SA:MP Admin Reform August 2013.

[Nathan]

People are so sensitive.

This. A single line of text "offends" people so much.

Taco love! Free tacos for everyone!

Damn it. You had me at free.

[Leon.]

This. A single line of text "offends" people so much.

No wonder people throw around the word "trolling" so much here. It's because people make it too damn easy, so easy that you actually end up accidentally trolling them...

[Pazienza]

I'd just like to throw in my thought about the ones that got removed whatever the reason was; thanks for your time and the efforts you put into keeping the community up and strong

Cheers

[eymas]

tacos

8 tacos.

[Grizz]

taco

I want a burrito.

[TheLegitHabibi]

Can I have the list of admins who have departed from the team?

[TiMoN]

Can I have the list of admins who have departed from the team?

As far as I have seen, they were:

Doggi
[WS]Paco
Gregersen
TheRock
Rydell_Corleone
Roman_Collin(?)
SeanC(Can't remember current name, he's probably on 58th)
[WS]Caltson

Sorry if I missed any!

Farewell to the dismissed Admins, you will be missed.

[clancker]

Sorry for putting my nose where is not supposed to be but guys comon Caltson and SeanC were one of the best admins at all let's say and they get removed doggie was good admins also every body have's his up and downs and can't be inactive i mean comon Kojak were inactive for like months before like 3-5 or maybe more but he didn't get removed at all.

Nothing much just speaking my mind i am sorry if somebody takes this as arguing or insult

[Cyril]

You can't compare a CL with an admin... They don't have the same obligations.

[eymas]

Roman_Collin(?)
SeanC(Can't remember current name, he's probably on 58th)

Roman was dismissed long ago, he was a moderator as well.
SeanC is known as Frankie_Mendoza.

[Ellz121]

So in more then two years, that I was an admin, I wasn't?
I hardly received a complain, yet it seems that NOTIFIED inactivity is such a big problem.. why not removed the inactive manages and inactive community leaders also?
They're inactive for up to a year.. even more..
If you only fire/kick the admins and moderators, I have serious doubt about this system, and the HQ..

Can you read my mind?  100% correct

[TheLegitHabibi]

You see, Admins and moderators can be seen as the "work force".
The basic commodity that functions on the field. This field staff needs to be active and good in what they do.
Managers or higher, are seen to be the "leaders". They are much much more experienced, have vast knowledge and do a lot more than being in game and doing field work. Managing problems, unban requests, cash transfers. Trust me, they have a lot to do. Even the courts alone give them a hard time. They're seen to be the very trusted members of the community who have achieved the rank. And the vast amount of forum work they have enables them to work without even going in game.

Look at Kojak. And before I say this, trust me, I'm not an asslicker. But Kojak after his returned has done a lot of things to make this community better. I see him everyday dedicating time to unban requests. And he's so reasonable! There were quite a number of 'harsh' bans. Bans for punishments that perhaps didn't needed a ban. And he's started changing that. From what I see and think, he's making sure that the admins function absolutely perfectly. Removing confusions, making the ban hammer the last resort for serious offences. And making unbans a much better procedure. Like he denies unbans for long periods for those who deserve it, and unbans people who have served their time.
Previously and to some extent now too, people think that bans are no big deal. Get banned, get unbanned. Get banned again. And with the direction Kojak is headed this is pretty much changing to the reality that a ban is something you never want.

There are countless other people who have served the community as managers and higher ranks, and I think they deserve their position and not removed for inactivity.

Its kind of like any group. The leaders are there so that the group flourishes. Without the leaders the group dies out from inactivity. The leaders need people to lead and they are the "field staff". And wherever you go, life's tough for the field staff.

My personal opinion was that the inactive admins should be removed. The reason was that they occupy unnecessary slots. I mean, another person could be hired instead of the inactive ones and make the team more effective. Yes the inactive one is trusted and if he's back, and there's a slot empty he would be favoured over other applicants. Its not a big deal really. And if you are removed for some other issue, like perhaps incorrect judgements, then maybe you're not suited for the job.

I think its a good decision. Any admin removed knows the reason why he's removed. If you really like to be an admin again then perhaps join the rest of us, who've applied and waited months on end and try endlessly to get our voices heard and be delivered with the shiny rank and a new responsibility.

Prolong inactive admins or moderators not only make the whole team ineffective, but also strip away the chances from the deserving and active members.

I personally know some people who if given the chance, imo, would prove to be extremely excellent admins but don't get the chance to do so. And maybe occupied slots is a reason.

[Kojak]

The question about why it is that inactive admins are removed, when inactive managers or community leaders retain their positions, is one that is always asked whenever admins are removed for inactivity.

The answer to that is simple; admins are the most important members of staff Argonath has, without them the server will descend into chaos and fall apart. I can go inactive for a month and return to find the server exactly as I left it, there might be some changes needed but the very important things will be fine; the players will be playing and the admins will be making sure they are able to do so in peace. If the admins go away for a month, the server is in trouble.

For that reason, we absolutely have to know who is active and who is not. Of those who are active we have to know they are reaching a minimum level of activity so across the board we can tell how well staffed the server is. When you look at a list of admins all you see is a list of names, you might see forty of them and think well that's enough surely, but if half of them are inactive, or barely active, we have a skewed figure which means we have no idea if we need to recruit or not. By completing this reform we now know we don't have enough active staff and we will need to begin recruitment.

For that reason, when it comes to the issue of activity, we ask our admins for two simple things; firstly they maintain a consistent seven hour per week minimum activity, and secondly they tell us if they're going to be inactive for any reason. Providing an admin has done one of those things, they will not be removed unless they have been inactive for months.

It is true that when you achieve a certain position within Argonath you earn tenure, and the obligations we have are not the same as that of admins. But that is because we as members of HQ are not as urgently needed as admins are, our daily presence is not always required, and the server will not fall apart if we're absent for a few days or weeks. Our admins are held to a very high standard, and it is a standard that all of them agreed to before taking the job, there is not one admin who was removed for inactivity who did not know he had to be active or how active he had to be.

Finally so it is clear, the door is not completely closed to those admins who have been removed. It is possible they might gain their positions back as long as they are seen to have addressed the reasons for their removal. There are in fact several admins who I would really love to have back in the team and if they can sort out their activity issues they will be welcome back.

If you think this approach is unreasonable, then so be it, there is nothing more to be said.

[clancker]

Thanks for answering my questions Kojak i have my mind clear now

[Caltson]

People,

It is clear that being removed for inactivity or being 'fired' for being a bad administrator are two opposite things.
None of the administrators were 'fired' because they were bad, yet were dismissed due to their inactivity.

As with anything, the community cannot run active if the administration is inactive. I currently have other duties to fullfill than Argonath and even though I will miss doing my job for the community at the time when I was active, I must see what's best for the community and in that perspective I fully understand the reason why I was removed. I can't say the same for my collegues as I don't know their reasons for being dismissed, yet I do know all of them did their best for the community and will do so even when being dismissed.

This is not the end of the line for any of us, we were not killed, jailed or raped by them freecops, we can all carry on and eventually we'll be active enough once again to be part of the administration again. Who knows what time'll bring us. Currently my focus however goes to my personal work affairs.

I do wish the best of luck to the new wave of active people, I'm quite sure the show can carry on for much more years with them.


Sincerely,

Caltson