The Argonath. It's past. It's Present. And it's future.

[Julio.]

On a sever I used to Co-own, when someone was banned, they could not post an unban request for two months.

Also, tempban was regularly used to ban someone for up to 2 weeks, not just 60 minutes

[TheRock]

On a sever I used to Co-own, when someone was banned, they could not post an unban request for two months.

Also, tempban was regularly used to ban someone for up to 2 weeks, not just 60 minutes

beep beep.. this is about argonath not your co-owned server's thread..

[Murt]

This is not even about the SRU, don't know why people dragged it up.

But to go on topic, Gird3r you really got some good points here. The constant moan towards freecops and new players should stop, I am tired of it. Those people who shits on them should drag out their thumb from the ass and try to use their brain they were given and help people instead of constant disrespect them.

Without the new players on the server it wouldn't be so much players on it since it's them keeping it alive. Can't denie the fact that some who joins the server hacks and things like that but in some cases have I seen true individuals join the server and most have begun to be something big. And their skills have drasticly raised in roleplay, grammar and the English language. And especially their right to respect people.

If myself think back when I joined the server I really sucked as a player, I didn't have a bad English library but my RPG skills weren't really good. That raised due that some individuals choosed to help me and improve my skills, even gave me money for my fast learning. The individuals really helped me in my beginning was Ted_Bundy, TinMan and Gvardia of it's unique members.

Special thanks to those to show me that, if there were more players like that, I know it exist many of them on the server. But the "group" on the server who just comes on to get suspected and kill cops and moan about abuse and shit on the newplayers for their low experience. Not everyone is from a English speaking country nor don't have so much knowledge about the language. But they'll learn after time.

The group who deserves credits for helping new players are the Inferno 9 and the NBA, they even invited me to the NBA after my departure from Gvardia and helped me raised my skills as a balla. I even contributed some of my knowledge from the mafia roleplay towards them.

[Jamal]

'If you don't like it, leave' - the words of quite a few when they see a topic like this.. I just want to ask them why should a person have to leave because they want to discuss or suggest a way to make the server different(not going to say 'better' because it might just be some selfish moaning really, but in most cases its a valid argument which actually has no chance due to being locked).

The biggest point I agree with is punishments (through admins and moderators). I'm not a smart guy with anything like this really, but it seems punishments are just so easy as of late, and I'm sure many can agree.

[newguy]

Explain.

Why should i explain,if the explanation is already infront of your own eyes?

[Gird3r]

I need the community to be engaged in this, I am taking the first step for now, can you?
I9 can. Can you?
Admins and moderators try to help protect? Can you?


The current plans I have been cooking on will not work unless the community if willing to work an bit in order to improve itself.

The role reversal week was according to me. An huge and awesome idea that can possible help improve relations, and make both sides realise what they are going thru.

If we all start this by helping new players atleast once an week (each and every regular helps an respective new player) things will improve A.L.O.T.

There will be less (as some call it) "intentional" abuse from "freecops".
New players would be less likely to rulebreak.
Admins and moderators could focus more on catching the real shit that's going on (Trolls/flamers/rulebreakers).
You could gain friends.

Let's say you would use 30 minutes once an week, where you take 1 or (if you can handle it) more new players, and help them get started shortly.
Refer the the New Players Manual.
Explain the rules in an easy and understandable way.
Give them the basic roleplay ala /me.
And offer help and advise them where to go for further help if you yourself don't happen to know an specefic question.
30 minutes an Week is not much of your time. If you can play for 4 hours each day. Surely, there's nothing wrong with sacrificing 30 minutes out of
28 hours of weekly gameplay in order to help new players?

Let's say there are 40 new players and 60 regulars on the server at an given time. If all those 40 new players did not get met with an "fuck you" and instead was met by an "welcome", things are guaranteed to improve alot.

I will tell you about an particular case:

I was pulled over by an cop. He did not know any proper procedures. And demanded I pay 500$ to him for absolutely no reason.
I followed him to the investigation which I demanded. Well at that place, I turned an potentional abuse into an attempt to offer help and some basic training.

It all ended with me paying him 3$, he got alot of material and links to work with. I offered help. Offer to help them if you are so damn "pissed" at this "abuse".

In the end, I refeered him to the New players manual, The ARPD website. He could not speak english which was understandable. Yet, I helped him to the best of my ability so he can be an fair cop and pull over when it's an true crime.

When you help an new player, you can help as much as you want. That is fine and good, but in the end. It's up to the new player himself to WANT to understand. And when the new player simply refuses to accept any help and go on to rulebreak. That is truly the time when admins and moderators come in.

/h How do I buy guns
/h Ammunation
/h Ok thanks.

This has been mentioned several times, Let me remind you:

How can you expect that new player to fully cope with and understand the rules at day 1? Never.

I'd like to see more of this:

/h How do I buy guns?
/h You can buy them at Ammunation, make sure you read the rules properly, this is not an Deathmatch server, so do not use your guns to mindlessly kill players.
/h Ok Thanks

Atleast explain it in an bit more detail.


Here's some short .tk links I have created that are easy to use and type when you want to tell the new player where to find additional help.
Also make sure to tell them the website of Argonath RPG (www.argonathrpg.eu)

www.argosampmanual.tk (This goes to the SA:MP New Players Manual on the Argonath wiki)
www.argoarpd.tk (This goes to the ARPD website)

For the new players who happens to read this, here's the original/official links (Use these if you want to bookmark).

http://wiki.argonathrpg.eu/index.php/Portal:SA-MP (This goes to the SA:MP New Players Manual on the Argonath wiki)
http://arpd.argonathrpg.com/ (This goes to the ARPD website)

[Leon.]

Gird3r, as much as I dislike you, disagree with many of your views, despise your incorrect usage of "an," and various other things, I'd like to congratulate you and PRAISE you for making such a decent topic. As much as I support this topic, the quote below is extremely true.

This won't get locked as it's made by Gid3r, if it was made by anyone who have never been moderator or whatsoever before will just get ignored and their topic will get locked.

It's the harsh truth.

It may not be officially recognized as such, but veteran players and influential players get some sorts of special treatment, even if unintentional. 70% of bias is unintentional to begin with, and I do not deny that I am biased 70% of the time.

[Green-Eye]

I'm thankful for all the Work that the Admins, Mods & Scripters do. They work hard, and I know things are'nt Right and I'l also glad that these Issues are being tackled. As for this up-coming Reset? It's a good thing, we all need a New Begining. That and I don't know about you, but I can't wait for the new Scripts that could be coming out, cause Argonath is the best RPG Server on SA:MP. I apreciate all the work that everyone puts into Argonath, and as for Trolls, let's BAN them since they won't GTFO. And believe me, Admins know how to back Trolls into there Corners. :P

[Que]

I9 can. Can you?

To be honest with you, Gird3r, I'm getting pretty tired of hearing this kinds of things all the time. No offense against Inferno 9 and their work, but there's more groups who's involved in teaching new players, making them better role-players. We might not be doing advertisements about it, neither being at the most central place in Los Santos, but we're surely doing as much as they do. If you ask around the server, where they got taught in the beginning of their role-play session, I can surely tell you that there will be as much players saying "by 58th Street Conecta" instead of Inferno 9. Same goes with Gvardia.

[Cutt3r]

Regarding the point about bans - which is where my namey comes in. So, you wanna know why people are allowed back in, why a permanent ban is not a permanent ban...
For starters, a permanent ban is a permanent ban, unless the guy comes back after a year or two and we feel that he is worth letting in. Why? We want people on server, even if they were not too good back in the day. We believe that they can change and a year or two would suffice for their change.
So why are some people unbanned even if it is not yet a year or so after their permanent denial? Well, being engaged with real life activity, we simply cannot keep track of all the names which are perm banned. So sometimes a manager not knowing that a guy has been perm denied or not knowing his track record of bans may unban the person. In order to avoid such cases we are trying to maintain a database of permanent denied players.
Constant rulebreakers - in the spur of the moment at times, people rulebreak. We believe that they have served their time with a month or two, yes a month or two will do for rulebreaking such as DM or such. Of course, in case of repeated rulebreaks the ban gets extended.

We have always had a policy of giving people a chance - barring repeated hackers/abusers, who are permanently denied.

And to those who said "because it is Gird3r who made the topic, it will not get locked" - people who are capable of locking topics know fully well which topic is positive and which topic has a negative tone. Use the right tone and get the right treatment.

[Gird3r]

Cutter. I can take an simple example:

Wash_Corleone (Also called back in 2007) WashSforza.

Count the bans?
I can count them on two hands. (if I include his shenanigans from mta:vc aswell)
I can not count his kicks and warns on two hands. I'd need atleast 20 hands for that.


Over the years. he has repedeatly been banned and unbanned for similar reasons.
And this is not only on SA:MP, he dragged alot of shit onto himself in mta:vc aswell.

Well, he's permantly banned now. For what I hope, forever.


This is exactly why the banning system needs an rework.
Cutter, you know aswell as I do that I am not uninformed in the banning processes in the general way.

Month? So what Wash did, only deserves an Month?

I am in favour of changing this. 3 strikes, if they player get's denied, then an strike is consumed and shall be noted down (and the player can make an new unban request later on)
If feel fit. Perm denied (consumes all 3 strikes) Then out you go without chance to return.
When you were "denied" in mta:vc, you was denied. No this temporary deny thingys.
When the third strike is consume (by denied the second one, or the player being banned an third time).
Well time to find another community.

Each chance respetents an Strike. Strikes are consumed if you get denied or caught lying.
Thereotically, you'd could only be unbanned twice. Since the third strike marks the time when you can find another community.

2 chances are according to me, enough.

If this system shall remain: Then bloody well make sure that assholes who refuse to change and follow the rules, can be perm denied without this illy dilly do temp perm things.

Trolls and other shit who show no interest at in developing this community at all, Should just be gotten rid off.

Yhe I belivie people can change to. But why waste time and discussion on an lost case? Someone, who keeps coming back and f**ks around?
And read what I said about those with unban rights really closely. I am not mad at you directly. I am mad at the current system and want it improved. So people stop with this "Press Button to continue" shit that's been going on.


Post Merge: May 15, 2011, 07:29:27 amLet me sum up the whole ban thing:

Ethier the system is improved as I suggsested it. Or we work to find an solution, to truly show that being banned is something to be taken seriosly.

In short: The mentality that some players have that Banned = Oh lookie here lol. And prevent this "You now have 10 lifes left. Continue?".

[Julio.]

beep beep.. this is about argonath not your co-owned server's thread..

beep beep, this is an opinionated topic, not a one man autocracy

[Leon.]

And to those who said "because it is Gird3r who made the topic, it will not get locked" - people who are capable of locking topics know fully well which topic is positive and which topic has a negative tone. Use the right tone and get the right treatment.

Lol.
I can make the most positive or neutral tone, and someone (not going to mention any names here... let's just say we don't have a very good relationship between the two of us) comes in and locks it, assuming it's all BS and is going to start an argument - exactly what this topic is doing.

[Gird3r]

As cutter said.

If they have an good justification to lock the topic. I will not complain.

As for the "special treament".

No, it's called being an friend with someone.
If I had only in mind to shit on all of Argonath, I'm sure even my best friend here would lock the topic and give me an warning or something more harsh.
But that's not what this topic is intended to do. Yes I am strict and harsh. I don't deny it.

Lemme show you something:



This is not going to improve relations between players at all.
New players are important to this community, how cannot you realise that?

EVen if they ask for money, offer to help in another way. Use the links I provided. Flaming them will not help at all, and only serves to destroy this community.

Here's some short .tk links I have created that are easy to use and type when you want to tell the new player where to find additional help.
Also make sure to tell them the website of Argonath RPG (www.argonathrpg.eu)

www.argosampmanual.tk (This goes to the SA:MP New Players Manual on the Argonath wiki)
www.argoarpd.tk (This goes to the ARPD website)

For the new players who happens to read this, here's the original/official links (Use these if you want to bookmark).

http://wiki.argonathrpg.eu/index.php/Portal:SA-MP (This goes to the SA:MP New Players Manual on the Argonath wiki)
http://arpd.argonathrpg.com/ (This goes to the ARPD website)