Transparency & Double Standards 2: Electric Boogaloo

[Kessu]

Also Kessu ... I was just told from an administrator that the situation really matters ... Well I do not see anythign being told about situation in your three rules...

It matters in a rule-specific case, but then again if you follow all three thumb rules I just listed you shouldn't be breaking the rules anyway.

[Hamza_Khan]

Well let me tell you that something that happened to us today Well I gathered  my family members for kidnapping alphonse and things were going well but FBI interfere there and rescued him. All cool then OK? but suddenly he started to provoking us on /p like
''you sucks'',''failed people''. I reported him but no one taken action against him I don't know  about the /pm function. then few moments after We tried to kidnap alfonze and succeed in it and taken him to our HQ where we RP'ed with him.PS:  when we entered SF boundaries  I don't from where FBI and PD started to following us whoever tell them don't know,maybe angels tell them but somehow we managed to drags him inside the building.ALL things was going well So decided to finish him after doing so called Roleplay.
and then one of my friend takes out his deagle and shoots in his mouth Ok (IN HIS MOUTH) and after getting shot in his mouth he typed /me runs towards the window and jumps and by pressing ''H'' he gets out I mean what is it? and after this that Alphonse start to provoke us again the same things he done before I reported him but again no one takes action against him (Note: He was the same admin who received a last report against him by me) I mean if some admins wants to play a certain group or players then they can tell us directly instead of doing this by banning our friends and forgiving them all the time I really request to High ranks admins to get involve in this and please thing something about it.

[Kostas]

Hamza you shouldn't have brought this up...

Jovanca, admins who are present to the situation shouldn't pickup the report about the situation(you understood the other way arround completly)

Rusty when I am present to a situation, it is more easy for me to get biased, and I've also seen 100% of the one side, possible not carring about the other side...
Also about what you said about the rules, take the time and read what I posted. People who do not want to read will have the short list, people who do, like me for examble, will read the huge list. Simple as that! Also about the ARPD Divisions, guidelines, rules, they are just different ways to calling a basic thing. No I will not ask from the SAPD Command to know when I am being abused. I have every right to know when I am being abused... THose DOs and DON'Ts have to become active, coz I need to atleast know the DON'Ts. Coz if I am alone with one of their members, and I don't know the DON'Ts then he will simply be abled to do anything to me... As I won't know when he's crossed the line ... DO prove me wrong here please!

[jovanca]

Hamza you shouldn't have brought this up...

Jovanca, admins who are present to the situation shouldn't pickup the report about the situation(you understood the other way arround completly)

Rusty when I am present to a situation, it is more easy for me to get biased, and I've also seen 100% of the one side, possible not carring about the other side...
Also about what you said about the rules, take the time and read what I posted. People who do not want to read will have the short list, people who do, like me for examble, will read the huge list. Simple as that! Also about the ARPD Divisions, guidelines, rules, they are just different ways to calling a basic thing. No I will not ask from the SAPD Command to know when I am being abused. I have every right to know when I am being abused... THose DOs and DON'Ts have to become active, coz I need to atleast know the DON'Ts. Coz if I am alone with one of their members, and I don't know the DON'Ts then he will simply be abled to do anything to me... As I won't know when he's crossed the line ... DO prove me wrong here please!

oh soz then, i kinda jsut woke up at the time i was reading that post xd maybe they shouldnt be the ones who issue the punishment (the admins who were part of the scene) but they should be objective when telling another admin what happened there.

[Mikro]

*text*

It was not like you then came outside and started so called O O C talking towards Alfonze while there were literally 14 cops around. Then all of a sudden "/me takes out his deagle and shoots Alfonze in the head". This makes your claim that Alfonze did not RP good enough quite ironic. What I am trying to say, this came from 2 sides.

*text*

Fine that you all try to kidnap people from the enemies side. But it is happening constantly and it seems that for you all the only satisfying result is that the hostage dies. If you ask me, that can be barely considered RP. I am fully capable of handling a situation where I was involved. And the situation you are referring to, did not even involve me personally as the problem was between the kidnappers and the hostage.

In general what I see in all these situations, people tend to find the edge between rulebreaking and allowed stuff. And then some tend to cross this edge now and then, because it is so easy. Why is it needed to find this edge and always go around testing this edge? It is much more enjoyable to keep a clear distance from this edge and you will find yourself in a much better position. Not only for admin, but also for yourself and other players.

[CharlieKasper]

Also about punishments, organised or not. First of all, I do not care of having a chat with 10x more red posts on it, /p is a spam already, let's add a little more, who cares? Also I do not mind if the list of "standars" would become huge, just like you said(who ever did) it will actually make your work easier, you are indeed not robots, but you, just like us, should follow a set of rules on how to operate...

And seems you're one of those guys who would much rather see a guy punished publicly. Why are people so obsessed with it? Following a set of guidelines on when to punish a player is never going to help. We know when a punishment would be appropriate and when talking would be appropriate to bring the best out of the situation. Doing that will just cause endless moan. It would make our work easier and would be a pain the butt for the players. You sure you would want that?

The last few lines is just pulling words out of thin air. I have no interest in replying to those lines

[Hamza_Khan]

It was not like you then came outside and started so called O O C talking towards Alfonze while there were literally 14 cops around. Then all of a sudden "/me takes out his deagle and shoots Alfonze in the head". This makes your claim that Alfonze did not RP good enough quite ironic. What I am trying to say, this came from 2 sides.

That was the result of this continuously fuss and because of this I was really pissed of by that situation ! I mean you are doing RP from ass and then other one get away by just pressing simple H and what about that provocation part?

[Kostas]

And seems you're one of those guys who would much rather see a guy punished publicly. Why are people so obsessed with it? Following a set of guidelines on when to punish a player is never going to help. We know when a punishment would be appropriate and when talking would be appropriate to bring the best out of the situation. Doing that will just cause endless moan. It would make our work easier and would be a pain the butt for the players. You sure you would want that?

The last few lines is just pulling words out of thin air. I have no interest in replying to those lines

Ofcourse you wouldn't coz this is a truth that is against you, but I do not want to give much importance to that either. Also no I wouldn't rather see a guy punished publicly but I do like known if my report was properly handled, be it by just letting the reporter know what happent? Yet again my post had nothing to do about that, It was about being fair to the other guy, such standards could make it more fair.

Mikro you do have a point there. BUT "for you all", no one here is being completly general who gave you the right to? No I would personally rather have a different outcome out of a kidnap, and the only times i want the police force to get involved is when I kidnap an officer, asking money for it even though I never get them. THe only time I would just kill the guy that I've kidnapped would be the time that I was "forced" to by the ones against me, if the police storms, my first move would indeed be to kill that guy.
Also pulling a gun when not frisked/cuffed is poor RP? Did you guys take Alfonze to the hospital afterwards? Oh wait you didn't even though just like htey said he was shot in the mouth(which is most times a lethal shot).
Last, I was barelly part of what was going on, I had just logged and had managed to get there to RP with the officers outside... who didn't know any words other than: Leave from the scene!
Mikro it is true that you weren't directly affected by the situation, but you still were partly with the side of the victim as you were an officer, the way I see it, you should've digged more into what happent in there, but you didn't. But this is not what this topic is about, but it is rather another idea.

[Stivi]

Red text means serious business. There's no light-rulebreaking. If there's a /report in-between then someone's gameplay got ruined. The spam is nothing we can't "unsee" ( /settings IG ). How many times have you seen the reported person apologize to the reporter for the thing he did ? Seen it few times with the red text. Only once with the "verbally warned" but for that to happen, it took 1 Division Leader, i Manager, three admins and one or two moderators present on the scene. Wasn't A-team going to be stricter in rs5 ?

[Marcel]

We should concentrate on the higher level stuff here, not go into specific situations.

[Rusty]

Hamza you shouldn't have brought this up...

Jovanca, admins who are present to the situation shouldn't pickup the report about the situation(you understood the other way arround completly)

Rusty when I am present to a situation, it is more easy for me to get biased, and I've also seen 100% of the one side, possible not carring about the other side...
Also about what you said about the rules, take the time and read what I posted. People who do not want to read will have the short list, people who do, like me for examble, will read the huge list. Simple as that! Also about the ARPD Divisions, guidelines, rules, they are just different ways to calling a basic thing. No I will not ask from the SAPD Command to know when I am being abused. I have every right to know when I am being abused... THose DOs and DON'Ts have to become active, coz I need to atleast know the DON'Ts. Coz if I am alone with one of their members, and I don't know the DON'Ts then he will simply be abled to do anything to me... As I won't know when he's crossed the line ... DO prove me wrong here please!

Admins will pick-up any report that comes in.  End of.
People who do not want to read won't read the rules at all, it's that simple. Great you want to read massive list of rules go ahead but most people who enter a server with RPG and have a ounce of sense n their head would understand that the most basic of rules apply on the server and will learn the rest as they go.  They don't want to sit and read long list of rules that takes up their playing time. 

Who said ask SAPD Command?  *crickets*
If you don't want to go to the ARPD forum then don't not my concern.  You just won't know when you were in the wrong or the cop was in the wrong.
Go speak to SAPD guy's about that stuff don't want to hear about it in this section of the forum.

Don't come here posting about how a kidnapping went or whatever, get original and do something else for once jeez.  Venture off the track again and topic's closed indefinitely.

[Kostas]

I like how you go: blabla. End of. Feels like talking to a wall or something.
Also once again, I do not give a flying f..k about people who do not want to read the rules, I cannot prevent the server from rule breakers but I want to be abled to know when me or someone else is wrong, so that I can both try my best to always be "within" the rules but also know when I'm ask to do things that I don't have to.
You just asked me to go to the ARPD and read the rules... I do know these rules by heart, I used to be an SAPD Officer in RS4, and I highly doubt there are any big changes in them other than the ARPD Rules that were added a few months ago. I want to get access to every rule that I dont have access to, simple as that... And I also want a damn topic with atleast the server rules(f**k the police ones) atleast every single server rule, explain. The server has been arround for 8 years, and we still do not have a complete list of rules...

How will a list of rules help? A player will be abled to know the actual rules, and not have to follow what the administrator's mind finds are at each given time, coz there have been numerous times when a rule told by an administrator was later untold by another one.

(Don't come here posting about how a kidnapping went or whatever, get original and do something else for once jeez.  Venture off the track again and topic's closed indefinitely.)
I hope that this wasn't going to me....

[Tiny]

There is a list of clearly understandable rules. What makes them complex sometimes are the situations, that's where different administrators make different verdicts and act accordingly.

If you use common sense for once, you'll see how easy it is to be active and take part in several events staying within the rules, without even having the rules and limits in mind.

Administrators are not robots, they make mistakes, they sometimes overreact, etc; Who doesn't? Nobody.
Do not have in mind such an example to decide how you will act, have your own way of behaving while staying within the rules and even if you get in trouble somehow, you'll find the way to avoid it by explaining.

Also, I'm not talking as the person who's perfect and never breaks a rule, I'm talking as a person who a very big troublemaker in the past but learnt some things, which he always keeps in mind.

[Kostas]

Yeah Right...

If we all only have to use common sense, then how come even administrators themselves tend to sometimes find eachother's verdicts wrong? The answer is simple, common sense is not as common as you think, every human sees things in a different way depending on his past, a guy who has been through 20 surgeries in his life will find an external operation a complete joke, a guy who has never had one, will probably be thinking about it the whole week before...
If you think that you see things the same way everyone does, then I am afraid that I can't help with that. And you could just go on and delete the whole topic...

EDIT: And to get something clear, you asked from us to get our shit straight, well do the same. Why is there no topic with each rule out there with specific explanations?
a: Because newbies do not want to read big topic?
b: Because no one would read it.
c: Because it is not needed as common sense is all that it takes?
d: Because you simply want to be abled to come to a verdict each time you get ask to, rather than following a book
e: Because you simply do not want to make one?

Also about common sense... the rules corrently writen are part of common sense, anything after that is fully situational, either put everything or delete the corrent ones... Or do you think that we don't know that DM is not allowed in RPG servers? Or do you think that we would start cheating and abusing glitches thinking that it is allowed?

Many servers have a good list of rules, WHY DON'T WE?

[Tiny]

I never said that, I can guarantee I see things way too more strange than most people around me do. Common sense in this situation would be what is rulebreaking and what isn't. I think that's pretty common for everyone - without considering personal reasons that may lead to a different verdict. Once action can be rulebreaking and within the rules, players'/administrators' opinion at times doesn't change it.