Argonath RPG - A World of its own
GTA:SA => SA:MP - San Andreas Multiplayer => SA:MP General => Topic started by: Gandalf on November 07, 2013, 02:45:01 pm
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But Argonath not yet!
Some of you may have already played it, others might not have gotten the news or are shocked by their experience. The Open Beta of RS5 is however a success for what it was supposed to do: give you a first look in to a new world.
Now before you stop reading in dismay of losing the RS4 you are used to, understand that RS5 is not yet the finished product, and many things will be altered. After all the experience of RS5 should not be complicated for new players, however keep the veterans more challenged in the long run.
That is why a number of features have been added and a number of changes implemented. Changes that offer the most advanced scripts possible, while at the same time keeping the freedom and character-based roleplay that you are used to.
Some things may surprise you. But most of them have been done in reply to long time requests and suggestions on our ideas boards. Do not forget it was YOU who asked for them.
In the coming week I will go in to more detail of the features and how they are set up, as well as give our idea of how to use the scripts for both free uncomplicated play and more 'serious' possibilities.
Als I will indicate which parts of the current beta are going to cheange before the final release. However RS5 is here, and is no longer a myth.
I welcome all veterans and new players to take a look and also enjoy the RS4 for the time being. Remember we are always full of surprises.
For those who are aware about my inactivity, it is coming to an end and you can expect to see a lot more from me in the coming time. I have even been spotted in game without my invisibility cloak.
It is time to start the holiday season as Thanksgiving, Hanukah, Christmas, New Year and all other festivities are getting close. Time to meet your friends and find new ones. After all that is the real reason people play here: to meet others from all over the world. For that no scripts would even be needed, your imagination and positive attitude is more than enough.
Time to enjoy!
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Welcome back!
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There's no way we can't notice the spam "GANDALF!!!one!11" :hah:
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Welcome back...and lets enjoy what we have and what we will have in the future...
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It is time to start the holiday season as Thanksgiving, Hanukah, Christmas, New Year and all other festivities
Your birthday too. :neutral2:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Brj8d5HKpEs
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Welcome Back!, Topic name scared the hell out of me.
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Welcome back!
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WellCome Back <3
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Who doesn't love the holidays? Best time of the year!
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"All good things must come to an end" i though argo was about to get closed D:
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Welcome back!
I have one thing to add..
Most of our Veterans are leaving SA:MP because they are afraid of loosing all thier assets and money earned..Some says that they "won't do scripted jobs for dollars".The Argonath Team have to do something regarding this problem..
Time to enjoy! :) :bananarock: :bananav: :jackson:
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WB, don't make party without me m'kay? :o
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Haha surprise announcement! May have to go in game to kidnap Gandalf as is tradition. :janek:
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Welcome back!
I have one thing to add..
Most of our Veterans are leaving SA:MP because they are afraid of loosing all thier assets and money earned..Some says that they "won't do scripted jobs for dollars".The Argonath Team have to do something regarding this problem..
Time to enjoy! :) :bananarock: :bananav: :jackson:
If worthless money is the only thing that keeps them here, I wish them good luck what ever they will do.
Even before being a server owner I never played for money, but also never had a problem making it. As owner most of the funds I have come from my own paydays, as I almost never use weapons.
Veterans who feel that money is more important as enjoying the game will not be missed a lot.
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Welcome back!
I have one thing to add..
Most of our Veterans are leaving SA:MP because they are afraid of loosing all thier assets and money earned..Some says that they "won't do scripted jobs for dollars".The Argonath Team have to do something regarding this problem..
Time to enjoy! :) :bananarock: :bananav: :jackson:
Playing here isn't all about how much money you can 'Collect' , weed or whatever , it's more like a place where you meet up with your friends, RP & most importantly 'have fun'.
All you need is a Forklift & carry benches <3 :)
'Hooker Duty in my case'
Screams! <3 :lol: :bananarock:
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Welcome back!
To those who leave for e-$$, sadly you have lost the value of being an real player. Because a real player, is someone who enjoys playing and interacting with people without taking into consideration of e-possessions! For the rest, let's enjoy the last of RS4 and let's give a warm welcome to RS5! :banana:
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It is time to start the holiday season as Thanksgiving, Hanukah, Christmas, New Year and all other festivities are getting close.
You forgot about Sinterklaas, Zwarte Piet is staying. :janek:
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Welcome back!
I have one thing to add..
Most of our Veterans are leaving SA:MP because they are afraid of loosing all thier assets and money earned..Some says that they "won't do scripted jobs for dollars".The Argonath Team have to do something regarding this problem..
Time to enjoy! :) :bananarock: :bananav: :jackson:
If the 'veterans' earned the money they have now, it should be no problem yet again to obtain it through hard work.
As they already got the experience how to get it.
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Welcome back!
To those who leave for e-$$, sadly you have lost the value of being an real player. Because a real player, is someone who enjoys playing and interacting with people without taking into consideration of e-possessions! For the rest, let's enjoy the last of RS4 and let's give a warm welcome to RS5! :banana:
Rock, what is that means? RS5 will release soon?
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Welcome back Gandalf.
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oh i forgot :eek:
Welcome Back Gandalf.. :bananarock:
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Rock, what is that means? RS5 will release soon?
Come on, its just the beta stage, The Development team has tons of bugs to fix. And No he does not mean that RS5 will release soon, he just said that we should be thankful to the development team instead of moaning about loosing our assets we have in RS4.
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Come on, its just the beta stage, The Development team has tons of bugs to fix. And No he does not mean that RS5 will release soon, he just said that we should be thankful to the development team instead of moaning about loosing our assets we have in RS4.
Okay then thanks Axis....<X
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It seems like the reset at RS5 is confirmed, have i'm right?
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It seems like the reset at RS5 is confirmed, have i'm right?
You are not right
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I am glad RS5 has come this far, however there is lot of bug fixing and changes to be made. The effort developers put into the script is sensible when you experience it, also the structure of RS5 quite fascinating and the surprises are yet to come. I hope everyone accustoms with the new scripts, we are still Argonath with the same vision.
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If the 'veterans' earned the money they have now, it should be no problem yet again to obtain it through hard work.
As they already got the experience how to get it.
Laziness. They may know ways of earning some money but it's having to do it all again so like I said laziness.
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Argo money is not important but you don't play game to drive around, one of your main points is to earn money. Most of players that actually want restart are cops, their main point is to get higher rank. They don't need money because they already have weapons and car, for free. All they need is a house, not necessary, sometimes you just got to have money to roleplay something that you want. You should listen other players.
If the 'veterans' earned the money they have now, it should be no problem yet again to obtain it through hard work.
As they already got the experience how to get it.
Yes, right, let's remove your division leader rank because it would be no problem to obtain it through hard work again, since you already have experience.
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Argo money is not important but you don't play game to drive around, one of your main points is to earn money.
Wrong. Main point is to meet players from all around the world and make friends!
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Most of players that actually want restart are cops, their main point is to get higher rank.
What have you been smoking, bro, how are ranks relevant to a reset?
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Wrong. Main point is to meet players from all around the world and make friends!
You might want to register on all of these networks (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_social_networking_websites)
What
What what?
Quote everything before you ask please.
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Argo money is not important but you don't play game to drive around, one of your main points is to earn money. Most of players that actually want restart are cops, their main point is to get higher rank. They don't need money because they already have weapons and car, for free. All they need is a house, not necessary, sometimes you just got to have money to roleplay something that you want. You should listen other players.
What have you been smoking, bro, how are ranks relevant to a reset?
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Yes, right, let's remove your division leader rank because it would be no problem to obtain it through hard work again, since you already have experience.
This is actually a good point.
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This is actually a good point.
Please, be my guest and elaborate in detail as to why removing leadership ranks would solve anything or even be some sort of good idea.
People should think before coming up with these supposed good ideas which make no sense.
Stop being brainwashed into thinking money is everything on a game and only caring about numbers on your screen; instead play the game for the reason it was made, for entertainment.
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The topic is left, and the discussion is going right.
Stay on topic, please.
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What have you been smoking, bro, how are ranks relevant to a reset?
Quote everything before you ask please.
Looks like I was wrong, you also have to read before replying.
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You might want to register on all of these networks (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_social_networking_websites)
Social Media was not a big thing until MySpace made it that way. Argo was around first. :)
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Argo money is not important but you don't play game to drive around, one of your main points is to earn money. Most of players that actually want restart are cops, their main point is to get higher rank. They don't need money because they already have weapons and car, for free. All they need is a house, not necessary, sometimes you just got to have money to roleplay something that you want. You should listen other players.
Yes, right, let's remove your division leader rank because it would be no problem to obtain it through hard work again, since you already have experience.
When you read our rules and vision, where does it say that it is important to gather money and possesions?
they are tools, not targets.
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Welcome back!
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Yes, right, let's remove your division leader rank because it would be no problem to obtain it through hard work again, since you already have experience.
Exactly,A very good point.
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Yes, right, let's remove your division leader rank because it would be no problem to obtain it through hard work again, since you already have experience.
If he removes it, then everyone who was banned should also get their unbans removed so they can earn them back. ;)
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If he removes it, then everyone who was banned should also get their unbans removed so they can earn them back. ;)
:lol:
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If he removes it, then everyone who was banned should also get their unbans removed so they can earn them back. ;)
yes
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Exactly,A very good point.
Please, be my guest and elaborate in detail as to why removing leadership ranks would solve anything or even be some sort of good idea.
People should think before coming up with these supposed good ideas which make no sense.
Stop being brainwashed into thinking money is everything on a game and only caring about numbers on your screen; instead play the game for the reason it was made, for entertainment.
Please Explain why.
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Stop being brainwashed into thinking money is everything on a game and only caring about numbers on your screen; instead play the game for the reason it was made, for entertainment.
I have never said that! Gandalf just said a cool thing:
they are tools, not targets.
The money isn't the most important thing, but it's needed.
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Look at it this way... everyone will be on a level playing field. If you know how to earn money or have ideas you'll earn money in no time if it matters to you. It also gives those who have been sitting and throwing their money in the air and bathing in it a chance to work for money again.
It's not the 'end' of the 'world' you know.. lets say it gives you something to do?
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The money isn't the most important thing, but it's needed.
How is money even needed?
How can money help you roleplay?
What, do you NEED a house to roleplay? Can't you drive without owning a car?
Money is absolutely the least interesting part of Argonath, this might be my opinion, but I know I'm not alone on that.
I only see one sad thing that has happened recently. I've seen a lot of players just.. Vanish away. I don't know the reason, and I wonder why.
I hope that Argonath RPG will stay the big second family that it's been ever since I joined here, and if it doesn't, I am 100% sure it will be again with the amazing team "we" have.
If the "veterans" leave, there will come new ones.
-iD.
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People who possess more will be less happy with the reset than the ones who possess nothing/less. This discussion can go on and on but eventually it's up to Gandalf to decide whether there's going to be a reset or not. Discussing this is not even possible, I suppose.
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Buying a house/car is RP
Making money is RP
Having fun with your friends is RP
Spending 50k earned in fire missions with illegal races are RPing.
I seriously get pissed when I see people saying I'm ruining this damn game because I'm not a lunatic using /me for every action I'm doing.
Saying money isn't needed? Give me a break.
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If he removes it, then everyone who was banned should also get their unbans removed so they can earn them back. ;)
And what's the point?
What, do you NEED a house to roleplay?
Yes
No one of you said why should there be reset.
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Don't you think your exaggerating a bit much?
It would be foolish to say money isn't needed, just as it would be foolish to say money is required. If money wasn't needed we wouldn't have redone the entire economy.
Money is an asset to roleplay. Roleplay is NOT dependent on money.
However, in regards to money. In RS4 the economy is... well... there is no economy. In RS5 there has been a lot of careful planning, researching, and even debates in forming a structured economy. This economy would be useless if the previous non-existent economy was merged. We're not removing money, so take a chill pill. Nobody is forcing you to hardcore RP either. The economy is an asset, just like its own assets are an asset to RP. If you read Gandalfs post about the economy you'll see all the new options of RP we have created in this economic structure.
TL:DR: old rs4 economy isn't compatible with new economy and attempt to merge the two would defeat the purpose of a more effective economic model. Also nobody is saying your ruining the game cause you don't /me, so take a chill pill.
I will now explain in comparison the two.
You all need to take a seat in a developers chair and slip your feet into our shoes. I've been working on this new economy for 10 months. It wouldn't make sense to spend 10 months developing something that would be wasted by a failed system before. The two simply are not compatible, and using RS4 would effectively render the development of a new system useless and valueless. It would be like trying to create a country with your own currency and economy while using an old countries currency. It simply wouldn't equate to something efficient.
The biggest failure of RS4 was with managers logging in doing huge events for millions, and giving away /paydays like they were a candy man at a child's birthday party. This massive inflation made money in RS4 virtually useless. It was so easy to comeby and carries essentially no value. In RS5 we've redone it so there will always be value to money, we have plans for an elaborate algorithm to measure the money of the server and support inflation and deflation of the economy. This algorithm will constantly ensure money has value in the server as well as "collect" extra funds that try to slip away.
In RS4 money is spawned in and leaves the server into a dark hole. In RS5 this isn't the case, no money is ever spawned in other than initial funds for the bank and when a player leaves. In the sense of RP the "starter" money is money a new citizen brings with them to the state. Managers can still do paydays however the money is taken from the global bank, players can also sponsor their own paydays without the requirement of manager. This will encourage players to spread the money around but this money comes from an internal source and is never spawned.
On top of this money never leaves the server. In RS4 when you buy weapons, food, clothing, vehicles, and property the money vanishes into a black hole. In RS5 when you buy something from a shop that money goes to various sources; the shop and taxes. Vehicles and properties are paid to the state, or global bank. This includes loan funds, they are paid to and from the global bank.
What does this mean? Money is something that the server is based on, its not required for RP but can be used in RP. Money is something that is valueless in RS4 but valued in RS5.
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When the final product of RS5 is released, we will be able to test your economy system to the fullest. First it felt complicated, but when you think about it RS5 will atleast have a economy system. RS4 "economy system" /send /wire. The RS5 system will be superior with cards, wallets etc.
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Yes
No one of you said why should there be reset.
Why is a house needed to roleplay?
The reset was made because the database contained about 300,000(?) different registered accounts and that would be a total clusterfuck to blend into the new script.
As well that would give the new players of the community a fair chance not being the underdogs.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but this is what I can remember.
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In terms of economy, it would benefit more from keeping the money, so that economy has a kick off, instead of every penny having to be delivered through scripts. If everyone starts off with 5k, there's going to be no money going into the global funds, there's going to be no additional money going in the bank for at least a couple of weeks, meaning, until then, the economy is going to be at a stalemate, and then kick off rather slowly. On top of that, rich players are going to be a healthy thing for the economy, with the sponsored payday script.
In terms of money not being necessary for roleplay and so on, I can agree with that to some extent. However, people have been building their characters up and they've evolved with the events that have happened over time. We know these characters, we know many aspects of these characters, and that's what creates the familiarity of Argonath. What I'm getting at is, we know who's rich, who's poor, who's your average Joe and so on, their characters have changed due to their wealth, and so has their roleplay.
So while money isn't necessary for your usual roleplay, the characters involved in the roleplay are going to be vastly different because of it. Reset the stats and you have an army of drones doing scripted jobs. Keep the stats and you have a wide array of people. Sure, a lot of them won't be too motivated to explore all the scripted jobs to their full extent, but that's the beauty of it. You won't have 100 people doing the same thing, you'll have the civilians to kidnap and pickpocket, you'll have the mafia outsourcing other businesses, and you'll have the rich politician trying to buy a mayorship with huge paydays.
I don't see why the world of Argonath should take a massive blow to it's environment because of difficulties with transferring the account data, the world of roleplay is far more important than "blending a clusterfuck into new scripts".
Just my 2 cents.
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Money is a mere tool to RP with you don't need it to be a good player :)
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Why is a house needed to roleplay?
Because I want to roleplay estate agent
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The centralized bank will start off with a realistic amount of funds to keep the economy rolling upon start-up. We cannot expect for the economy to work out while running on nothing from the beginning. That wouldn't be feasible. Players start off with $10,000 not $5,000. $5,000 is simply the max you can hold as a citizen in spare change.
Because I want to roleplay estate agent
Considering you can own unlimited properties in RS5, I think that this can be done far more possible in RS5 than RS4.
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The centralized bank will start off with a realistic amount of funds to keep the economy rolling upon start-up. We cannot expect for the economy to work out while running on nothing from the beginning. That wouldn't be feasible. Players start off with $10,000 not $5,000. $5,000 is simply the max you can hold as a citizen in spare change.
Rest of the point remains, though.
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Rest of the point remains, though.
Not really a point, its just your opinion.. which we respect your input and are taking into consideration, as we are everyone else. One thing to mention is how nonfactual your is.
If you actually read my post it has nothing to do with a "cluster fuck". If we merged the two it would be very simple, a simple script could be written to read the files and translate them into our new format. There would be no problems systematically or operationally. So no, it wouldn't be difficult to transfer the account data.
The problem lies within purpose. If we merged the two the purpose of creating a new becomes unfulfilled. Why even create new if your going to instantly ruin the new features with the pollution of the old.
There is also more creative RP opportunity to make legitimate money here in RS5 by simply RP and not scripted jobs. That'll just need to fall into the hands of the players.
However, at the end of the day its Gandalf's server and he has been leading this community as strong as it is for years now, I would trust his judgement in continuing to lead it to bigger and better.
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And what's the point?
Yes
No one of you said why should there be reset.
So that economy would finally be fine and not overinflated as f**k? Don't act stupid because it's not the time already.
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Clusterfuck was regarding iDavid's post, and only purpose even mentioning it was to make a point about difficulties with scripting shouldn't be used as an excuse to change the existing world. Glad to know that it's not an issue in this case.
Anyhow, ruining the economy, I've honestly no idea of the grand scheme of things in RS5's economy, so you'd have to address which parts of it would be drastically different with people keeping their money and people losing it. So far I can imagine the prices in shops (and other systems used to balance prices) would be higher, but that's about it.
It's a two edged sword, however. Players starting with little to no money would result in everything being priced really low. Might seem like a good thing, but that would also mean that the roleplay jobs would result in much less payment as well. Things like delivering stock to a shop would pay much less if the stock is resold at a low value. People would be unwilling to repair their vehicles 20 times an hour if it costs too much. Your usual roleplay is not going to end up you walking 10k richer, it'll end up you walking away $200 richer. And this is going to continue until enough money is brought into bank accounts from the main bank (which, as far as I can tell, is most likely going to be firemen completing missions more than anything else).
From what I've seen, the properties are overall more expensive than they currently are, meaning, unless you're extremely rich (which shouldn't be a high percentage of players), purchasing back the home you had would result in you having less funds to throw around. More so with allowing to purchase more than 1 property. The value of money would still be high as intended, though not quite as high.
But here's a better idea, instead of letting everyone keep what they have or removing it completely, do something inbetween. Let people keep a percentage of what they have. That way you would ensure that everyone wouldn't start with nothing and that people who didn't have extreme amounts of money would still have to work to make money. I'm sure you can create a quick script to check how much money is there between the active players and decide what percentage of that would be okay to remain in the economy. And then it's just a small matter of adding 1/x into the script responsible for translating current funds to the new format.
And yeah, I know, if everything costs less, then getting paid less is the same as everything costing more and getting paid more. But that's not how people think, specially not after years of RS4.
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The money isn't the most important thing, but it's needed.
Far from it. We roleplayed it in MTA:VC for years despite there being a scripted system. People were not greedy, so we roleplayed imaginary items, transactions, and activities, and paid for them via /me.
It is not hard to play pretend.
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As argonath have alot of state vehicles such as helicopters, cars, bikes, trucks and many other vehicles that can be used for free, it makes money even less important.
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Numbers don't end.
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The drastic changes are in RS4 there is legitimately no economy, no economic models, unvalued currency, and making money is easy as hell. Took me only a few months to make a few million in RS4.
The entire structure of the economy in RS5 is introduced, by allowing any third-party sourcing you are going to make starting off harder. Remember I mentioned a complex algorithm that'll count the economic value and adjust accordingly. This means, as the value in the server goes up the price of gas, items, and etc. goes up. As the value in the server goes down, the price of gas, items, and etc goes down.
Do you see the problem with sourcing the funds now from RS4? You would have the "rich" spiking the prices of everything, and the poor absolutely fucked due to those spikes. In order to give a fighting chance, the "starter" money price will increase and decrease with the value of the market.
How is the market controlled? Same way the real world does it, control the bank funds. We want deflation, we remove money. Inflation occurs naturally and never is unbalanced.
tl;dr
By introducing the RS4 value into RS5 you would ruin the algorithms that inflate/deflate the economy causing it to become ineffective and create an economic shutdown nearly instantly.
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As argonath have alot of state vehicles such as helicopters, cars, bikes, trucks and many other vehicles that can be used for free, it makes money even less important.
Agreed.
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FUCK MAN Just in my birthday :D we will remain the ban time to RS5 to :S? from RS4 ?
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The biggest failure of RS4 was with managers logging in doing huge events for millions, and giving away /paydays like they were a candy man at a child's birthday party.
Managers logging in and doing huge money giveaways saved the fucking economy, and the server.
This massive inflation made money in RS4 virtually useless. It was so easy to comeby and carries essentially no value.
That's how it should be. That's the ideal state of an RP server, where your money can be used for whatever the fuck because it's worth basically fuck all. That situation is conducive to roleplaying for the sake of roleplaying, rather than making money.
What does this mean? Money is something that the server is based on, its not required for RP but can be used in RP. Money is something that is valueless in RS4 but valued in RS5.
Until money becomes nearly valueless, you will have an early 2008 RS3 on your hands.
Quoting myself from fucking 6 years ago:
And also, in the situation all money is taken, nobody will have any money. Everyone will be abusing/exploiting (along with legitimately) making money. But the bottom line is those making money will not be doing the pure roleplay that comes with monetary satisfaction.
"I have 100k, so whats 1k spent on a RP session?"
will become
"I only have 20k now =\. I don't want to spend this money on RP."
well look who was right
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Then you simply do not understand the vision of what Gandalf had in mind then. I can assure you its not valueless economy.
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Sure, but Panda does have a point.
The only real upside of players not having any money is that shootouts with M4s, AKs and 2k armor are going to be less common, specially on the cop side (cheaper for criminals - load the weapon and buy extra ammunition rather than having to pay for the weapon as well as there's no option to load from cop side). Yeah, the grand plan of how the economy should be also will be maintained, but as far as roleplay goes, money is going to be a bigger goal than actually having fun.
You mentioned RP opportunities to make money in RS5 without the use of scripted jobs. If you can elaborate on that, okay, if not, I do not see how is this going to work when players have very little money. As Panda said, if I have 30k on me, I'm not very likely to be giving away 10k to a street sweeper, specially when I still have to make money to purchase a vehicle or two and then start thinking of properties. And I know the go-to argument here, you don't need vehicles and properties to RP, but that's not going to work. People still want them regardless if you need them or don't.
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I think Gandalf already put some examples of methods of entrepreneurship in RS5, as well as the new economy and ideals behind it.
An example would be:
A delivery service company, while delivery is scripted consider the following.
Since some areas might have high interest for mafias, they might try and extort businesses. In order to do this they'll need to create a reason for protection. Thus, a method might be attacking delivery trucks. The owner of this company would be responsible for their drivers, in turn they might hire another company which specializes in protection. The protection details could get a percentage of the awards for delivery. While protection convoys and such aren't scripted directly, they are a non-scripted service which could present reward.
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Such roleplay would be unlikely to happen until people are already on their way to making money anyway, which would only be realistic by doing jobs that get paid from the main bank. Which goes back to my earlier point about having armies of fire fighters or whatever else job there is going to be that pays well and is paid by the main bank, instead of roleplaying.
By the way, speaking of that, the whole point about this was that there would be no money spawned in and no money being removed from the economy. I'm assuming that means all the scripted jobs are paid by the bank and that there's a possibility, however unreal it may be, that the bank runs dry. What happens then, all the scripted jobs stop getting paid until people start buying weapons and paying taxes? Do you add more money to the bank? If so, does that not defeat the purpose?
PS: The past 20-30 posts really should've been at the Economy thread, but man, at least we got a productive discussion going here D:
PPS: Love the editing, also, what about the retaining a percentage of the funds, low enough to keep the algorithm working efficiently, high enough to keep the players happy? Would that not work?
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Such roleplay is likely to happen actually as long as people don't have your attitude about it.
A economic collapse is possible, we would not spawn money into the bank for the hell of it. There is mayors that'll be involved with this, there us also emergency reserve funds. It also suggests algorithms should be in place to detect a collapse and automatically making budget cuts. Currently in the event funds start looking... low, the bank will suspend loaning services automatically. We could develop a system that'll reduce the payment for government jobs. This would lead to players protesting their mayors to do something about the economy situation, strikes for police duty and etc... would be an interesting scenario to be in.
Keep in mind the bank does make money as well. Factories are also planned, they could print money.. if needed ;) #AmericanStyle
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Eh, it's hardly my attitude about it, I'm just taking that position for the sake of that actually being more productive than me enthusing over all the ways we can work now, which would lead to nothing. So far I've found out about infinity more than I did from Gandalf's posts (with no offence meant, they revealed almost absolutely nothing that you couldn't put together yourself... At least I didn't find out anything I didn't suspect/know already :3). Take this as my beta testing your vision of economy, if you will. :P
Anyway, be as it may be, I just hope that this turns out to be more than just a vision, we're attempting to move a community of people, who's vision of making money (which they already have millions of) is driving around, waiting for random pop quizzes all the while the weed is growing and the next fire mission is on it's way, to a situation where they have to actually work for their money. It's going to be some difficult times.
Good talk bro, good job with the scripts (if you've finally finished them!), and have a shot of vodka on me when your day's done.
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Oh lordy, why are you guys so crazed about the role of money on the server? Let me just clarify as objectively as possible what the role of money here and any other roleplay-based community is:
It helps you buy shit, it helps you bribe people... It's incentive, it's competition, it's reward, it's risk. It gets you what you want while making you work for it, and above all, it makes things interesting. That's it. Money here is not useless or completely unneeded (as some of you imply), nor does it form the core of the server (as others imply). You theoretically do not need money to roleplay, but you have to realize that this is 2013, and we are making the most advanced and developed form of playing pretend there is.
And this is regarding what Sugar said - We are not just going to stick with /me all the time and expect everyone to be happy with an un-immersive game of pretend. Wouldn't you agree that pretending you're a knight if you were a kid would be 10x more fun if you had a toy sword to swing around, rather than just pretending it was in your hand? If we could just pretend everything, why don't we just pretend the TV is there playing a pretend broadcast of pretend Family Guy? SOUNDS LIKE SO MUCH FUN.
Money plays the role of being more immersive. Since GTA:SA is pretty much based around real life-- and I emphasize, based on real life, not is real life or a replica-- a lot of roleplay in a multiplayer version of it is going to be based on or reminiscent of real life. You can preach however much you want about Argonath not being a real life server, which someone is bound to do sooner or later and am very well aware of (despite the fact that I made any notion of Argonath having to be a strictly realistic-based roleplay server), but like it or not, we're still running around with human-based characters and driving around with vehicles based off of real life ones... and yes - spending currency, a real life human invention. The commands, the money, the animations, the system of properties, the scripts - it's all about immersion.
I do hold high hopes that the ideas behind the new economy for Argonath will work in practice, and create a whole new level immersion.
And on an unrelated subject, I must mention as a general note, this polarity of philosophy in Argonath is other than fucking annoying ridiculous. No one ever wants to meet in the middle, everyone has to have one opinion or another, as if it were American politics. After all these years, I'm beginning to believe that people are simply playing Devil's advocate for the sport of argument.
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Wouldn't you agree that pretending you're a knight if you were a kid would be 10x more fun if you had a toy sword to swing around, rather than just pretending it was in your hand? If we could just pretend everything, why don't we just pretend the TV is there playing a pretend broadcast of pretend Family Guy? SOUNDS LIKE SO MUCH FUN.
Well said.
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Far from it. We roleplayed it in MTA:VC for years despite there being a scripted system. People were not greedy, so we roleplayed imaginary items, transactions, and activities, and paid for them via /me.
It is not hard to play pretend.
Just because some things used to work earlier before, doesn't mean that it would be advantagious to try to implement that system to this day. I can imagine that you had fun when you didn't know of any better system, but imagine saying "We had 5 inch stone TV's back in the day, and that worked fine, so you shouldn't own a 40' LCD TV".
As argonath have alot of state vehicles such as helicopters, cars, bikes, trucks and many other vehicles that can be used for free, it makes money even less important.
Sigh.
If you have ever owned a single vehicle, you know that having the option to take control, lock, and own a vehicle is much more enjoyable and advantageous than trying to live on state vehicles. Have fun trying to roleplay a street race when you can only find a few sport cars. Have fun trying to organize a mafia meeting when only a few can arrive with the mafia's signature car, and others come with a f**king taxi.
I personally enjoy owning vehicles, wether it be planes or cars, and I like to change them on a weekly basis. At lot of the fun I get from Argonath comes from driving around with my vehicles and roleplaying a role. Once again, I don't understand why we would need this downgrade.
What, do you NEED a house to roleplay? Can't you drive without owning a car?
I recently roleplayed a rich bit*h, who owned classic cars, which all were golden. I lived in a big mansion and gave away my resources to those who needed it. So yes, I needed my assets to roleplay. And guess what, I enjoyed my RP, I enjoyed it very much.
You can drive without owning a car, but it's extremely inconvinient. That's why you don't see players driving around in state cars, if they have their own vehicle at their disposal.
I seriously get pissed when I see people saying I'm ruining this damn game because I'm not a lunatic using /me for every action I'm doing.
Saying money isn't needed? Give me a break.
This.