President Obama supports gay / same-sex marriage

[Leon.]

You blamed Christians for burning homosexuals. That is like blaming all the current day Germans right now for the Holocaust or blaming all Americans for sending out the Native Americans. Something that happened in the past shouldn't be pertained to current day situations. 

The Christian church during the late Roman Empire

during the late Roman Empire

[Nathan]

Explain to me how it's relevant to the current discussion.

[Leon.]

Explain to me how it's relevant to the current discussion.

You claim that I'm blaming every single Christian for the Christian Church's burning of homosexuals during that time period in a way that a simple bigot thinks every German is responsible for the tragic deaths during the Holocaust. I was simply emphasizing that it was the Christian Church of the late Roman Empire that did the burnings, and not every Christian alive today.

[Nathan]

You claim that I'm blaming every single Christian for the Christian Church's burning of homosexuals during that time period in a way that a simple bigot thinks every German is responsible for the tragic deaths during the Holocaust. I was simply emphasizing that it was the Christian Church of the late Roman Empire that did the burnings, and not every Christian alive today.

How is the corrupt Roman Church related to this discussion?

[JDC]

And I thought it would stop at the East-West discussion. As we've managed to formulate a good (compared to just about everything we had in PnR) argument in this topic, let us continue it in that way.

Segregation was commonplace for thousands of years before mid 20th century

Segregation, however, has not been as universally upheld as was the pattern of male-female relationships, the latter being present even in species other than humans.


Nathan / Luigi:

There have been claims that the Old Testament verses against same-sex relationships and homosexuality are obsolete and no longer apply after Jesus' time, and that Jesus himself has not spoken against homosexuals.

However, what do you have to say about Romans 1:26-27?

"(26) Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. (27) In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion."


As for whoever tried to use Physics in Biological arguments...

Physics is the study of matter and motion in spacetime, while Biology is the study of living orgasnisms. Get your facts straight.

[Nathan]

However, what do you have to say about Romans 1:26-27?

"(26) Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. (27) In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion."

If you read a little more above it says:

21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like a mortal human being and birds and animals and reptiles.

24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. 25 They exchanged the truth about God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator - who is forever praised. Amen.

As far as I know right now (I'm not a home and my study material is not available), this is probably referring to the tribes of Israel who basically were doing the follow: They, when being controlled by the judges, were under control of themselves and did what was right in the Lord's view. But when the judges seized to exist, they did what was right in their eyes and therefore had a loss of morals to God stepped in. I maybe wrong right now, I'll look it up when I get home in a few days.

[Pandalink]

People like you support em just because it is "modern", and authorities approve it.

Just like it is "modern" to support rights for black people and women, am I right?

You people are so easy to manipulate...

Coming from a religious person? How f**king laughable.

In nature, same sex animals do not attract each other.

Actually, they do.

Also in physics, take magnetism. Magnets of the same sex (sry if that is wrong expression, but i do not know how to say that 2 same parts of magnet repel each other) repel each other.

Are you really comparing biological sexuality to magnetism..?

Dude, physics is science. Physics is a nature science (or whatever is it called on english language), and the law of magnetism say that same poles defect each other. Same is with humans. Same sexes should defect each other. End of story. That is the law of nature.

Fair enough, but also you should remember that if you pour oil into a cup of water, the oil will stay together with the rest of the oil, and will not intermingle with the water. Therefore, homosexuality is natural, because science.

[SafetyMoose]

if your gay, move to Canada

>Problem Solved

[aleksandar_gojkovic]

Then explain Bonobo's, gay wolves and other animals with the same behaviour.
With magnetism the laws are unchangeable, you can not create a defect magnet.
Similar sexual preference that is genetically created can not be altered.

Gandalf, and all other's. I used magnetism to show you that: it is unnatural for 2 same sex'es (poles at magnetism) to combine. Those 2 in nature SHOULD NOT go togeather. So, gayness is WRONG.

If you read a little more above it says:

21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like a mortal human being and birds and animals and reptiles.

24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. 25 They exchanged the truth about God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator - who is forever praised. Amen.

As far as I know right now (I'm not a home and my study material is not available), this is probably referring to the tribes of Israel who basically were doing the follow: They, when being controlled by the judges, were under control of themselves and did what was right in the Lord's view. But when the judges seized to exist, they did what was right in their eyes and therefore had a loss of morals to God stepped in. I maybe wrong right now, I'll look it up when I get home in a few days.

Homosexuality ties to the fall of morals. Alone, of course homosexuality wasn't the key to the fall, but we all know that when the morals dropped, a society is no longer able to function.Of course no one cared, but great philosophers such as Plato were against it and knew that it was against the natural.Wrong again. Torah, which was dictated by God to Moses, which has Leviticus in it. As we all know the following were some of the verses:

Leviticus 18:22, "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination."

Leviticus 20:13, "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

Now, I do not accept the death of homosexuals nor favor what the other guy has said about concentration camps, because:

John 13:34, "A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. 35 By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another."

Since it still remains a sin, the follow actions should be taken instead:

Matthew 18:15, "If your brother sins against you, go and show him his fault, just between the two of you. If he listens to you, you have won your brother over.

Therefore, instead of shoving it down their throat saying that they will go to hell and basically shun them out of society, that wont do any good to the person. So instead, a Christian would tell that person his/her fault and that he/she should change it. Again, non in an agressive way because we all know that you can never get anyone to believe using fear.

Now i do not want to act like a 5 year old, that would be immature, but still: HE REALLY BURRIED YA!

No, seriously speaking, if you are a christian and supporting homo's, you are actually going against the god himself. (if ya still wanna show that "killing gay thing", i told ya, i'd do that to save lives of my family, i know it.)

Just like it is "modern" to support rights for black people and women, am I right?

NO Pandalink, NO!
I see NOTHING wrong with other races. I see that CHRISTIAN god did not say ANYTHING wrong about other races. I DO NOT see anything UNATURAL about other races of humans. That is just NOT WRONG. Besides all that races are nothing more than SAME humans born in diffrent places

if your gay, move to Canada

>Problem Solved

Or buy a gun in ammunation   

[Jubin]

I see the tables have turned to attacking me personally. Personally, I would like the answers of why should this nonsense be allowed. We can easily see history repeats itself. See ancient Greeks, then enter the loss of morality with acts such as men having sex with other men and the society begins to fall apart, same goes for ancient Romans. Once a country or a nation loses it's morality and a true standard that actually makes sense, it begins to crumble.

Ancient Greece - Dudes wrestling each other naked in a ring and covered with olive oil. Also there was lets say peculiar relationships between a greek soldiers and their adolescence squires. Ancient Rome started to fall apart right about the same time Christianity was accepted as the countrys religion.

Also I was not attacking you at all I was just stating that put your own theory to the test if you think homosexuality is a choice, but for some reason you won't execute the test as I am quite sure that you don't want to because you know it yourself it will give you no results whatsoever and henceforth disproving your theory.

[Dutchy]

Alek, in this current society your beliefs and statements are blasphemy, they're extreme, discriminating and conservative. A VERY small amount of Argo players and of the world population has your beliefs, there for you will not get any support or acknowledgement from almost none to none of the members here. I suggest you stop this discussion as this is never going to end with one saying to the other: I am wrong, you are right.

You have beliefs.
Other people have beliefs.
Live and let live.
Believe and let believe.

[aleksandar_gojkovic]

How are my statements blasphemy?
Post Merge: May 21, 2012, 12:51:29 pmThere is a question i should have asked you long time ago:
What the use of gays in human society? Can you name atleast 5 gays that actually contributed to human race in any kind of way? (Dont start to BOMBARD me with comments "and what did you do". My answer to them is: Hey, am too young to do anything. Well see when i get older.)

[Oliver]

How is the corrupt Roman Church related to this discussion?

The Great Schism hadn't happened back then, so it was all one single church. The orthodox are as much to blame as the catholics for ruining the glorious Roman empire.

What the use of gays in human society? Can you name atleast 5 gays that actually contributed to human race in any kind of way?

Freddie Mercury (one of the greatest singers of our time), Stephen Fry (an excellent entertainer), Alan Turing (scientist, contributed to computer science), Oscar Wilde (a great writer), J Edgar Hoover (the director of the FBI)

Can you name 5 Catholic zealots who contributed to the human race in any way?

[Dutchy]

How are my statements blasphemy?

Because hating gay people isn't considered ''normal''.

[Dolfagr]

How are my statements blasphemy?
Post Merge: May 21, 2012, 12:51:29 pmThere is a question i should have asked you long time ago:
What the use of gays in human society? Can you name atleast 5 gays that actually contributed to human race in any kind of way? (Dont start to BOMBARD me with comments "and what did you do". My answer to them is: Hey, am too young to do anything. Well see when i get older.)

Your beliefs were heard. Do not persist on them, you're not going to change anyone's mind in this forum even if you're right, you're wrong.