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Let's get real - part 2 - RS5 or RS4?

Frank_Hawk · 102665

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Offline Chuck_Norris

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Reply #210 on: January 26, 2014, 09:32:36 pm
Hi, Me again !

Want to hear my opinion? I logged off after trying to go on copduty and I received a tutorial.... and i thought Argonath was different.



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Offline JDC

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Reply #211 on: January 26, 2014, 09:33:58 pm
We are. Posted bug reports, helped newcomers,  RPed when I could, had fun. Oh wait, that doesn't count.

It most definitely would if your group did not bail out of the server, with you remaining as the most frequently-seen Gvardia online here instead of being surrounded by your friends. You yourself are not the problem.

The most important part is interacting with others and meeting people from around the world.

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Offline Kaze

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Reply #212 on: January 26, 2014, 09:37:04 pm
Unfortunately, what is dead official is the numbers you can see in the SA:MP Client showing the current number of players.
When push comes to shove, those are the official numbers you want to be looking at.

Amen.



Offline Bundy

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Reply #213 on: January 26, 2014, 10:32:53 pm
It most definitely would if your group did not bail out of the server, with you remaining as the most frequently-seen Gvardia online here instead of being surrounded by your friends. You yourself are not the problem.
You seem to love the word 'Gvardia'.
What you tend to forget is that it's not only Gvardia who ''bailed out'', it's 100+ of the former regular players, including lots of other families.

By the way, I'm wondering what the difference is between an official and unofficial poll... There are more RS5 voters in an official one?

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Offline Leon.

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Reply #214 on: January 27, 2014, 12:47:29 am
Lol @ those who believe we, Gvardia, "bailed out" with the rest of the crowd without any particular reason and without hesitation. Let me clarify a few things.

1. Gvardia was founded during the peak of other groups that sought to eradicate us the moment they recognized us as a potential threat, such as the Straccis. If we were ones to simply "bail out" so easily when faced with change or challenges, we would have done so in a matter of months from our creation.

2. The decision to move to MTA was made with quite a lot of discussion and hesitation, and was made before the transition from RS5 Beta to the full game mode. The plan was to rejoin after the release of the full mode, however due to the circumstances surrounding RS5, the decision has been put on hold while we wait for the situation on the server to unfold.

3. Communication between us and the developers has been terrible. Someone says one thing, someone else says the opposite. Occasionally, one will say something and go on to contradict themselves later. We are not the only group that has experienced this, and is an entirely other topic in itself.

Thank you.

p.s. JDC be easy with those condescending and affrontive comments... they don't strengthen your points and just make you look like a mean person



Offline Shejken

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Reply #215 on: January 27, 2014, 01:05:46 am
I think RS5 was released too early, however the future seems bright.



Offline Teddy

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Reply #216 on: January 27, 2014, 01:10:23 am
I think RS5 was released too early, however the future seems bright.

Indeed true; however the developer's hand was forced by the unfortunate nature of technology.



Offline Gird3r

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Reply #217 on: January 27, 2014, 02:33:01 am
Scripts was, and never will be. The main reason why the SA:MP Argonath community imploded upon itself.
RS5 was just the last straw, but this has been a long time coming.

And it's been coming ever since the server opened in the first place.
Really, between lax administration and a "happy go lucky" attitude. Combined with a huge lack of a plan to account for far more players than
the community could handle in a cultural way (that is, lack of role models, lack of enforcement of the rules, not to mention the "continue" button mentality for banned players).

Recount every major shitstorm that has hit this community. From corrupted admins, to controversial statements.
Along with a complete disregard of the Argonath Vision. And there was a recipe for disaster.

The only question of when it would happen. And all it took was a spark. RS5 was that spark.
But let's get real. We asked several times of when RS5 would come. Adding pressure. Pressure means mistakes happens.
I agree with other people that RS5 was released far to early. But we ultimately asked for it.

No, take a break a second. I'm not wholeheartedly defending the team. I have plenty of reasons to be disappointed.
It's just not so much about the script. It's about the mentality.

The HQ has for far to long, been content with taking things less seriously than it should have.
Problems were never nipped in the bud when they should have. And for most, far to late when the damage had already been done.

People learn what they see others doing. If you portray a community where it's okay to be a selfish dick, where it's okay
to get banned several times and have nothing serious done about it. And where it's okay to backstab eachother and sow
conspiracies in a quest for power and status. Then that is what people are gonna do.

And that problem will feed itself. Over and over again until what remains is a complete disregard for the rules of the server, lack of respect.
And a lack of trust with each other.

This should have been dealt with years ago. Specifically back when the server started.
As people have mentioned to me before. There's a huge difference between 32 players, playing at the same time. And 100's.
It was a given really that a different culture would arise from this.
With so many people bringing ideas, opinions (and with it. Attitudes that crashed head first with the original culture).
Things were bound to end up in a heap.

This  "mixed" culture was never really kept an eye on. The Argonath Vision appeared as a response, and then nothing was done about it. Resulting in two entirely different opinions/cultures head butting each other until today.


Now, we see the aftermath of unchecked community chaos.
The question is can something new be built from this? With a clearer plan, a better mentality and a stronger vision?

It would be good to remember that in the end, the scripts should be seen as a enchantment, a tool to improve the roleplay.
Not as a excuse to get lazy. RP are what this entire community is about in the end.

Heck, if players where 100% honest with each other. You would not even need the scripts at all. Just a paper to keep track of the money on hand. And to write down transactions in. And a dice for gambling or to make things random if you like that kind of thing.

And one heck of a creative mind to abuse the engine to it's fullest to create RP's without custom animations and all that jazz.

But eye candy is cool. And why not abuse the technology to create something cool. But could we do it for the right reasons and not because of "MAH ASSETS" or "MAH STATUS?!".

As for the problems that needed fixing, could never be fixed without the leaders permission, or only partially.
Over-reliance on Aragorn and Gandalf that is.

I'm going to repeat a line that I wrote, from an by now, half year old unfinished document (which will never be finished by the way. Kudos for that btw, and you know who you are) I was working on together with two other people here, in a effort to outline what exactly needs fixing, with suggestions on how it could be done. In the end a effort to try to get things moving again.

"You can't have a community run itself if they themselves are not allowed to fix the broken things. It’s simply impossible to do this".

Sorry, but the dictatorship model does not, and will not suffice anymore.
And yes, I'm aware that there is currently a bit more democratic plan being worked on to get the community involved a bit better.
But that too should have happened much much earlier.

As for why? Activity of course. Gandalf can't really be here all the time. And he can't deal with everything by himself.
And he cannot also be there to approve every little single thing that needs to be fixed.
Even less so with Aragorn never being around.

It worked in the past because there was so much more time to do so.
And because two guys who perfectly complemented each others strengths and covered each others weaknesses made it like dream.
Truly a ying and yang. Not so much anymore with one of them having a family that needs the priority way more.
Way way more.

To end my entirely pointless post, what matters in the end is the RP and the willingness to stick together as a community.
Me rambling on, or a vote. Will not change this in one bit. What we really should be doing is taking care of the community first, outlining
a good strategy to deal with various problems. Be they taking a closer look at the vision. Dealing with rulebreakers better and stomping that foot down. Outlining a strategy to better welcome new players.
Or coming up with ways to entice co-operation in such a way that people can contribute better, and  :eek: maybe in a fun way.
I mean, we have quite alot of brains here. If people put those brains together towards one goal. Surely some decent ideas could pop up on how to do this?

I've tried, many others have tried over the years. It does not hurt to speak ones mind.
But there needs to be action to complement said statements. Actions that clearly speaks of co-operation and not utter circlejerk and bullshit.












Life has been a fucking hell recently, including accepting what has happened to me in the past. Dunno if life will ever get better but at the least I'm still hanging on. Lol.


Offline Pingster

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Reply #218 on: January 27, 2014, 02:39:32 am


We need to put aside the egos of both the leadership/management/players too because ultimately we have one objective, which is to ensure the prosperity of our community.


Offline Leon.

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Reply #219 on: January 27, 2014, 06:01:29 am



Offline IMVINCIBILUL

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Reply #220 on: January 27, 2014, 08:34:15 am
123 members voted - that's the regular number of players which used to be on Argonath.

And just don't come and tell me that's an unofficial poll,because for many of us is official.



Offline Cofiliano

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Reply #221 on: January 27, 2014, 08:51:20 am
Who claims to be more of a doer than a talker, but actually bailed on SA:MP and is nothing more than a part of the past now, just like you complaining over lost assets.
With you as a constant talker and essay writer that no one actually takes into consideration, its not so hard to be a doer.
I didnt 'bailed out' (and like Leon wrote you can stop talking about Gvardia cause of all those facts ), the entire community collapsed and left, and LOL on your effort to show how Gvardia is guilty that you got 2 players online at the moment :lol:

Until you learn to accept your own mistakes and your responsibility for them, you cant deal with it, and you cant progress.
But some peoples ego are bigger then Argonath.

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Offline Alexander_Rijav

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Reply #222 on: January 27, 2014, 09:13:25 am
123 members voted - that's the regular number of players which used to be on Argonath.

And just don't come and tell me that's an unofficial poll,because for many of us is official.
Not all of them voted for time machine...(returning to RS4 :rolleyes:)



Offline JDC

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Reply #223 on: January 27, 2014, 02:23:18 pm
With you as a constant talker and essay writer that no one actually takes into consideration, its not so hard to be a doer.

I didnt 'bailed out' (and like Leon wrote you can stop talking about Gvardia cause of all those facts ), the entire community collapsed and left, and LOL on your effort to show how Gvardia is guilty that you got 2 players online at the moment

So Sforza, Ancelotti, and Svensson are not counted as part of the community now? The difference between they and you (as well as the other factions who are contributing little more to RS5's progress than complaints) is that they are ingame, circulating with the community, interacting, and even helping junior players.

Not so hard to be a doer? Funny how you accuse me of being nothing but a constant talker, because the only thing you are doing right now aside from complaining about the system is sitting back and waiting for things to unfold. That's what you are doing.

You can say all you want that your group (as well as any others with the same plan) intends to come back. But until then, all that your absence (which was timed along with when the storm hit) is doing is showing that you bailed, by having jumped ship when things got rough. Things would not have been that way if you chose to return instead of waiting, but as long as your group's presence amounts to little more than Stivi alone (whose efforts I commend, by the way) then that is what the facts will show.

If you really did not bail out, then prove me wrong by going ingame and pitching in with everyone who chose to remain. Otherwise, all you will be doing there is not being there.

Anyone who feels bad about the state the server is in would do best to go in and play instead of talking about it.
As long as all people do is talk here, nothing is going to change.

The most important part is interacting with others and meeting people from around the world.

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Offline eymas

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Reply #224 on: January 27, 2014, 02:37:46 pm
It's sad to see that we barely have any groups left.

So far the only group I see actively playing and contributing is Ancelotti...

Gvardia left for MTA
Luciano disappeared
Sforza met the same fate as Gvardia; Started playing more on MTA
Stracci is in an unknown state
Corleone likewise.
And I don't know about all the others.



 


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