ Acts 6.9, 6.10, 6.11 and 6.12 are punishable by up to 5 minutes of imprisonment.

There has been some confusion with this. Some people believe that accidental car kills are considered vehicular assault. Wouldn't it use the following act instead:

Act 6.4
A person who could do nothing to avoid the accidental death of another person is guilty of
manslaughter.


Speaking of which:

Act 6.6
​ ​ ​ ​ ​ Acts 6.1, 6.2, 6.3, 6.4 and 6.5 are punishable by up to 5 minutes of jail.


I hope they can still be investigated and be deemed innocent if that is the case, and are not automatically going to jail, as some officers seem to think that is what it means.
If it really means they all should be jailed (even if it is not their fault, such as a pedestrian jumping in front of a moving vehicle on purpose), then I completely disagree with it.



4:
Last but not least, I ask for an extension of the 7 days and make a sticky thread at IV:MP General subforum that redirects to this one, as I believe not many players have had the chance of reading this thread and express their opinions (I was completely unaware of it), since it is buried down in this subforum (even though it is correctly placed).


Also, i recommend that in the future the rules are placed on the thread itself and not a PDF file. Some players might not even notice the attachment, and it does not show up to people who are not logged in. It's about making it more user-friendly, for all the population of Liberty City. (I understand that there may be formatting issues by posting the PDF content on a thread, and that might be why the PDF format has been chosen, but still).

well i completely agree with u wheel like if someone was driving his own car and was following the police laws and he got suspected by a victims fault why he should get jailed for some think  is not his fault. i suggest wheel is right.

[Kerbe]

I like most changes, but here's what I believe could be improved:



1:

Act 6.9
A person who attacks another person, with or without a weapon, is guilty of assault.
A person who attacks another person with a vehicle is guilty of vehicular assault.
If the attacked person is a Law Enforcer, the punishment shall be more severe.

I believe the punishment should be the same regardless of what profession the person is part of. In other words, no distinction betwen Law Enforcers and Civillians.



2:

Act 6.9
A person who attacks another person, with or without a weapon, is guilty of assault.dw
A person who attacks another person with a vehicle is guilty of vehicular assault.
If the attacked person is a Law Enforcer, the punishment shall be more severe.

Again, same thing as mentioned above.

In many legal systems, the assault on or the killing of an emergency services employee (even medics, firemen...) while performing their duties is punished more severely by the court due to the fact the person was killed while doing a public service.

3:

Act 6.13
​ ​ ​ ​ Acts 6.9, 6.10, 6.11 and 6.12 are punishable by up to 5 minutes of imprisonment.

There has been some confusion with this. Some people believe that accidental car kills are considered vehicular assault. Wouldn't it use the following act instead:

Act 6.4
A person who could do nothing to avoid the accidental death of another person is guilty of
manslaughter.

Speaking of which:

Act 6.6
​ ​ ​ ​ ​ Acts 6.1, 6.2, 6.3, 6.4 and 6.5 are punishable by up to 5 minutes of jail.

I hope they can still be investigated and be deemed innocent if that is the case, and are not automatically going to jail, as some officers seem to think that is what it means.
If it really means they all should be jailed (even if it is not their fault, such as a pedestrian jumping in front of a moving vehicle on purpose), then I completely disagree with it.

Accidental carkills are usually rulebreaks and will not be judged using these laws. If there was any form of role play involved, though, the car kill may be considered a vehicular assault and therefore the driver can be prosecuted over the court or treated accordingly in game.

The possibility of investigation is not ruled out and it's up to the investigation's result whether the person will be jailed (or prosecuted at the LC court) or not.

Also note that there is no variable jail time in game and all the punishments listed in these laws are only appliable over the LC court.

[Mihail Junkovich]

Act 1.2

• Law Enforcement Organisations in Liberty City are the Liberty City Police Department (LCPD) and the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI).
• Law Enforcer is a member of LCPD or FBI.

I think that N.O.O.S.E. should be added as it is a separated from the LCPD. Same goes for the point underneath [Maybe].

Act 1.2

• Authorisation is a specific permission given to an individual or a group of individuals by the government or the courts of Liberty City or by the LCPD or the FBI.

These points should be edited, mostly because of misconception with the Act 2.7, which states that only law enforcement is able to use for example, force to stop a suspect, when the current state is that N.O.O.S.E. can do that too

Act 6.4

• A person who could do nothing to avoid the accidental death of another person is guilty of
  manslaughter.

I deem this act unnecessary and invalid as the scenario in which victim was clearly guilty of trying to commit suicide should take all the guilt for the specific crime.


I would like to know what is the difference between Act 6.3 and 6.7, could you please clarify it for me?

Act 6.10

• A person who stalks, follows, spies on or watches a person repeatedly without his consent is guilty of
  harassment.
  A Law Enforcer performing his duties cannot be charged with harassment.

The part for Law Enforcer should have a reminder in connection with Act 2.10 which states that abuse of power is forbidden and is punishable.
Stalking a civilian constantly in order to make the him/her nervous or provoke a law-break should be punishable [Suspect-stalking]

Act 7.7

• A person who occupies or blocks government or private property he does not own is guilty of
  hijacking.
  This act is punishable by up to 10 minutes if imprisonment.

This act should be reformed to cover the case of warrant execution or possible kidnap situation in which law enforcer is in a need to block the area around the specific property in order to lower the chances of causing harm to wider public

Act 5.11

• Betting on public places is prohibited.

Act 5.12

• Holding a building with the intention of permitting bets to take place is forbidden.

Aren't these two acts in contradiction to the Act 8.2?

Act 8.2

• A person who does not respect payments in gambling activities is guilty of fraudulent gambling.

Part nine drugs, this section should be reworked with addition of details considering the specific situation - "When is the Law Enforcer allowed just to accept drugs"

Act 11.3

• All drivers must drive forward.
  Exception is for drivers who are in the process of parking their vehicle.
  No reverse movements are allowed on highways.

This act should have a reminder for the case in which you are in a need to drive backwards to avoid danger [i.e. sudden shooting/act of terrorism in front of you] or to get out of undesirable situation [Dead-end due to blockade on the road]

Act 11.4

• Drivers are required to slow down or stop their vehicles when they face a red light and traffic is
  coming from the direction with the green light. In case of absence of traffic from other directions,
  drivers are not required to stop at red lights.

This act should be reworked according to the current client possibilities as the synchronization might be a problem [Especially due to technical possibilities of an individual, for example heavy lag deceiving law enforcer into thinking that civilian committed a law-break]

Act 11.7

• Jturns, or the act of going backwards and then turning by 180 degrees, are prohibited.

This act should be reworked in order to cover the situation in which Law Enforcer is in a need to perform J-Turn in order to proceed with pursuit after evading suspects vehicle [Of course, only if the law enforcer is able to do it safely without endangering wider public]

Act 11.10

• Slowing down in front of another person with the intention of blocking them, pushing them out of the
  road or making them rapidly slow down is prohibited.
  Exception is for situations where such a rapid stop is needed, for example a pedestrian crossing the
  road in an unexpected place.

An exception should also be added for situations where law enforcer is allowed to block the suspect in order to stop his vehicle when the suspect is resisting arrest

Act 11.13

• Any driver that is danger to himself or others on a public road by repeatedly violating the laws of
  vehicle operation can be subject of temporary license revoking.

For areas that are heavily populate, violation of this act should be much more severely penalized by impounding personal vehicles that civilian uses with a fine.
The penalty itself wouldn't be harsh when issued for the first time [i.e. just 1 day of impound + penalty fine of 1000$], but with repetition, it should increase drastically
At least that is my personal opinion

[James Conway]

Topic unstickied and moved back to court board. The suggestions will be processed.

[CoolGuy295]

Topic unstickied and moved back to court board. The suggestions will be processed.

So will there be any changes made to the original document?

[PulseEffect]

Hey guys I saw you guys are writing new laws for your City. I've been writing a couple of law proposals in the past for SA:MP, if you wish I could make you guys a draft or something? :P