Enough is enough, the rules apply for all

[Stivi]

AFKfest. No one will be given money for sitting around in-game on duty.
You want money? Then work for it.

Isn't there anti-AFK support ? I mean, you get that clock thingy when you're AFK, if you ahve that, activity doesn't raise.

[Devin]

Isn't there anti-AFK support ? I mean, you get that clock thingy when you're AFK, if you ahve that, activity doesn't raise.

And then we have people sitting around without pausing, no salary for sitting around.
Police are paid for the work they do, not how long they sit around on duty.

[Manas]

Da fuk, i just logged into the server and a cop comes and /su me for suspicious gang activity and starts shooting.

Please any admin hop in. He is abusing many players
ID - Jackling jobalinghar.
A UC admin would be appreciated.

[Orel]

And then we have people sitting around without pausing, no salary for sitting around.
Police are paid for the work they do, not how long they sit around on duty.

There will always be advantages and disadvantages but there are more positive things in this idea then negative ones.
As for now we have most of the time 40 players with 25 cops, which leaves us with 10 firemen and 2 civilian/suspect and 3 afks and it's very boring, with this idea I am sure there will be less cops if you put a fair paycheck. also there will be less abuse and more RP as people won't be looking only for killing the suspects.

[Cyril]

We don't want to pay people for doing nothing.

[JDC]

As topic says, enough is enough.
Newbies from other servers must not be able to join SAPD as soon as they arrive without passports and with a test which a class 1 child can succeed in.

5 years of admin experience calls bullshit on your claims against new players. As Emmet said, our worst headaches come from "veterans", not newbies.

A new player who abuses does not know about the rules in most cases, or how things work. They are still easy to correct, most of them will react nicely if you show them that you will treat them like people, and those who refuse to learn will not last long on the server before an admin gets in their way.

A "veteran" who abuses, on the other hand, already knows how things work, yet still chooses to treat other players like shit. They cannot claim ignorance of our rules, therefore their punishment will be greater. As they know more, more will also be expected from them. Troublesome players from this category are the real problem.

Do not ever try and pin the blame for the problem underlying this topic on new players, because anyone with at least half a brain who has stuck around will know that they are not to blame. If we treated new players with the same elitist and closed-minded view as yours, then most of you will not be here today.

There will always be advantages and disadvantages but there are more positive things in this idea then negative ones.
As for now we have most of the time 40 players with 25 cops, which leaves us with 10 firemen and 2 civilian/suspect and 3 afks and it's very boring, with this idea I am sure there will be less cops if you put a fair paycheck. also there will be less abuse and more RP as people won't be looking only for killing the suspects.

The problem with your approach, like that of many others here, is that it is mediocre. You attack what "has" instead of bringing up "what does not have". Why not give all jobs the opportunity to be as financially sustainable as cop and fireman instead?

Players flock to Cop and Fireman duty because they know they can be rewarded adequately. Instead of trying to nerf those jobs because they actually provide something, focus on enhancing the other jobs that "lack", so that the average overall quality of jobs goes higher, rather than lower.

If you still can't understand that, then here's an (MS Paint) graph example.

[Cofiliano]

In real life people don't go around armed, shooting and aiming at people nor they drive like they are in a video game ignoring all trafic laws.

Actually they do.

 IRL when a cop ask someone to do something, the person either comply or he is arrested by force. IRL, suspect also don't go around saying they have been abused or saying they haven't done anything wrong. They are taken to the PD and cops will investigate there.

Ever heard of 'ACAB'? Pls people moan about police everyday.

And cops doesn't investigate anything, the Justices Department does, in most countries in the world.
[n]

And I would really like you to answer on my question:

And why does a innocent person, victim of an abuse, who didn't break any law or rule, except being abused by some rule breaker has to get jailed?

How about we jail the abusive cop, and then when he does get jailed, the criminal score he raised by abusing /sus gets erased.

@Rusty, what I wrote in my suggest is to raise the limit for cop ban, I know atm  1 month is probably not scripted.

[Solis]

You can't expect the 1160 members of SAPD group to perfectly cooperate 24/7. It's completly unrealistic.

The police departments of major cities across the first world, air traffic control, and even law enforcement agencies on other RP servers have been doing this just fine for years. So I wouldn't say it's unrealistic.

In real life people don't go around armed, shooting and aiming at people nor they drive like they are in a video game ignoring all trafic laws.

They do, or at least in countries like Mexico, that's comparable to Argonath not only in how unorganized and broken everything is, but in the firepower that criminals have. Violation of traffic laws also happens all the time.

IRL when a cop ask someone to do something, the person either comply or he is arrested by force.

People actually aren't lawfully obliged to do a lot of things that officers would ask, like answering questions, taking sobriety tests, pat-downs, vehicle searches, stopping recording them, letting them into their house without a warrant, etc. At least that's how it works in the United States.

IRL, suspect also don't go around saying they have been abused or saying they haven't done anything wrong. They are taken to the PD and cops will investigate there.

It's done quite a lot in fact, there are multiple YouTube videos about it. Such matters mostly happen inside courts, not police departments.

And cops doesn't investigate anything, the Justices Department does, in most countries in the world.

I guess you're referring to the judicial branch. The justice department enforces laws and prosecutes criminals.

[Orel]

5 years of admin experience calls bullshit on your claims against new players. As Emmet said, our worst headaches come from "veterans", not newbies.

A new player who abuses does not know about the rules in most cases, or how things work. They are still easy to correct, most of them will react nicely if you show them that you will treat them like people, and those who refuse to learn will not last long on the server before an admin gets in their way.

A "veteran" who abuses, on the other hand, already knows how things work, yet still chooses to treat other players like shit. They cannot claim ignorance of our rules, therefore their punishment will be greater. As they know more, more will also be expected from them. Troublesome players from this category are the real problem.

Do not ever try and pin the blame for the problem underlying this topic on new players, because anyone with at least half a brain who has stuck around will know that they are not to blame. If we treated new players with the same elitist and closed-minded view as yours, then most of you will not be here today.


The problem with your approach, like that of many others here, is that it is mediocre. You attack what "has" instead of bringing up "what does not have". Why not give all jobs the opportunity to be as financially sustainable as cop and fireman instead?

Players flock to Cop and Fireman duty because they know they can be rewarded adequately. Instead of trying to nerf those jobs because they actually provide something, focus on enhancing the other jobs that "lack", so that the average overall quality of jobs goes higher, rather than lower.

If you still can't understand that, then here's an (MS Paint) graph example.

People don't go on the rest of the duties beacuse they are boring. why would someone want to be a medic when there is a store where you can refill HP? why would anyone want to be a driver when people don't want to spend thier money so they prefer running to a state car?
firemen and cop duties are the ones with most action and most $$, thats why people choose to go on these duties.
What I suggested was actually going to lower the cops on the server, not make more people go on cop duty.

[JDC]

People don't go on the rest of the duties beacuse they are boring. why would someone want to be a medic when there is a store where you can refill HP? why would anyone want to be a driver when people don't want to spend thier money so they prefer running to a state car?
firemen and cop duties are the ones with most action and most $$, thats why people choose to go on these duties.
What I suggested was actually going to lower the cops on the server, not make more people go on cop duty.

That's exactly the whole point of finding ways to make the other duties better.

Once that is done, not only will all duties give substantial opportunities for earning, but you'll also have the side benefit of solving the problem of too many players gravitating towards cop / fireman duty. You won't have a huge disproportion because players will already be interested in the other duties too.

In the end, that gives you more benefit than just making sure that not too many players go on duty as cop.

[Miller786]

5 years of admin experience calls bullshit on your claims against new players. As Emmet said, our worst headaches come from "veterans", not newbies.

A new player who abuses does not know about the rules in most cases, or how things work. They are still easy to correct, most of them will react nicely if you show them that you will treat them like people, and those who refuse to learn will not last long on the server before an admin gets in their way.

A "veteran" who abuses, on the other hand, already knows how things work, yet still chooses to treat other players like shit. They cannot claim ignorance of our rules, therefore their punishment will be greater. As they know more, more will also be expected from them. Troublesome players from this category are the real problem.

Do not ever try and pin the blame for the problem underlying this topic on new players, because anyone with at least half a brain who has stuck around will know that they are not to blame. If we treated new players with the same elitist and closed-minded view as yours, then most of you will not be here today.


The problem with your approach, like that of many others here, is that it is mediocre. You attack what "has" instead of bringing up "what does not have". Why not give all jobs the opportunity to be as financially sustainable as cop and fireman instead?

Players flock to Cop and Fireman duty because they know they can be rewarded adequately. Instead of trying to nerf those jobs because they actually provide something, focus on enhancing the other jobs that "lack", so that the average overall quality of jobs goes higher, rather than lower.

If you still can't understand that, then here's an (MS Paint) graph example.

Really? You gotta be kidding me, where in hell do you find all the time to write those books plus graphics? Tell me your secret JDC, i really wanna know.

@Rusty, what I wrote in my suggest is to raise the limit for cop ban, I know atm  1 month is probably not scripted.

No god, please no, if that happens ill end up playing once 2 months

[Manas]

http://i61.tinypic.com/153351c.jpg[/img]

False Graphs.

Cop duty rewards are much less compared to fireman rewards
And "Others" Like Drugs must be raised.

[JDC]

False Graphs.

Cop duty rewards are much less compared to fireman rewards
And "Others" Like Drugs must be raised.

It was an example, not meant to be numerically accurate in terms of raw money earned. I put more at "Cop" since many more players tend to gravitate towards Cop duty (over Fireman duty, the situation reversed from what it was at the start of RS5) than anything else.

Really? You gotta be kidding me, where in hell do you find all the time to write those books plus graphics? Tell me your secret JDC, i really wanna know.

That infographic was something I hastily put together in MS Paint, rather than real graph-making software like Photoshop or Excel. As I mentioned before, Argonath is something I attend to in my spare time (after work, university, and social obligations). It just so happens I can squeeze a lot into a short amount of time.

[KelviNC]

I don't know that what talk is going on but I'd like to say that the COP script really needs to be changed.

My suggestion is that, first of all the newcommers (newbie) should not be able to join the police duty. Somewhat like, for example; There's is a new player ingame, he needs to be apart SAPD. He went into the PD, and gets on the duty mark. A message appears that, "You need to play atleat 1/2 Weeks to join police duty.". This would really help to decrease the DM'ing occured by the newcommer(s).

However, I'll come to the COPBAN system. If a cop is caught DM'ing around, misusing his firearms and he's get a copban for 1DAY or 2DAYs or maybe 3DAYs. 1-3 days of copban changes nothing. For example;

*A cop DM'es a player(s).
*The player(s) reported him to the admins.
*Got copbanned to 1/2/3 day(s).
*1/2/3 day(s) went away, he's now able to join the duty again.
*Started to DM the players again.

So, nothing is changing with this short time period of copban.

[AK47]

My suggestion is that, first of all the newcommers (newbie) should not be able to join the police duty. Somewhat like, for example; There's is a new player ingame, he needs to be apart SAPD. He went into the PD, and gets on the duty mark. A message appears that, "You need to play atleat 1/2 Weeks to join police duty.". This would really help to decrease the DM'ing occured by the newcommer(s).

Bullshit.

The biggest ammount of people abusing stuffs like copduty is the veterans. If you see a new guys abusing? Help him instead of moaning on him.

When are you all going to learn this?^

A new player breaks a rule because he doesn't know what he's doing wrong. A veteran breaks a rule (copduty etc) just to be a fucking moron.
Stop blaming everything on the new players.