Knock knock

[Serifis]

"A fish rots from the head down"...At leats that is what they are saying in my village.

[jovanca]

Nice. Nice. Very fucking nice. Look at all of those funny folks completely drained in mud, by all means.

Here's one suggestion; start playing and invite your similar spoiled friends in order TO PLAY THE GAME AND NOT BULLSHIT OR POINT FINGERS. For once. Talk it out, have patience, stop judging each and every move, stop complaining constantly.

Couple of years back it was Carbon you all starting throwing shit at, no wonder he is now inactive af, then it was some other dude, then it was some other dude, then it was Bas, now the current one in charge. DROP THE 'MY WAY OR NO WAY' MENTALITY.

Let's say everyone involved in the SAMP leadership resigns. Has it crossed your majestic mind that if it's not one of your friends in charge you'll still fucking be not satisfied?

Most if not all of you complaining are actively playing on this other server and yet come here every now and then when similar topic to this one is opened in order to bullshit the ones who are in charge this time. Guess what? The ones in charge at that specific server used to be in charge or at least part of the server here. Most likely you have thrown shit in their face during their reign here as well. This other server has 90% Argonath blood all the way to its corpse.

Yes there have been mistakes, yes there has been corruption, yes there was false calls BUT YES THIS IS ARGONATH. It always has been like that whether you are old enough to realize or not.

Now for the love of God let's not make this another one of the cancerous topics that end up locked due to people being moderated but at least have the decency and honor to realize that you are not helping the server if you simply are here to point fingers and look for excuses from the rule book in order to cause further harm.

You got something to suggest? Then that's awesome. We'd be fascinated to here your proposals. But let it be for improvement, not for just another stab to Argonath's heart, it has taken plenty of these.

I didn't point fingers, the topic asks what made people stop playing, and i said what made me stop playing. as for the other off topic bs you said, i can only tell you to get a life lol

[Hubbestubbe]

Good topic and interesting replies, but I'd need some more constructive criticism. Saying "leadership is shit" doesnt tell me too much. Please come with ideas of what we can change instead.

[Lonewolf]

Good topic and interesting replies, but I'd need some more constructive criticism. Saying "leadership is shit" doesnt tell me too much. Please come with ideas of what we can change instead.

I'd say a massive nerf against weed and drugs in general, when it comes to prices. Maybe a look at the current economy system would be great, since it is, so easy to earn money.

[Stivi]

Please come with ideas of what we can change instead.

The leadership? What else can we change? Scripts? Rules? Players? The server has no clear direction, one day it's freeroam, CnR, strict RP or poor RP? If there's an event, it's a special 3-in-1, you start playing in CnR, then mid-chase you TP to a "escape the shamal" event and after that, it's freeroam because you got hit and didn't have a chute..

Our staff team is not able to come forward and enforce a set of rules. Do your jobs properly, that's what I want. When that starts happening then maybe you will see script suggestions, rule discussion and more. If you can't do your job, step down, easy.

[Stefos]

As a board moderator, let's keep this topic civil, like asked to. Try not to post things that people may find offensive and react to those.
Then all hell will break loose. We do not want that. Thanks 

[Nathan]

Good topic and interesting replies, but I'd need some more constructive criticism. Saying "leadership is shit" doesnt tell me too much. Please come with ideas of what we can change instead.

I've posted several times and I don't know how much clearer I can make it. You refuse to listen and don't even want to acknowledge what several veterans have been telling you and others on your team.

The problem is with the leadership from the top. Not you specifically but people above you. Because of them, our community is no longer striving and is no longer in good shape. They need to step down or take on more activity to make decisions. This does not mean they need to invite a bunch of veterans to come back for a month. Without this change, the rest of the (staff) body is poisoned and no progress will be made. Cut the poison off, please.

It's time to pass on the torch.

Please, please, get someone who will not fuck up the community further than what it is now with the inactivity and inability to make meaningful changes. Asking for no-script changes from the players without having the actual ability to make meaningful changes is pointless. Any progress will be hindered from the people above you.

[Bogomil]

Haha Nathan you can't buy the community.

[Sawyer]

knock knock this is motherfucking loupid in the house

Due to the drama I missed this glorious post.

Lmao wassup Dr. Loupid_Araatus, hit me up on Disc to kick your butt in-game.

[Leon.]

There's a lot of themes that I have noticed in my years of playing. I can't really comment on the past 3 years, but I imagine there are some common denominators that come into play despite these different time periods.

-HQ's inability to decisively handle toxic relations between groups
-Groups' consistent inability to maturely handle their relations among themselves; witchhunting, cheating, players bringing IRL nationalistic hatred into the game
-Really long streaks of stunted server development
-People losing interest in the game as they grow older, in favor of IRL responsibilities
-The game is really old
-Players and HQ often butt heads, even players/owners butted heads of 40+ page long argument topics many years ago to no avail
-Staff being hired and promoted despite having a history of either intentionally or unintentionally favoring a particular group of players, AKA bias
-Staff members who are hired and maintain impartiality despite their group associations are often taken advantage of by their groups' enemy
-HQ's inability to efficiently please loyal, regular players, who are the backbone of the community.
-Without regulars sticking around who are familiar with RP, and who also run businesses and groups, there is hardly any incentive for new players to stay
-New players are naturally drawn to active servers. If for whatever reason regulars keep getting pissed off and leaving, our player count continues to drop.

You can see here in this very topic that there are players who are veterans and aren't even active on the server anymore, yet somehow they have that 1% care left to even come on the forum and share their dissatisfaction. I think it's important that those in positions of server influence listen to the heart of these guys' statements despite their tone and try to understand where they're actually coming from, rather than dismissing them; clearly they are here being honest.

All of my friends I'd like to play on Argonath with aren't just "bored" of Argonath, they're sick of Argonath. I myself am bored of Argonath because there's no incentive for me to play anymore. There's not even a modest bit of community to get involved in anymore. The opportunity for interesting and creative roleplay has dwindled. Back in the day, the hypothetical for that interesting and creative roleplay that I craved was suppressed by a heavy "play-to-win," "I'll use the rules to my advantage, or to your disadvantage," "I refuse to this or that with fucking Gvardias or Sopranos," "That fucking admin is corrupt" sort of atmosphere. It was really depressing when I was an admin, because I tried so hard to make everybody happy, but even if there were a handful of times that I remorsefully made a bad decision, all of my good decisions that I tiresomely, delicately made, with all of my years of experience, and with all those years of collaborating with other admins - in the end still pissed somebody off, sometimes even my own friends.

So what do we do about this? I'm at a loss for any ideas that are truly constructive. I feel a sense of defeatism whenever I have the idea of approaching this server with any hope ever again.

[TheRock]

-People losing interest in the game as they grow older, in favor of IRL responsibilities
-The game is really old

Totally true on both points, at least for me. I've spent a good time playing SA:MP the last decade, it's time to go on. Community should focus on newer games. I literally see no damn reason to play GTA SA or SA:MP at this point.

-Staff being hired and promoted despite having a history of either intentionally or unintentionally favoring a particular group of players, AKA bias

I remember a nice evening where 2 people from each official group were made mods back then, on top of star tower. Good times.

-Really long streaks of stunted server development

Very good point. But HQ is not to the one to blame on this one, WE did kick most of those people with our attitude against them.. CBFasi, XCasio, Zaila, David, Louis and many more later...
To be honest, I am actually sad to see a revival attempt whenever fresh HQ is up.. I mean, how many attempts have there been at total? It's time to let it go.
And no, I am not here to "offer" solutions or ideas about the player base, but to point the truth. How many years will we keep hiding behind our fingers? Lying to ourselves that the situation is temporary? That it is because of exams? That it is because of RS5 stat reset? We are all to blame, we were all part in this, we all did this together..

[Sawyer]

I doubt even half of the current active ones around believe that we can reach the good old times of an in and out full server. The main goal is the somewhat active when at least once or twice a week reaches a fair amount of active players which at this point should be around 30 to 40. From there, it's in our hands to keep on growing.

SAMP's overall reputation as well as activity is rather low but definitely not dead.

[Stefos]

Last warning. Do not start causing fights.
This is a CIVIL conversation.
People who fight will be punished acordingly.
Goes for everyone.

[Leon.]

Also I want to point out that our increased roleplay requirements, as opposed to being an "RP for the sake of DM" type of server, has led to many uh, undesirable players getting banned and ostracized. These individuals and groups can now be found at a server that shall not be named. You know, the server that stole basically every Argonath script? Yeah. That one. If you thought Argonath had its shitshow moments, you have no idea...

[Khm]

Also I want to point out that our increased roleplay requirements, as opposed to being an "RP for the sake of DM" type of server, has led to many uh, undesirable players getting banned and ostracized. These individuals and groups can now be found at a server that shall not be named. You know, the server that stole basically every Argonath script? Yeah. That one. If you thought Argonath had its shitshow moments, you have no idea...

This is precisely the biggest issue, we have a big part that wants the server a bit freeroam while another big part wants it to be serious roleplay. Neither want the middle solution.