UK EU Referendum

[Mikal]

At least David Cameron is standing up for what he believes in. Boris Johnson on the other hand previous was a prime supporter of Turkey joining the EU. He sure made a U turn on that pretty quickly... The only thing Boris Johnson is standing for is himself... if we do leave the EU, the main well known Conservative politician will be guess who... Boris Johnson. He's got his eyes on the Prime Minister position. Nothing more, nothing less.

Aslong as Boris keeps working within the interests of the UK and for the UK I couldn't give 2 shits on wether he's doing all this for his political position, Cameron is a spineless liar (who I used to support) and Boris would definitely have done a better job negotiating the UK's position within the EU, something that Cameron completely failed at, didn't even look like he put in any real effort, he is a laughing stock.

Besides, you can't really moan about Boris leading the Conservatives whilst Corbyn leads Labour, both of them are clowns.

[Julio.]

Corbyn leading labour was a bit of an accident I think. I believe he was nominated to "make a point" as a truly left-wing candidate, and due to the state of the party, was actually voted in...  couldn't see him being PM, but it certainly got the point across that Labour had lost their way a bit.

Let's see what happens tomorrow, most polls I've seen on economic/technical/education websites have supported remain, and so far on a motorbike + gaming forum I've seen mainly seen people wanting to leave.

[Mikal]

Most polls I've seen indicate that it's neck and neck after the murder of Jo Cox, though leave was in the lead beforehand, of course some people linked the murder to the Leave campaign, which is quite screwed up if you ask me.

I assume Remain will win though, after all David Cameron granted the Scottish independence referendum, which he won, and now he's granted this one, and it just so happens the polling cards are to be filled in with pencil, god help us in our 'democracy'...

[Julio.]

Making excuses already 

The majority will speak 

[Julio.]

And on a similar note:

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/05f69210-3684-11e6-a780-b48ed7b6126f.html?siteedition=uk#axzz4CJ7spYCs

[Mikal]

I'm not making excuses, it's just beyond me how polling cards which will be counted by volunteers are to be filled in with pencil, why not use black pen? It's the safest way to get the best result... After the Scottish Indy Ref there was lots of claims (and some actual footage) of people fucking with the polling cards, in democracy that is plain wrong.

And on a similar note:

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/05f69210-3684-11e6-a780-b48ed7b6126f.html?siteedition=uk#axzz4CJ7spYCs

You see, to Remain voters it's all economy, economy, economy, you throw everything else to the wind.

[Julio.]

Uh, you mean remain voters are those actually not disregarding the argument amount the economy entirely? The Brexit argument has has been driven in a large part by racism and hate in my honest opinion.

[Mikal]

Uh, you mean remain voters are those actually not disregarding the argument amount the economy entirely? The Brexit argument has has been driven in a large part by racism and hate in my honest opinion.

Please, I seriously beg you to find me some racism in the Brexit campaign, I'll be waiting.

As for the economy, as I have said, I doubt we'll lose the trade agreements, the EU wouldn't want to stop trading with 65million people, that in my eyes is complete common sense.

[Julio.]

Please, I seriously beg you to find me some racism in the Brexit campaign, I'll be waiting.

As for the economy, as I have said, I doubt we'll lose the trade agreements, the EU wouldn't want to stop trading with 65million people, that in my eyes is complete common sense.

It's all around you if you look:
https://www.evernote.com/shard/s1/sh/0025da4a-e0c2-4854-9da6-083ee801b2a2/8f70688d584c1ae5

Probably worth rewording your last sentence. All EU trade agreements will need to be renegotiated as we will technically no longer have them. All will need to be reviewed as they're under the EU umbrella.

[taseen11]

Pretty sure we traveled before the EU...

After signing a shit ton of paper work, paying for and meeting visa requirements 😀

Free movement is the best thing about being in the EU. Being able to go to any member state without visas or any questions is great.

[Julio.]

Pretty sure we traveled before the EU...

This is drawn from your extensive experience of traveling before we were in the EU? 

[Mikal]

It's all around you if you look:
https://www.evernote.com/shard/s1/sh/0025da4a-e0c2-4854-9da6-083ee801b2a2/8f70688d584c1ae5

That's racist?! LMAO.

Probably worth rewording your last sentence. All EU trade agreements will need to be renegotiated as we will technically no longer have them. All will need to be reviewed as they're under the EU umbrella.

Or we can just become part of the EFTA like Switzerland, problem solved.

After signing a shit ton of paper work, paying for and meeting visa requirements

Yes, just like we do with the rest of the world, unlike Remain voters I care more for the country as a whole than I do my own wallet.

This is drawn from your extensive experience of traveling before we were in the EU? 

Oh alright then, we were all stuck on our little island until the EU came along.

[taseen11]

Yes, just like we do with the rest of the world, unlike Remain voters I care more for the country as a whole than I do my own wallet.

If you cared for the country you'd vote remain. Britain's economy will get fucked if we leave. Not a single economist has said it would be fine. There have been no long term projections of how the UK would be if it were to leave so we would be taking a gamble with our country. Is that a risk you're willing to take?

The leave campaign literally have no facts to back up what they're saying.

[Julio.]

No other country has managed to secure significant access to the Single Market, without having to:

    follow EU rules over which they have no real say
    pay into the EU
    accept EU citizens living and working in their country

So, even if we go the same way as Norway and Switzerland, we still need to accept EU immigrants, follow certain EU rules, and pay money into it... but no longer have a say in any of the regulations? Genius idea.

If the UK voted to leave the EU, we would lose access to trade agreements with more than 50 countries outside the EU. The UK would seek to renegotiate these deals, but this would take years and there is no guarantee that the UK would manage to negotiate terms as good as those we enjoy today.

Many of our international trade partners have had deals negotiated through the EU, we would also have to renegotiate these. Canada has been negotiating for years and not even their agreement is fully in force with the EU yet!

We can work anywhere we want without having to apply for a work visa.

As an individual interested in working across Europe, I don't relish the thought of applying for a work visa and *hoping* I get it.

In his new deal, Cameron has secured a ‘brake’ period of seven years on EU migrants claiming benefits, which would reduce the number of people potentially abusing the system.

People have belittled David Cameron's negotiations but there have been a couple of useful items crop up, including the item above.

The EU has introduced many directives which undoubtedly help British workers and protect our rights.

These include:

    Regulated working hours and break times, so people cannot be forced to work more than 48 hours a week
    At least four weeks of guaranteed annual leave
    Four months paid parental leave and extra protections for pregnant workers
    Anti-discrimination laws, so people cannot be discriminated against on the grounds of race, ethnicity, religion or belief, disability, age, or sexual orientation.
    Protection for workers when companies change ownership

It's not always "Beloved Britain" that implements safeguard for workers, quite the opposite. Our current government isn't "for the people", so we need an overseer that acts as a safety net.

Treasury analysis has found that the average family’s weekly food and drink bill would rise by almost three per cent, in the event of Brexit.

Some people don't have that money to spend. This is assuming that they aren't one of the 3 million people involved in jobs that are reliant on the EU...


This is before you even take into account  the funding that the EU has provided to Wales specifically!
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/19-things-european-funding-done-10939396

[Mikal]

If you cared for the country you'd vote remain. Britain's economy will get fucked if we leave.

We were just fine before we joined, just like every other country outside of the EU is just fine, infact, the worlds richest countries are outside the EU.

Not a single economist has said it would be fine. There have been no long term projections of how the UK would be if it were to leave so we would be taking a gamble with our country. Is that a risk you're willing to take?

Yes, it's a risk I'm willing to take, is voting Remain and risking having to bail out EU countries in future a risk you're willing to take? Is terror attacks aided by free movement a risk you're willing to take? Is pressure on the NHS and other public services a risk you're willing to take? Is increased house prices and house shortages a risk you're willing to take? Everything is a risk.

So, even if we go the same way as Norway and Switzerland, we still need to accept EU immigrants, follow certain EU rules, and pay money into it... but no longer have a say in any of the regulations? Genius idea.

It's this simple to the EU: Meet the demands of the UK's people, or lose trade with 65million people.

Many of our international trade partners have had deals negotiated through the EU, we would also have to renegotiate these. Canada has been negotiating for years and not even their agreement is fully in force with the EU yet!

Meanwhile, we could be creating our own deals, trading with Canada and the rest of the world without running it through the EU first.

People have belittled David Cameron's negotiations but there have been a couple of useful items crop up, including the item above.

He failed to do anything significant.

It's not always "Beloved Britain" that implements safeguard for workers, quite the opposite. Our current government isn't "for the people", so we need an overseer that acts as a safety net.

Well, then it's time to make our government 'for the people'.

Some people don't have that money to spend. This is assuming that they aren't one of the 3 million people involved in jobs that are reliant on the EU...

You mean reliant on the jobs that will remain due to the UK keeping it's trade agreement with the EU due to our significant population.

This is before you even take into account  the funding that the EU has provided to Wales specifically!
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/19-things-european-funding-done-10939396

Oh, a list of things we could do with the £18billion we save leaving the EU. (Yes I'm aware we get re-baits and such).



This just in:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36596060

Which demonstrates my point about the European Union NEEDING our trade.