[Guidelines] Extended Information about Forcing Roleplay

[Benn]

I hope this will help you understand what forcing RP exactly is:

Roleplay must be agreed upon by both sides in order for it to be roleplay. How a player agrees to roleplay is the confusing part as many factors can be taken into consideration.

Some of the factors include:

• The type of character you are roleplaying. If you are part of a mafia, you should expect to be involved in more crime roleplays than a civilian. This means you will be the perpetrator and the victim of such roleplays.
• Your location. If you walk into territory controlled by another group, do not expect a friendly greeting unless you are friends. Do not complain that you were killed if you walk into a mafia's headquarters with the intention of annoying them.
• Who you are with. If you are alone, you are an easy target. You should be aware of your surroundings and stick with people who will be able to help you if you get into a difficult situation. If you are in an area with no police presence, expect criminal activity.

So what constitutes an agreement of roleplay? Read through the factors above and if any apply to you, you may have no option but to agree. For example, if you are part of a mafia and you happen to walk into another mafia's territory, you have already agreed to roleplay. You cannot say that you refuse to roleplay when you have multiple guns in your face. You choose to go to that area knowing it will cause trouble, therefore you agreed to get involved in that trouble. If you get killed, it is not DM, but bad decision making on your part.

First of all and most important, the headline, Forcing Roleplay:
-Can someone simply refuse to roleplay? Can someone say : Leave me i dont feel like roleplaying now!
Gandalf's post was clear about this, "If you don't want to RP /q, but we got several opinions about this, maybe it has changed..

To some scenarios that admins always get excuses about ("I was RPing" "He ran away" "He's from a different gang!"..etc)

-Player 1 wants to rob Player 2 > Player 1 Asks Player 2 for cash (Give me your cash or die!)
Player 2 refuses to give him cash which leads Player 1 blasting Player's 2 head.
   This would be : A)Normal Roleplay    B)Forcing Roleplay    C) Deathmatching

In my opinion, a player should never say outright that they refuse to take part in any roleplay - it's a roleplay server after all and anything can happen at any time. If a player runs up to another player and demands money, simply refusing to roleplay is not acceptable. They can easily put their hands in the air and claim they have no money on them and the robber should run off before the cops get involved. If the robber ends up killing the victim then it could be seen as DM depending on the situation. Make sure you witnessed the full robbery before coming to the conclusion that it was DM, regardless what the victim said.
Likewise, if a robber notices a victim complying but not handing over money, they should know they are only doing this because they aren't interested in the roleplay, so it shouldn't result in the victim being killed. On the other hand, if a robber outright says to their victim that they must put their hands in the air or be shot at, they should comply. If they just run off, expect to be shot at (and falsely report the robber for DM).
If, however, a player is constantly robbing other players and becoming an annoyance, the player should be reported to admins and they can tell him to change roleplay.


-I encountered this situation my self a while ago, i was standing at LSCH, when a group of Ballas showed up
saying (What are you doing here bad girl? Ballas territory)And couple more of /L text and end up killing me.
   This would be : A)Normal Roleplay    B)Forcing Roleplay    C) Deathmatching

If ballas come along and claim you are in their territory - simply move away if you do not want to take part in the roleplay. Remaining there and shouting that you refuse to take part in that roleplay only makes you look stupid, especially if you are in Idlewood where you expect to encounter ballas. As your example states it happened at LSCH, you could either face off the ballas if you are brave enough or move away from the area and get the police involved. If you face them off, that is you agreeing to roleplay and you should expect to get involved in a heated argument and even fighting. If you are killed, it is your own fault.


-Player 1 tries to rob player 2, player 2 completely ignores player 1 which will end up player 1 blasting player's 2 head.
   This would be : A)Normal Roleplay    B)Forcing Roleplay    C) Deathmatching

The main problem I see is the victim ignoring the robber - why? Are they AFK, or is that their way of avoiding the roleplay? If they are AFK, then their hour glass should be visible (alt tabbing or going to the pause menu). If they left their game still running then they are still considered active and should expect to be involved in roleplays. If they are being robbed then the robber is only going to get annoyed. If this happened in Idlewood against a balla, then being killed is an option. If they are ignoring the robber because they do not want to be involved in the roleplay, then again, that is just as bad as outright saying that they refuse to take part. Remember that in order for a player to kill another player, the victim must be aware that he is about to be killed. If the robber stated that the victim must comply or be shot at, it is not DM if the victim refuses to comply. The victim decided to go against what the robber said knowing that it would result in death.


The main point that I am trying to get across is that in almost every roleplay scenario, there is always a way to avoid the roleplay by roleplaying. This means that saying "I refuse to take part in this roleplay" only shows laziness and lack of roleplay skills. If I see a player saying that, I will ask them why they even bothered to join a roleplay server - perhaps another type of server will be more satisfactory for them. If they are a new player, then perhaps a less aggressive approach is required by talking them through the options they have.

If a roleplay starts with you being forcefully pushed into a vehicle, this shows lack of roleplay skills regardless of the factors listed above. If you want someone in your vehicle quickly, either "attempt" to push someone into your vehicle or take a longer, more obvious approach by disabling the victim through means of knocking them out or tying them up. However, you still cannot do this outright - how do you know you are even able to knock the victim out? Start by demanding them to put their hands in the air, "attempt" to tie them up, then "attempt" to put them in your vehicle. Notice my emphasis on "attempt" - you should always give the victim means of a roleplay response. You could be trying to knock out a player who is roleplaying a boxer, in which case the chance of knocking him out will be less than an ordinary civilian.

If you are being forced into something that you do not want, you can just as easily force yourself out of it.

Some example scenarios:
* Kidnappers pull up along side another player in their vehicle *
* Kidnappers forces the player into the vehicle *
Player: "I refuse to take part in this roleplay"

* Kidnappers pull up along side another player in a their vehicle *
* Kidnappers forces the player into the vehicle *
* Player forcefully breaks free and runs off *

These examples both show very poor roleplay, but in the first example the player outright refuses to take part. I admit that the latter is not the best roleplay in the world, but it is roleplay and it does get the player out of a situation that he does not want to be in. If you are approached by people who are not good at roleplaying, there is nothing wrong with lowering your standards to accommodate.

[Stivi]

It's nice to have this. I do have a question though, is reporting players for "doesn't want to RP" allowed ? Is it against the rules to refuse to RP ( exceptions when you have to /q ) ?

[Kostas]

No need to tell you how many times an administrator(mod+ actually) has explained this in a much different way. To the point, are those contents acceptable from everyone in the administraton team(in general)? Because they are reasonable, and I'd say fair for both sides.

[Benn]

It's nice to have this. I do have a question though, is reporting players for "doesn't want to RP" allowed ? Is it against the rules to refuse to RP ( exceptions when you have to /q ) ?

Yes, reporting a player for doesn't want to roleplay is allowed, although admins don't punish someone who doesn't want to roleplay but they can convince him to roleplay or /q since this is a roleplay server
and  refusing roleplay is against the rules, but if you get killed or shot in a robbery for not complying to whatever the robber asks you to do is not considered deathmatching
same goes to most of the cases...
if you see someone who doesn't want to roleplay best thing to do is let admins know about him, they will probably talk to him
I hope I made it clear to you...

No need to tell you how many times an administrator(mod+ actually) has explained this in a much different way. To the point, are those contents acceptable from everyone in the administraton team(in general)? Because they are reasonable, and I'd say fair for both sides.

Most of the administrator and moderators explain the same thing but in different ways, this way Conroy explained forcing roleplay is really basic to understand and should be clear to everyone.
explaining and understanding such rule is a bit hard... so you might have understood admins and mods the wrong way...

[Kostas]

Well, situations described in this post, have been stopped by administrators for the known excuse: Forcing RP. I am not trying to be offencive, I just want to know if the content of this topic is accepted by every administrator, if I can bring it up when accused of forcing RP, and so on.

[Conroy]

Why would you want to play on a roleplay server if you are not willing to roleplay? I would remove anyone from the server caught saying such nonsense...

[Alexander_Rijav]

Roleplay must be agreed upon by both sides in order for it to be roleplay

[Conroy]

Although true, that does not mean a direct agreement. Your role, location, time of day, etc. can all be considered an agreement of roleplay. You should never outright say that you refuse to take part as there is always a way to get out of it through roleplay means.

[.Mario.]

Why would you want to play on a roleplay server if you are not willing to roleplay?

Well said.

[Kostas]

Why would you want to play on a roleplay server if you are not willing to roleplay? I would remove anyone from the server caught saying such nonsense...

Im afraid that many do not want to RP scenarios that are not in their favour.

[Spike.]

This is valid community wide and not only SA:MP, just in case someone is wondering.

[Ben.]

True, and a good guide for the most part, though situations should still be assessed individually in my opinion.
For example, if the reason you find yourself stopping in the middle of Idlewood is due to a non-RP intervention of some kind (i.e. having to go AFK for a short time, or involvement with Admins), I would expect extra consideration.

I can see varying levels of abuse regarding being allowed to shoot someone if they don't comply after a verbal warning - Again, I'd imagine this should always be taken into consideration.


My main example here would be this:

A player is running through Idlewood and is stopped playing by a IRL family member. They then return, but before they start running again a gang approaches, shouting "What are you doing here?! Hands on your head or we'll shoot!". Meanwhile, the player starts running...and is promptly shot by the gang.
In this scenario, it's worth noting a few things:
1. The only reason they have stopped is due to something IRL, which should take priority.
2. They have started running again, having just come back from being AFK.
3. The gang has approached with no prior warning, and forced a specific RP to take place, without any awareness of who they are approaching -- Let's not forget that regardless of tags, a user can RP whatever they like! At that moment, they could hold a Kolta tag but be RP'ing a farmer's dog! We don't have a rule that limits you to one character.

As the victim in this scenario, I'd expect special consideration for my circumstance...

Also, it begs the question, Did the group approach the unknown victim with the pure intention of killing them? If the real intention was death, and not role-play, again, would that be acceptable?


99 times out of 100 things fit into the guide written though, so I will be applying this to my general gameplay. Thanks for the repost! 

--Ben

[Kostas]

Nice examble, though instead of running you could RP your way out, no one can know if IRL was really the reason. Also killing someone is almost never the reason of why an RP starts, its part of the reason sometimes indeed but there is always more to this.

[Matute]

You should never outright say that you refuse to take part as there is always a way to get out of it through roleplay means.

You can always RP your wait out of it, not just run away. Maybe it is their territory, so why not approach someone who isnt from there? You question is if they came with the pure intention of killing, if you RP your way out of it, maybe you would find out, if you run away and ignore them, they can see it as an invasion of their territory and proably start shooting.

[Conroy]

I would suggest you quit the server if you are going to go AFK at a populated location, especially gangster territory. At the very least, press ESC or alt tab so other players can see the hour glass and know you are AFK. If you just simply leave your game running and return surrounded by gangsters, that is your fault. The gangsters did not know you were AFK, therefore they roleplayed with you thinking you were there. If you fail to respond, that might only upset them.

If you did quit the server or showed your hour glass, then you would expect that the gangsters would not interact with you during that time. When you return, they will continue as usual. Getting robbed in gangster territory is not uncommon, and running away will probably result in you being shot at. Remember that next time you decide to run through that area.