FLA vs ARPD - Let's talk

[eymas]

Again. Instead of arguing about rights or wrongs. Try aiming to solutions that we can all agree on.

We all know that we want both groups to ignore each other, and this is achievable if the players follow this.
We cannot make it a server rule to forbid interaction between the groups. Neither can we perform impossible miracles.

Think outside of the box, like i've said you already have most of what you desire if you look at it from the rules.

[Mikal]

Closing FLA is an option I would rather not take, but I feel we aren't getting to any other option if they remain on their set goal of bullying the ARPD. I liked their idea of an independent country with their own lifestyle but so far it's just a covert TDM, alas from what I keep hearing... The ARPD keeps fueling this as well.

I doubt anyone enjoys SA:MP anymore thanks to this global war, and we must come to a solution to keep both groups happy to a degree.

Practically, From what I understood. FLA just wants to have an independent country acknowledged by the state of argonath. De facto this isn't required as you can already roleplay this by our ruling. Players have the choice to accept or refuse this as they travel through flint county. They cannot be forced to comply with the policies that this country would then enforce. That way one part of the entire shitstorm is potentially solved.

The thing is, FLA is pretty much the most active non-law enforcement group on the server, what we do is what is keeping players coming on, a few have actually told me they only came back for FLA, I'm not gloating, I'm seeing it how it is, despite RS5.2 the server population has once again dropped and now you think you can come over here suggesting to close one of the things keeping it going, as I've said, if police didn't come to us or block what we call our borders, there would be no shootout, how many times do I have to say that? It's not like we actively group up and then going into Los Santos looking for cops to kill, and I feel like that's what you're making it out we do...

I'll leave you with this picture from when law enforcement came to us in Angel Pine and tazed me yesterday.

Spoiler for Hiden:

First of all, they're not gonna get an independent country. None from Law Enforcement is gonna let that happen. It's normal and it wouldn't be let done in real life either, imagine some militia in USA rebelling against government. Oh wait, it happened. Take Oregon Militia as example.

You are pretty much not in a position to dictate wether we get independence or not, that is up to Gandalf/HQ, and the only way the shooting is going to stop is, well, either law enforcement stops coming to us, or Flint Country gets independence.

Try aiming to solutions that we can all agree on.

Independence?

[Axison]

Turn this into a role play situation. If the ARPD can't deal with this(which they clearly can't) then give FLA what they want. I haven't seen any roleplay from the cops against FLA besides guns blazing(sorry if i sound a little biased). And what Kaze said, its been a long time since i've seen a group with such a unique goal. Free Flint!

[Justin39]

Yes, it's always guns blazing because if cops enter Flint County, we get shot at.  Obviously we'll retaliate.

[Kaze]

Only problem being that even if we kill the head of the snake in this case, the head comes back (in a different situation obviously) 

What are the objectives? There's never, ever going to be a formal proposal to "liberate" Flint Count from the rest of the map.

This is all fine if your objectives are attainable, but are they?

Yeah, first of all I want to apologize for generalizing all LEOs. Let's say MAJORITY of cops (relating back to my previous post).

Well, let's say a restraining order would last from 5-21 days. I don't see FLA as a terrorist group. They are just playing your game. You come with guns? They would respond with guns. Leave them alone, they should leave you alone too.

I've been wanted to start a Nazi group for ages now but can't because of the players in this community. If I take over in a territory and say 'no blacks' I'd get 24/7 moans.

UNLESS THEY ARE A SUSPECT, LET THEM BE.

If FLA is bothering you, why don't you stop big families like Corleone and Gvardia who allegedly deal with drugs in big batches. Two families dealing with 200kg of cocaine doesn't concern you but a party who wants independence does? Give me a break.

I am not part of FLA nor any other group for that matter. My views on this is strictly neutral.

[Chase]

The only suggestion I have in mind is how some big wars in our history have resulted to - Cease fire agreement aka. Armistice

Kinda think of it like the issue with North Korea vs South Korea. They are technically at war still but agreed to a cease fire. Some flare ups could occur  in or around the DMZ, but usually its not long term. And anyone who decides to go to North Korea does it at their own peril.

Maybe the same can apply here?

It's the only roleplay peaceful option I see.

[Mikal]

I haven't seen any roleplay from the cops against FLA besides guns blazing(sorry if i sound a little biased).

I'll be honest, FLA haven't roleplayed at all lately, we don't have time to, as soon as we group up to do something there's a mob of angry cops waiting to close the roads or generally come to Angel Pine to 'patrol'.

Yes, it's always guns blazing because if cops enter Flint County, we get shot at.  Obviously we'll retaliate.

Entering rebel held territory gets law enforcement/(uh, army) shot at, just as it would in reality.

Kinda think of it like the issue with North Korea vs South Korea.

Aye, so lets create a cease fire, during this, law enforcement will stay out of 'Flint Country', we can organise it in RP if you like.

[.Matthew.]

I don't get people saying "cops can't deal with it". Tell us what do you expect us to do? realistically, you want us to walk to them and talk? I've tried that many times and as I said earlier, they submit unrealistic demands which cannot be executed. They don't care about roleplaying along with ARPD, they just want to win. That's what I call a must win attitude. Numerous times I try to end the situation diplomatically by just talking and negotiating. Never had it worked. Even though I go down and say I understand them and their issues and ask for understanding, they just wanna make a shootout and win. And then again, when we respond in such a manner in which we defend the country itself from these rebels, the other side of Argonath (since argonath has 2 sides - cops and robbers), steps in and says we can't deal with FLA. If there was a proper unbiased neutral party in Argonath, those neutral citizens, then we'd hear different opinions. But since it's all built up by either a cop or a criminal, it'll be constant TDM. And I'd for sure love more than anything going back to gangs and mafias. Good times those were.

[eymas]

Like i have said, You already have your independence if we look at the server rules.

Basically, You and players that want can roleplay your country already.
The passerby players however have the choice to accept or deny playing along, and cannot be forced to follow your country's playstyle.
Dito for the ARPD, They cannot be restricted from entering the county upon pursuits or patrols, Their job covers the state in the first place.
You can't shoot them on sight either, since that's deathmatching. Rebel or not. Shouldn't exploit it as an excuse either.

This hopefully gets us a little closer to the ceasefire chase mentioned 

[Mikal]

Like i have said, You already have your independence if we look at the server rules.

Basically, You and players that want can roleplay your country already.
The passerby players however have the choice to accept or deny playing along, and cannot be forced to follow your country's playstyle.
Dito for the ARPD, They cannot be restricted from entering the county upon pursuits or patrols, Their job covers the state in the first place.
You can't shoot them on sight either, since that's deathmatching. Rebel or not. Shouldn't exploit it as an excuse either.

This hopefully gets us a little closer to the ceasefire chase mentioned 

What you have said gets us no closer, but I guess FLA and law enforcements leaders can try to broker something in-game.

[.Matthew.]

They can roleplay all they want their rebel group. If they do it properly however. If they decide to make a roadblock, and get approached by Police and FBI, they should play along. They can't expect us to execute their unrealistic demands. I'm there to roleplay as an FBI Agent, they're there to roleplay as rebels. Watch how it works on youtube and come back and play along. You're acting as if it's normal for rebels to block roads in real life and let it be tolerated by cops, or shoot on sight. Well then my friend, you get done properly by an unmanned predator drone that bombs you without you even knowing how you died afterwards, Since this is Argonath, all I'll ask for is play along and stop with unrealistic demands and unrealistic roleplay.

[Luke]

Bottom line is this needs to be sorted with both sides, both sides are in the wrong, thats it.

p.s been saving this for rainy day;

Spoiler for Hiden:

[Mikal]

They can roleplay all they want their rebel group. If they do it properly however. If they decide to make a roadblock, and get approached by Police and FBI, they should play along. They can't expect us to execute their unrealistic demands. I'm there to roleplay as an FBI Agent, they're there to roleplay as rebels. Watch how it works on youtube and come back and play along. You're acting as if it's normal for rebels to block roads in real life and let it be tolerated by cops, or shoot on sight. Well then my friend, you get done properly by an unmanned predator drone that bombs you without you even knowing how you died afterwards, Since this is Argonath, all I'll ask for is play along and stop with unrealistic demands and unrealistic roleplay.

And so the fighting will continue until independence...

Or at the very least, a ceasefire in which law enforcement stop entering Flint Country.

[Sweeper]

End this, end the deathmatch.

[.Matthew.]

And so the fighting will continue until independence...

See what I'm talking about managers, admins, developers and HQ ?