What to do when RHL expires

[Petarda]

Then he is a "bad criminal", because if you are suspected, it means you failed somewhere.

He failed if he died or got jailed, he can evade from the police

Then he shouldn't allow himself to get caught and be suspected.

What if he didn't want to but cops busted him?

[JackWhite]

However as he has escaped successfully, just as like if he would be dead or jailed he is no longer part of the chase. By making him part again you create a possibility for people to be wanted and killing without end.

Not to make it a cop vs criminal thread, but that is the cops problem. If suspects keep on killing cops, cops should admit the "lost the fight". When the cops give up, criminals has nothing else to do than wait for the RHL to run out. And as I guess someone will say that if that happens suspects will chase cops, thats where the admins and the cophunting/baiting rules come in.

If he is driving the car, he has made the voluntary choice to break the rules if he has already left the roleplay. The only three ways he can leave are death, jail, and the RHL timer running out. The first two obviously would require him to purposely aid his friend(s) again. The third would be something of his own situation. He could easily switch seats with his suspected friends, not to mention if he can't continue as a suspect in that roleplay, he could always act as a frightened civilian who just had someone dangerous in his vehicle. Creativity is all that is needed to overcome that situation.

He never made a voluntary choice to break rules? That is just utterly stupid. As far as I see it this rule kind of forces players to rulebreak. I have played on Argo since 2009/2010 and I've never seen someone getting punished for this kind of thing. And he cant "easily switch seats with his suspected friends", because this would make the cops catch up, will be more shooting and DM fests, and his friends will get caught.

To Gandalf, my solution is this:
We should just leave it how it's always been, that suspects who run out their RHL but remain with active suspects are liable to be resuspected for aiding. Suspects in fight situations won't even run their RHL down anyway, and suspects in a group escape that run out their RHL can either dive out of the car and get away, or stay and risk themselves further to increase the group's overall chance of success in escaping together. That adds a level of control and choice to the situation, and makes it simpler for pursuing law enforcement to understand what they must do.

This makes the most sense.


People has to look at this case from both the criminals and cop sides, which I do. Most of the people here only seems to focus on one of the sides, mostly cops.

[SugarD]

This surely doesnt make us happy.

Then suggest an idea that isn't one-sided. That is the point of this entire discussion.

Well yea, but one of the risks should not be that your driver runs out his RHL and then a completely illogical new rule makes you all die for no reason.
Well I haven't seen any from you with regards to Drawn's scenario specifically. You basically said in response to his post "Well, f**k the suspects because they're suspects".

1. This "completely illogical new rule" has been around for more than 4 years.
2. Yes. They made the choice knowing the outcome, they got caught. Simple as that.

Cops make the same choice when going after suspects. They know they can die, but they voluntarily chose to go after them anyway. Firefighters are the same thing. They can catch on fire and lose their lives. They make the choice to fight the fires anyway. Your choices hold the consequences associated with them. If you don't want the risk of dying or being jailed, don't break the law, or at minimum, don't get caught doing it.

Not to make it a cop vs criminal thread, but that is the cops problem. If suspects keep on killing cops, cops should admit the "lost the fight". When the cops give up, criminals has nothing else to do than wait for the RHL to run out. And as I guess someone will say that if that happens suspects will chase cops, thats where the admins and the cophunting/baiting rules come in.
He never made a voluntary choice to break rules? That is just utterly stupid. As far as I see it this rule kind of forces players to rulebreak. I have played on Argo since 2009/2010 and I've never seen someone getting punished for this kind of thing. And he cant "easily switch seats with his suspected friends", because this would make the cops catch up, will be more shooting and DM fests, and his friends will get caught.
 This makes the most sense.


People has to look at this case from both the criminals and cop sides, which I do. Most of the people here only seems to focus on one of the sides, mostly cops.

1. Police are obligated to fight crime when on duty. That is their job. They won't just "give up".
2. If he decides to stay and aid his friend after his timer ends, then yes, he is voluntarily breaking the rules. If he got suspected with his friend previously to being chased by police, he voluntarily took on the risks of being killed or caught.
3. That was the old system. It worked fine until people took advantage of it to cause massive, never-ending shootouts. If player attitude was different, we could easily go back to that system.

[Zaila]

How would it force them to escape?

Not forcing, encouraging - 2 completly different things.

[Drawn]

You cannot punish half of Argonath just because some people are trieng to make a non ending shootouts , And we dont want cops to give up .
We just dont want to leave our friends in the middle of the chase when fifty cops are chasing you , Imagine if you got three people in ur car , You run out of RHL , you jump and let them all die or spend it in jail , They wont love you for that , Will they ?

[Cyril]

Not forcing, encouraging - 2 completly different things.

Ok remplace forcing with encouraging and answer the 2nd part of the question
"And if you implement this, then people who are here to deathmatch around wouldn't even have to get at least one kill to get a higher RHL, since it'll be sync to others RHL."

[SugarD]

You cannot punish half of Argonath just because some people are trieng to make a non ending shootouts

Actually yes, yes we can. This is not a deathmatch server. If you want never-ending shootouts, go to Paruni.

[Pandalink]

1. This "completely illogical new rule" has been around for more than 4 years.

Well, it hasn't. Either that or they forgot to tell anyone about it, including admins.

2. Yes. They made the choice knowing the outcome, they got caught. Simple as that.

But they didn't get caught. One of them arbitrarily ran out his RHL.

2. If he decides to stay and aid his friend after his timer ends, then yes, he is voluntarily breaking the rules.

You can say what you want but that isn't the rule unless it's to be added now.

3. That was the old system. It worked fine until people took advantage of it to cause massive, never-ending shootouts. If player attitude was different, we could easily go back to that system.

Frankly, I don't even see the problem with those situations. But that aside, those situations stop suspects escaping through RHL anyway due to cop proximity, so they're not even related to this discussion as far as I'm concerned.

You cannot punish half of Argonath just because some people are trieng to make a non ending shootouts

Actually yes, yes we can. This is not a deathmatch server. If you want never-ending shootouts, go to Paruni.

Then we can punish all cops for abusing their suspect command. If you want to attack random people for money go to Paruni.

See what I did there?

[Drawn]

Did you even read my post ? I said that you cannot punish everyone because some people want a non ending shootous , i DONT want a non ending shootout , You got this wrong , My friend.

[Zaila]

"And if you implement this, then people who are here to deathmatch around wouldn't even have to get at least one kill to get a higher RHL, since it'll be sync to others RHL."

Sorry, i'm not gonna go into details why i believe it's a good solution since if (and a big IF) this would be done, it would be in RS5 and i dont want to spoil too much yet.

[SugarD]

It's never been enforced ingame from what I've seen.
But they didn't get caught. One of them arbitrarily ran out his RHL.
You can say what you want but that isn't the rule unless it's to be added now.
Frankly, I don't even see the problem with those situations. But that aside, those situations stop suspects escaping through RHL anyway due to cop proximity, so they're not even related to this discussion as far as I'm concerned.
Actually yes, yes we can. This is not a deathmatch server. If you want never-ending shootouts, go to Paruni.

Then we can punish all cops for abusing their suspect command. If you want to attack random people for money go to Paruni.

See what I did there?

1. That does not mean it hasn't existed.
2. Then he is no longer a suspect and shouldn't act like one.
3. Returning to the roleplay has always been disallowed. It is not a new rule.
4. This is not Paruni. Never-ending shootouts are by no means roleplay. We aren't trying to create an artificial warzone so people can get their CnR fix.
5. If they are falsely suspecting someone, yes, they should be punished. If the suspection is valid, your argument is not logical to the situation at all.

See what I did there?

[JackWhite]

1. Police are obligated to fight crime when on duty. That is their job. They won't just "give up".
2. If he decides to stay and aid his friend after his timer ends, then yes, he is voluntarily breaking the rules. If he got suspected with his friend previously to being chased by police, he voluntarily took on the risks of being killed or caught.
3. That was the old system. It worked fine until people took advantage of it to cause massive, never-ending shootouts. If player attitude was different, we could easily go back to that system.

1. They are forced to give up when they cant take down the criminality. Back in the old days you had skilled cop groups to take down big criminals groups.
2. No he is not, thats just a retarded rule.
3. It has always worked, and I bet it still works, its just the way cops try to win over criminals that is stupid, they are doing it in stupid ways, if they started using their brains while planning to take down criminals, it would make everything much easier And when cops start to use their common sense, which criminals learned a long time ago, the never-ending shootouts will stop.

3. Returning to the roleplay has always been disallowed. It is not a new rule.
See what I did there?

You are still the same RP person if you escape the cops, like it has ALWAYS been before is that if you DIE and return to RP you break the rule, not if you escape.

And yeah, I see what you did there

[Drawn]

Sugar , So if cops abuse /su you punish them , Cops doesnt abuse you dont .
Let's do this then : Suspects wants to make a non-ending shootout , Punish them , Others don't , Easy , Isn't it ?

[Def Perry]

Can someone make a TL;DR of this topic?

[Pandalink]

5. If they are falsely suspecting someone, yes, they should be punished. If the suspection is valid, your argument is not logical to the situation at all.

See what I did there?

I was trying to point out your not reading Drawn's post correctly, but you seem to have missed it again.
He was saying that you shouldn't punish the whole for the actions of the few.

This:

Sugar , So if cops abuse /su you punish them , Cops doesnt abuse you dont .
Let's do this then : Suspects wants to make a non-ending shootout , Punish them , Others don't , Easy , Isn't it ?