Where did everyone go?

[Leon.]

The "end of vacation" and "school" thing is a myth. During RS4 era and even RS5 few months ago (before all these almighty vacations) we had more than 15 players daily. It went up to 60-70.

You know what's funny? This same exact phenomenon happened exactly a year ago, hence the removal of some groups' official status - they, along with many other players, went inactive, for whatever reason. And we had the same exact argument we had in that shitstorm of a topic.

[Khm]

Alright, don't think I'm provoking or something, I am just going to counter your arguments one by one.

I don't actually enjoy heavy role-play servers, but I think that we must ''transform'' this server into a heavy rp server.
 
That's what role-players want, they don't want to be limited, they want to do WHATEVER real life offers, they wan't to feel like there is no-one who can control their acts, if they're good role-players, it's not if they kill someone that they don't know how to roleplay or they should be banned. New players login, and just insta-leave Argonath because they join into another RP server (which their community is worst than argo).

No, we do not have to transform from RPG to heavy RP server. If serious role-players wanted to really role-play on the server like real life they can do so, no one stopped them, instead they just go IG or on forum, moan how the server isn't like other RP server then quit. If they made a scene in that time while they were arguing with leaders and other veterans who helped this community a lot that would be better.
The players who come online and leave instantly do that because of one main reason: One of them approaches another armed player on Argonath, he didn't buy a weapon or anything. The new player makes a scene by robbing that guy, taking a RP'd knife from his sock, the other old player on Argonath shoots him down instantly, the new player shouts on main chat "DM shit server, no RP at all" and gets banned. That's our main problem.

I don't know, it's just boring, playing with only 15 players (peak-time) it's like working on McDonalds. We need those players who invite their friends which invite their friends etc.
Players got abused but they can't do nothing against admins because they are ADMINS who abuse and says infront of the f**cking computer ''muahaha look at me leading this shit''. Most of them just don't listen to US, to our community members, even who's actually retired. Now? Now we lost them all, old players who gave a lot for this community and entertainment of the server, who are probably playing at this moment at another server, they found a leader at another community probably.

I have to agree with you about this point, there's still this old mentality if you're being hated by one of the staff members you will get watched strictly, if one of the loved staff team makes a mistake the others cover his arse instead of instructing him, it was reduced than before but still around which helped in what's happening now.

I'm not surprised with what's just happening.
And that stupid ban period it's to f**cking long.
 If someone says that he is sorry, f**cking FORGIVE HIM. Give him another f**cking chance and just unban him. I'm not saying to unban the player in 2 hours or so, but half a year? What the fuck? It's OBVIOUS that the player WON'T play in here anymore, not because he isn't loyal or ''doesn't deserve to play here'' But he got a life, maybe he will just keep playing sa:mp for more one year or so, YOU DON'T KNOW, if he returns to play at argo, feel lucky. So many shits happening that I dont need to say because it was already said, but as always, no one gave a fuck about it.

That is wrong, it's already a chance for them to come back instead of a perm ban, you're not making a favour by playing on the server, you're there to enjoy and not to annoy people who want to enjoy, anyone annoying others/breaking rules shouldn't stay at all.

a lot of players want to bring old argo activity back, unfortunately we can't do that as we are.

We actually can if everyone accept the truth about what's happening in SA:MP and not treat others differently + if people didn't take RP scenarios so personal we would be in a better time, unban request section would be dead right we are here to have fun and make friends.
If people don't get salty from anything that others say about them we'd increase the activity, true school and the end of vacation have an effect on this but thinking it's only because of that is just lying to ourselves to deny the fact that we screwed up and we have to make change with listening to each-other in a civilised way.

[Bruce.]

I'm not surprised with what's just happening.
And that stupid ban period it's to f**cking long.
 If someone says that he is sorry, f**cking FORGIVE HIM. Give him another f**cking chance and just unban him. I'm not saying to unban the player in 2 hours or so, but half a year? What the fuck? It's OBVIOUS that the player WON'T play in here anymore, not because he isn't loyal or ''doesn't deserve to play here'' But he got a life, maybe he will just keep playing sa:mp for more one year or so, YOU DON'T KNOW, if he returns to play at argo, feel lucky. So many shits happening that I dont need to say because it was already said, but as always, no one gave a fuck about it.

Ok let's unban someone who hacks the shit around causes shitstorm and dm fests around only cause he says "SORRY ADMIN IT WAS MY 2 YEARS OLD BROTHER". Because let's believe him and unban him....It doesn't really works like that. And trust me Argonath has short ban periods of time, i've seen way worse....

[Teddy]

I have to agree with you about this point, there's still this old mentality if you're being hated by one of the staff members you will get watched strictly, if one of the loved staff team makes a mistake the others cover his arse instead of instructing him, it was reduced than before but still around which helped in what's happening now.

I agree as well but I do plan on fixing this. As I've recently become a manager I have a lot of admins and moderators in my crosshairs. Mistakes happen, but we're humans and this is how we learn, by making mistakes and being corrected when they occur. We cannot learn if we do not know we're doing wrong. Do note you will not always see those corrections, but do expect more apologizes from admins/moderators who make mistakes.

[Khm]

I agree as well but I do plan on fixing this. As I've recently become a manager I have a lot of admins and moderators in my crosshairs. Mistakes happen, but we're humans and this is how we learn, by making mistakes and being corrected when they occur. We cannot learn if we do not know we're doing wrong. Do note you will not always see those corrections, but do expect more apologizes from admins/moderators who make mistakes.

True mistakes happen but we have to correct them not leave them to happen again, that's what's mostly causing stress nowadays.
The best way to move forward.

[Jay42]

This is how we used to treat banned players, everyone said sorry and they all got unbanned, but what happened? Nothing, they got unbanned and continued where they left. Sure some people are actually sorry and won't repeat it, but 90 per cent of the people just continue doing what they used to do. I actually like the longer bans, it learns the people that not everything is acceptable, and sometimes I still find some of the ban reviews to be a bit short. But then again, we all have different views. I rather have people actually think about what they've done, and learn from it, and not repeat it in the future. Than 2-3 people in the server that rule-break and ruin the experience for others. I'd rather see a guy banned for a month or two, and learn something, than people leave/ get annoyed/ start flaming because that guy DMs him/ her again, and then they both get punished, and we lose even more people.

They did? Ban him for the time x2 than the last ban, if they continue, the same. So they must be banned for half a year? 1 month maximum in my opinion.

Alright, don't think I'm provoking or something, I am just going to counter your arguments one by one.
No, we do not have to transform from RPG to heavy RP server. If serious role-players wanted to really role-play on the server like real life they can do so, no one stopped them, instead they just go IG or on forum, moan how the server isn't like other RP server then quit. If they made a scene in that time while they were arguing with leaders and other veterans who helped this community a lot that would be better.
The players who come online and leave instantly do that because of one main reason: One of them approaches another armed player on Argonath, he didn't buy a weapon or anything. The new player makes a scene by robbing that guy, taking a RP'd knife from his sock, the other old player on Argonath shoots him down instantly, the new player shouts on main chat "DM shit server, no RP at all" and gets banned. That's our main problem.
I have to agree with you about this point, there's still this old mentality if you're being hated by one of the staff members you will get watched strictly, if one of the loved staff team makes a mistake the others cover his arse instead of instructing him, it was reduced than before but still around which helped in what's happening now.
That is wrong, it's already a chance for them to come back instead of a perm ban, you're not making a favour by playing on the server, you're there to enjoy and not to annoy people who want to enjoy, anyone annoying others/breaking rules shouldn't stay at all.
We actually can if everyone accept the truth about what's happening in SA:MP and not treat others differently + if people didn't take RP scenarios so personal we would be in a better time, unban request section would be dead right we are here to have fun and make friends.
If people don't get salty from anything that others say about them we'd increase the activity, true school and the end of vacation have an effect on this but thinking it's only because of that is just lying to ourselves to deny the fact that we screwed up and we have to make change with listening to each-other in a civilised way.

we don't need to, but we must increase it a bit. It's not what I want, I like the argo RP mode how it already is, but if we want to get RP's to come we must increase it, also adding some CMDS would be nice and don't come with ''you can rp it and shit'' Because there are many scripts which could increase the entertainment.
 
If they break the rules once, or even twice they shouldn't be banned for more than 1 month. Also sometimes there are enjustices from admins.

Ok let's unban someone who hacks the shit around causes shitstorm and dm fests around only cause he says "SORRY ADMIN IT WAS MY 2 YEARS OLD BROTHER". Because let's believe him and unban him....It doesn't really works like that. And trust me Argonath has short ban periods of time, i've seen way worse....

Yeah, unban him after 1 week, and keep an eye on him. if someone reports him for HACKS admins could check logs and ban him for 1 month. than, if he repeats, ban for 2 months, and that.

I agree as well but I do plan on fixing this. As I've recently become a manager I have a lot of admins and moderators in my crosshairs. Mistakes happen, but we're humans and this is how we learn, by making mistakes and being corrected when they occur. We cannot learn if we do not know we're doing wrong. Do note you will not always see those corrections, but do expect more apologizes from admins/moderators who make mistakes.

To be honest? I'm kinda glad to hear that, unfortunately that's just words and not actions. There are so many injustices. And when we ''report'' a staff members, nothing happens, not even a reply.

[Bruce.]

Yeah, unban him after 1 week, and keep an eye on him. if someone reports him for HACKS admins could check logs and ban him for 1 month. than, if he repeats, ban for 2 months, and that.

Doesn't HQ do it like that? First ban 1 month, 2nd one 2 or 3 months, 3rd one 6 and 4th one in a row probably one year or a simply "Find somewhere else to play" ... ofc if bans on a short period of time...Players just have to think before activating trollmode and just choose to fuck around....

The ban period is cool and I don't think your words will affect into it.... but It's not that the reason of keeping players away.

[Teddy]

To be honest? I'm kinda glad to hear that, unfortunately that's just words and not actions. There are so many injustices. And when we ''report'' a staff members, nothing happens, not even a reply.

Not just words, I have already spoken with a few of them and opened discussion with HQ on a whole host of other staff members and things to keep an eye on. Actions are going on, just because you don't see doesn't mean they don't exist. I've not seen any reports since I've become a manager so I can't speak to that.

[Jay42]

Doesn't HQ do it like that? First ban 1 month, 2nd one 2 or 3 months, 3rd one 6 and 4th one in a row probably one year or a simply "Find somewhere else to play" ... ofc if bans on a short period of time...Players just have to think before activating trollmode and just choose to fuck around....

The ban period is cool and I don't think your words will affect into it.... but It's not that the reason of keeping players away.

as i said '' 1 week - 2 week -1 month -2. It's not '' players just have to think before activating blabla'' It's  all about being unfair and lots of players get banned for stupid reasons.

[Jay42]

Not just words, I have already spoken with a few of them and opened discussion with HQ on a whole host of other staff members and things to keep an eye on. Actions are going on, just because you don't see doesn't mean they don't exist. I've not seen any reports since I've become a manager so I can't speak to that.

To me, it stills only words because as you said ''just because you don't see doesn't mean they dont' exist'' exactly, I don't see them, if they actualy exist, that's good to hear, and I hope the best.

[Rusty]

Doesn't HQ do it like that? First ban 1 month, 2nd one 2 or 3 months, 3rd one 6 and 4th one in a row probably one year or a simply "Find somewhere else to play" ... ofc if bans on a short period of time...Players just have to think before activating trollmode and just choose to fuck around....

The ban period is cool and I don't think your words will affect into it.... but It's not that the reason of keeping players away.

First - Few weeks/Month
Second - Two Months
Third - Three Months
Anything more and it's a permanent denial with no chance of unban.

Quite a few admins have been spoken to about their actions when they've been reported (I'm probably the one that's spoke to most of them), others were simply found to be false reports with no meaningful purpose but to complain that they got punished when they did infact rule break. 

[Nathan]

I've gotten older. I work Monday through Friday from 7AM to 4PM. I'm literally in front of the computer all day and the last thing I want to do is go back on a computer once I get home from work.

I try to get on the weekends though.

[Khm]

A fast question, do you also handle old, I mean very old reports? If yes I may hit you up tomorrow on skype about some old case(s).

[Jay42]

First - Few weeks/Month
Second - Two Months
Third - Three Months
Anything more and it's a permanent denial with no chance of unban.

Quite a few admins have been spoken to about their actions when they've been reported (I'm probably the one that's spoke to most of them), others were simply found to be false reports with no meaningful purpose but to complain that they got punished when they did infact rule break.

I don't agree with that, there are many POV'S which are kinda right but not a reason to ban, for example, DM. i've seen players getting warn, kick TB and ban for DM, 1 reason and 4 different punishments. It's all up to the admin who handles ur case.

[Axison]

I don't agree with that, there are many POV'S which are kinda right but not a reason to ban, for example, DM. i've seen players getting warn, kick TB and ban for DM, 1 reason and 4 different punishments. It's all up to the admin who handles ur case.

Not all DM cases are the same. It's all up to the case.